Van Staal Reels ???

[Donald]

Does anyone have any experience with these reels ? they seem very nice, durable and light. But how are they in the surf? Are we getting our "bang for the buck"? The hefty price tag is something to think about. The Bailess reels seem like something new to get used to. It just makes me wonder should I buy 1 Van Staal or 4 penn's?

[Singletjeff]

Boy you'll get some answers on that questions.....I've never used one, however I have a buddy that swears by them. He even dropped his in the water up in Mass, waited until low to get it and after all those hours on the bottom, he cleaned it and it worked like new......I would get one, but I can't justify spending that much money on a spinning reel for the surf.....

[Sgt_Slough]

Editing

BRB

[Sgt_Slough]

Had to answer the phone . . . didn't make it back in time:mad: Here's what should have gone above:p
------

They are considered by some to be the ultimate surfcasting reel. Guys up north mostly and especially in spots like Montauk where they swim out a 100 yards to stand on a rock and cast a 3 oz wooden plug 60 feet.

So, it is primarily used for lure fishing in harsh wet locations like jetties and such. I think it is overkill (and more than a bit ostentatious :rolleyes: ) to have one sitting on an open-beach chunking set-up.

They are great reels; their gearboxes are completely sealed from water intrusion and they have smooth and strong drags that are also impervious to sand and water. The reel and spool is made of machined aluminum with an anodized finish so that also is impervious to the elements.

They feature a manual pick-up on most reels; there's no bail, a roller rides on the rotor so you must place the line under it to retrieve after the cast.

They must be returned to the manufacturer every year for service to keep the warranty in effect. This costs $50.00 plus shipping each way.

Van Staal was taken over by Zebco a few years ago, whether or not this has had an effect on the reel's quality is an issue being debated by both the reel's enthusiasts and detractors.

Many of those rock swimming wetsuit guys who used Van Staal's up in Montauk have begun using Daiwa Saltiga's instead and have been singing the praises of that reel.

[OtterPop]

Alough I am fairly new to surf fishing , I do know van staal is fully sealed , you could fish with the reel underwater all day im sure if you wanted to . They last a very long time alough recently supposidly they have been bought out by zebco but still manufactured by the same people? .

I think they have a manual bail also , because of them being sealed there is also a fair amount of resistance compared to other reels that are not self contained .

( someone can chime in , there is a 150 dollar reel of a similar design ( not looks , nor is it all cnc'd alum / ss ) but are supposidly decent if thats what you are looking for .



I do though have a van staal c vex g , which is a fly reel , its amazing but for the price is it worth it? I think this depends on how much money you make as ive found alot cheaper that work just as well but do not last as long , then again its alot easier to replace or get say a penn fixed rather than it is to get a van stall fixed due to its design .

[bluerunner]

they are making one with a bail now.....they have great drags, I saw a picture of a i think 70+lb wahoo whooped down in the gulf with the 300 size and braid

[derekxec]

i just bought one a month or so ago but i dont use it for the surf and for the money it is def. worth it! you can get them with or without the bail i have without and it takes a little bit to get used to...compare it to getting used to a non levelwind reel so its not that hard and they are like a dream :)

[Donald]

Thanks for the feedback. Well , I would hate to get one of these to just to use it as beach bling. I really do think that a $600 reel MUST be used. I own many old school spinfishers and think the world of Penn. But the VS that I looked at in person seemed so light compared to penn. I Do chunk & whole Mullet fish alot. I have recently found that I rather hold the pole and "fish" the baits rather then throw the pole in the sand spike all day and wait till something swims by. I guess I like the gear and hate the price, Such as life... LOL..

[Pendulauncher]

Does anyone have any experience with these reels ? they seem very nice, durable and light. But how are they in the surf? Are we getting our "bang for the buck"? The hefty price tag is something to think about. The Bailess reels seem like something new to get used to. It just makes me wonder should I buy 1 Van Staal or 4 penn's?

If I could afford to, this would be the only spinning reel I'd use. I own a 200 and a 150 (they REALLY need to develop a 175 size)....need 2 more.

Manual pick-up is the ONLY way to go....FASTER than using a bail. Stop/secure line with trigger finger....turn handle....roller grabs line.

PAY NO ATTENTION to those who tell you the spool design is wrong for distance casting. My longest cast with spinning set up....over 200 yards with VS200, 12lb Maxima Chameleon, 13ft custom surf rod, 2oz lead spoon.

If you buy one, you'll love it.

[Donald]

Well thats good to hear! I was a little worried of the spool not being skirted on the larger non-bail models. I think I would pick the vs200, I was looking into the 250 but after looking at the line capacity this may be to big for a 10.5 ft graphite med light stick. I am trying to get the best of all worlds. smaller, lighter rod & reel that can be used for bait and for some lure casting when needed. I don't mind loosing $100 on a wrong choice but when the stakes get into vs level I try to watch where I step.

[Pendulauncher]

Well thats good to hear! I was a little worried of the spool not being skirted on the larger non-bail models. I think I would pick the vs200, I was looking into the 250 but after looking at the line capacity this may be to big for a 10.5 ft graphite med light stick. I am trying to get the best of all worlds. smaller, lighter rod & reel that can be used for bait and for some lure casting when needed. I don't mind loosing $100 on a wrong choice but when the stakes get into vs level I try to watch where I step.

Something I should have emphasized is that my distance casting with a Van Staal is with the aid of CUSTOM rods.....pendulum cast. My rod builder matched guide selection (diameter of 1st guide....the choker guide), distance between 1st guide and reel face, and diameter of spool.....built around Fuji guide concept. I haven't measured casts with my off-the-shelf 11ft Lamiglas rod....somewhere around 400 feet...never tried pendulum cast. Also, if you watch any of the Ron Arra distance casting videos, you'll notice that his reels are either conventional Abu 7500s or Van Stall 300s...maybe a 250 here or there. I don't know if he's topping 200 yards with the VS, but he appears to be getting over 500 feet with his Ron Arra signature Lamiglas rods.....not too shabby in my opinion.

[Donald]

Although I have not got into distance casting as of yet, I have watched videos of guys doing it. Cool stuff! Everone I have seen had a Modified garcia or some sort of souped up baitcasting setup. I have not seen a spinning set up used, but I have not even scratched the surface in this sport. I also build rods. I will post the rod I am trying to finish now as soon as I can after I get it done, It would be neat to get real opinions from others that share the same interest rather then my friends that really dont know the differance between a custom rod and a broom stick.. LOL they jut dont want to hurt my feelings.

[Pendulauncher]

Although I have not got into distance casting as of yet, I have watched videos of guys doing it. Cool stuff! Everone I have seen had a Modified garcia or some sort of souped up baitcasting setup. I have not seen a spinning set up used, but I have not even scratched the surface in this sport. I also build rods. I will post the rod I am trying to finish now as soon as I can after I get it done, It would be neat to get real opinions from others that share the same interest rather then my friends that really dont know the differance between a custom rod and a broom stick.. LOL they jut dont want to hurt my feelings.

I'll have to be more careful with my wording. When I said distance casting, I didn't mean to imply that I've entered competions. I measure distance so I know which rigs give me the best chance of reaching those fish that are always just out of range.

If entering a competition, I'd probably go for a magged Abu 6500 in a QTC frame or Accuframe.....noooooo levelwind.

[Donald]

I'll have to be more careful with my wording. When I said distance casting, I didn't mean to imply that I've entered competions. I measure distance so I know which rigs give me the best chance of reaching those fish that are always just out of range.

If entering a competition, I'd probably go for a magged Abu 6500 in a QTC frame or Accuframe.....noooooo levelwind.

Ohh Ok, Well I have never cast on land and measured the distance. That does make sence to at least let you know where your limits are. I have to admit sometimes when casting I hold back a little in fear of loading the blank with too much pressure. I really like my rods and dont hesitate to use them but I would hate to fracture one due to a gut busting throw. do you thing as long as there was not a obtruction of line(around the tip) and the weight being tossed was reasonable that there would be a great chance of breakage due to over loading?

[Drumdum]

Disclaimer: I have never owned one of these reels,my opinion is based on what two fishing guides have told me..

I know two guys that are twins.. Both have successful guide and charter businesses.. They have seen in the past where the crack and penn had great,troublefree service out of thier bailess reels many yrs ago.. So one of them bought one.. He had only had it a couple of weeks,and he bought one for his brother to use as well on his charters out of OI.. Both brothers,after a limited time of using these reels came to the same conclusion,they both said "they are overpriced pieces of junk".. One guides in Fla catches permit and tarpon,that is what he guides for,said it didn't take long and the drag became jerky.. The other brother throws them at breaking yellowfins,and was going to use them for white marlin,but the yellowfins alone put the hurts to the thing.. He generally uses the big Penn spinners for that and says they are trouble free.. The one in Fla uses Shimano spinners,and gets great service outta them also.. The one from FLA said "In this case you don't get what you pay for"....

[Donald]

Disclaimer: I have never owned one of these reels,my opinion is based on what two fishing guides have told me..

I know two guys that are twins.. Both have successful guide and charter businesses.. They have seen in the past where the crack and penn had great,troublefree service out of thier bailess reels many yrs ago.. So one of them bought one.. He had only had it a couple of weeks,and he bought one for his brother to use as well on his charters out of OI.. Both brothers,after a limited time of using these reels came to the same conclusion,they both said "they are overpriced pieces of junk".. One guides in Fla catches permit and tarpon,that is what he guides for,said it didn't take long and the drag became jerky.. The other brother throws them at breaking yellowfins,and was going to use them for white marlin,but the yellowfins alone put the hurts to the thing.. He generally uses the big Penn spinners for that and says they are trouble free.. The one in Fla uses Shimano spinners,and gets great service outta them also.. The one from FLA said "In this case you don't get what you pay for"....
WOW !!! I would not expect to hear this! I was thinking that the main problems would have been getting used to the design or something more personal preferance but I would have never thought with the "bullet proof" materials that it would turn into a heap of scrap! I was looking to get a reel I could use and maintain for many many years, I guess this is not it. The other reel is a Zee Baas but now your talking $1300.00 gosh!! I am not made of cash and I heard they were Of VS decent!! Thanks !!

[SeaSalt]

daiwa saltigas...

[derekxec]

if you want to go conventional instead check out the Shimano Trinidads i have a few of them and they are absolute beasts

you def. get what you pay for with them

[gundalba]

Or if you wanna push even further and dunk $1,300, Zeebaas... :eek: :--| :D
http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/tackle_1922_6554884

[Pendulauncher]

Disclaimer: I have never owned one of these reels,my opinion is based on what two fishing guides have told me..

I know two guys that are twins.. Both have successful guide and charter businesses.. They have seen in the past where the crack and penn had great,troublefree service out of thier bailess reels many yrs ago.. So one of them bought one.. He had only had it a couple of weeks,and he bought one for his brother to use as well on his charters out of OI.. Both brothers,after a limited time of using these reels came to the same conclusion,they both said "they are overpriced pieces of junk".. One guides in Fla catches permit and tarpon,that is what he guides for,said it didn't take long and the drag became jerky.. The other brother throws them at breaking yellowfins,and was going to use them for white marlin,but the yellowfins alone put the hurts to the thing.. He generally uses the big Penn spinners for that and says they are trouble free.. The one in Fla uses Shimano spinners,and gets great service outta them also.. The one from FLA said "In this case you don't get what you pay for"....

I've owned a 200 and a 150 for nearly 10 years....trouble free....never sent them back to the factory for that yearly servicing.

[Donald]

The Zee Baas is Neat! But what in the world could it possibly offer with a tag of $1300.00 ?? There is not that much to it! I could see if it was a super heavy reel for off shure sharking or some kind of industry standard for comercial use but this is just a medium spooled spinning reel, Thats just about the reality of the thing. Oh yea it comes with a wooden box! Got to have that. I am all about spending the extra dollar on gear but this thing is just plain rude.

[Digger]

You have to remember that these two reels are very low production, which means that the devlopment cost have to be absorbed by the few reels that are produced. They are designed for the guy that swims with his reel for either a rip or a rock, to fish from there. The dudes fishing from the rip are hanging just out side casting while swiming or floating. This is not stand on the beach fishing. I would like somebody tell me what other reels are able to work under water(the Z series packed with grease does work with daily reworks). They have a very high cost because of this.

[Drumdum]

I've owned a 200 and a 150 for nearly 10 years....trouble free....never sent them back to the factory for that yearly servicing.

Read the disclaimer I wrote at the top,although,I trust these two enough that I'll never buy one... :)

[Pendulauncher]

Read the disclaimer I wrote at the top,although,I trust these two enough that I'll never buy one... :)

I knew this would happen.....didn't complete my thought:eek: .....figured I could edit later since we're all away on the weekend-----smart.

In my opinion, anyone with an opposing viewpoint should grab a soap box. Especially if you can save your fellow man (or woman:cool: ) some coin.

Anyway, the "Paul Harvey rest of the story" is that I'm curious as to when your friends bought their reels. Before of after VS was sold? What were the specific problems?

[Pendulauncher]

Read the disclaimer I wrote at the top,although,I trust these two enough that I'll never buy one... :)

I knew this would happen.....didn't complete my thought:eek: .....figured I could edit later since we're all away on the weekend-----smart.

In my opinion, anyone with an opposing viewpoint should grab a soap box. Especially if you can save your fellow man (or woman:cool: ) some coin.

Anyway, the "Paul Harvey rest of the story" is that I'm curious as to when your friends bought their reels. Before of after VS was sold? What were the specific problems?

[Donald]

I knew this would happen.....didn't complete my thought:eek: .....figured I could edit later since we're all away on the weekend-----smart.

In my opinion, anyone with an opposing viewpoint should grab a soap box. Especially if you can save your fellow man (or woman:cool: ) some coin.

Anyway, the "Paul Harvey rest of the story" is that I'm curious as to when your friends bought their reels. Before of after VS was sold? What were the specific problems?
I am hopeing the reels being made now are ironed out and thet Zebco did not "change" anything for the worst..:(

[Drumdum]

I knew this would happen.....didn't complete my thought:eek: .....figured I could edit later since we're all away on the weekend-----smart.

In my opinion, anyone with an opposing viewpoint should grab a soap box. Especially if you can save your fellow man (or woman:cool: ) some coin.

Anyway, the "Paul Harvey rest of the story" is that I'm curious as to when your friends bought their reels. Before of after VS was sold? What were the specific problems?

Nothing to take personally,and nothing meant to be personal in the comment,just two friend's opinions that I trust.. They were mostly commenting on the drags.. He uses his for permit,bones and tarpon, and said it didn't even last one half a season,and the drag was jerking like it was a k mart reel.. His brother throws them when plugging for tuna, had the same problem within weeks..
The comments were all about the drags in these reels.. Both take excellent care of thier equipment.. Both own 9 and 10 thousand abu's,old garcia spinners,and all kinds of equipement from seventys and eightys that looks like it just came out of the box...
Both use shimano and penn spinning reels,and have no problems..
The reels are so expensive and I've heard and read many good things about them,thier comments just shocked me that's all...

[Donald]

:eek: Now I'm really confused: :eek:

[sand.trout]

If you have the cash get what you want. Nothing is bullet proof.
I've had penn reels that have lasted 20 yrs and others one night.
IMHO I think you should get the right reel for the right application.
Could be a big difference in price.

[KT_UMCP]

The VS reel is probably one of the most durable reels out there and yes there are some people that swears by them. These reels are especially made for the hardcore fisherman. They will take some wear and tear and keep on running.

[Donald]

If you have the cash get what you want. Nothing is bullet proof.
I've had penn reels that have lasted 20 yrs and others one night.
IMHO I think you should get the right reel for the right application.
Could be a big difference in price.
Well my thought is this, I value my time on the surf so I want to get as much out of my time there as I can. We all know nothing is bullet proof 100% but I know for a fact that if I drop one of my Penn spinners hard in the sand I now have a issue that will take time to correct. The simplicity and the way the vs is sealed seems to eliminate some of the chance of "Down time". I dont want to rebuild a reel on a trip, I want to fish. Some of the feeling I am getting in this forum is that This reel may be a little like showing off if you use this thing for 8 & bait. Well, I dont want bling bling I want to have something that works and works well with the horrible elements that this sport entails. But if this reel does not offer relentless dependability, quality and longevity I dont want the thing even for free! Thats why I am asking for the bottom line on these things from people that use them that know what and how they are.

[Pendulauncher]

Ohh Ok, Well I have never cast on land and measured the distance. That does make sence to at least let you know where your limits are. I have to admit sometimes when casting I hold back a little in fear of loading the blank with too much pressure. I really like my rods and dont hesitate to use them but I would hate to fracture one due to a gut busting throw. do you thing as long as there was not a obtruction of line(around the tip) and the weight being tossed was reasonable that there would be a great chance of breakage due to over loading?

Sorry I never addressed this question.....got pretty busy and forgot:eek: .

Chance of breakage? With my custom rods, I live in fear of this. I'd HATE to break a Snoopy rod, let alone a high dollar launcher!!!:eek: :mad: I've tried to stick to companies that offer lifetime blank warranty. As for heavy hitter casting, what I've found is that as long as I stay within the lure weight specs, the harder I hit 'em the greater my distance. Try backing off the max weight by a couple of ounces....hit it hard....work up to max.

Hatteras Jack (Outer Banks....Rodanthe, NC) is building the 1st of 2 rods for me...both on Century Tip Tornado blanks. The TT Ultra-Lite 13ft for plugs....the TT Sport cut back to 12'6" for 8 'n b8. Caaaaan't wwwWAIT to put them to the test.

Bill

[Digger]

My question to you is this. Do you dunk your reel allot or swim with it? If the answer is no then there is probably other options that would money spent better. Do you need a sealed gear box? if yes the the Van Stall or the Zee Bass may be the answer. If not you have many other option. JAM regularly splashes his 525MAG(heck probably submerges it from time to time(ask him)) and he likes it. Now does he swim with it or fish it underwater I guess not(I'm not putting words in his mouth) that is what these reels are made for. Now if you want a well machined reel that needs only annual maintence these may be your options. I always try and buy the right tool for the job. You need to decide what the job is. If a spinner for distance is what you want the the Basia may be your choice.

[RuddeDogg]

The other day. They really look great and feel good. Just way too pricy for me.

[Donald]

Well I had found a outfitter that has the vs reels on sale, I can get a VS200 for $553.00 deliverd to my door, So I orderd one. That seems to be the cheapest I can find anywhere. If It does not work I will list it 4-sale in the fourum and recoupe some of my $ then go back to the drawing board. I can give anyone who wants the name of the outfiter if you pm me.(I don't want to break the rules of the site). ;)

[Donald]

Well I had found a outfitter that has the vs reels on sale, I can get a VS200 for $553.00 deliverd to my door, So I orderd one. That seems to be the cheapest I can find anywhere. If It does not work I will list it 4-sale in the fourum and recoupe some of my $ then go back to the drawing board. I can give anyone who wants the name of the outfiter if you pm me.(I don't want to break the rules of the site). ;)

This price has gone up since this post...

[dirtyhandslopez]

Kinda off topic, but making a spinner a manual pick up is easy, we used to do it all the time and it saves a lot of break offs-just get a hacksaw and cut the bail arm off, then file it smoth were cut. Easy.Or you can get fancy and remove it with real tools such as screwdrivers etc.

[derekxec]

the high dollar reels are worth every penny!

i have a van staal and i like it although i havent had it for too long

i have a shimano trinidad TN30 that ive had for like 6 years and it looks brand new one the inside and feels like its brand new....hasnt been cleaned or rinsed off one time and has been in sand, dunked, etc etc and not oiled/greased or cleaned one time

these pics are the first time the reel has ever been opened

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/4101/tn30rw3.jpg
as you can see the beating its gotten

http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/2794/reelox8.jpg
no corrosion at all and still looks pretty clean

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/3328/sideplatewm6.jpg
tell me that doesnt look brand new

this reel has been used at least 5 days a week for 6 years

[Donald]

Hey guys Im not trying to stir up a pot of controversy I was just trying to pass on a good deal to others that may have been looking for a VS....:(

[BaitWaster]

It's like getting a brand new carbon fiber crowned titanium face driver vs. an old persimmon wood.

New vs. Old technology
High cost vs. low cost

More birdies vs. less birdies . . . I think not.

The point is that it will not land more fish. I would take a seasoned fishing veteran who knows the water, knows the bait, knows the technique with some POS rusty reel / rod combo than random guy/gal who has nice a nice van staal reel and knows nothing.

BUT . . . if you can afford to have it, then get it. Its the same arguement as: Why do people drive BMWs vs. Geo? 4 wheels, gets you where you wanna go, etc.

But Van Staal is basically old technology dressed up and tried to be made bullet proof. Patterned after the old (~40 years old?) Crack/Luxor reels.

Surf guys up north seem to like them because they are basically waterproof. $40 to send them back to get them serviced. "This warranty [1-yr, non-transferable-my add] will be considered VOID if the product has been opened or tampered with or if the water tight seals have been broken."

As far as how they stand up to actually catching fish vs casting, I'll defer to the brothers. 3 Penns vs 1 Van Staal? Hmmmm :D

[Drumdum]

But Van Staal is basically old technology dressed up and tried to be made bullet proof. Patterned after the old (~40 years old?) Crack/Luxor reels.

Surf guys up north seem to like them because they are basically waterproof. $40 to send them back to get them serviced. "This warranty [1-yr, non-transferable-my add] will be considered VOID if the product has been opened or tampered with or if the water tight seals have been broken."

As far as how they stand up to actually catching fish vs casting, I'll defer to the brothers. 3 Penns vs 1 Van Staal? Hmmmm :D

Twins,I presume??? ;) :D

[Donald]

Well, here is my personal up to date experiance with the VS company, On 11-21-06 I finnally got my vs 200. I immeadiatly spooled it up and headed to the surf. It casted great! Felt great! the next week I took it out and caught a nice sized rock but to my surprize the drag got tighter as the fish ran. Well....??? OK .... I was warned by some fourm members of some potential problems. SO...I figured Just maybe this reel had to "break" in. I took it out again ang managed to catch yet a even bigger rock that was hooked by the tinyest piece of lip skin, Well I had to strip line off the spool by hand when he ran if I wanted to have any chance to getting this fish in, After the fish was landed I flicked the hook out with my finger. At this pont I was forced to come to the realization that this reel had to be shipped back for service. I gave the service dept. a call then shipped it back. I got the reel back today, it only was gone for 8 days. The vs guys replaced some of the drag components and it seems to be acting much better. I think things will be ok with it now. By the way they did not charge me for the repair. SO thats my story so far, we have a big season ahead of us so Im wishing for the best.