Rod, reel advice

[racewire20]

I purchased my first conventional set up about a year ago. After reading alot of the post here I think I may have gone the wrong direction. I'd like to be able to get more distance with less hassle of blow ups. What I have is an abu Ambassadeur 10000i bg on a 10' ugly stick heavy action rod. I was looking for something with line capacity and big enough for larger fish. With my limited experience using conventional reels I can only get about 75 yds or so without risking wading this thing up. Also I don't know if it is common with this reel but the drag seems like it's either on or off nothing in between, and you really have to crank down on it to get any drag at all. I even took the first one back for this reason, but the replacement doesn't seem any better. Can this thing be modified or do I need to go another direction.

Any Advise here would be greatly appreciated :confused:

[Cerberus]

How much weight are you trying to throw?

I think you would need at least 4-6 ounces maybe 8, plus bait, to load that rod enough to get good distance without losing control of the reel.

I have a 7000CL Big Game that is a great caster, I just need to watch the spool tension and use enough wieght to load the rod.

[RuddeDogg]

I started out with the penn 525. have gotten pretty good with it and went out and bought 3 more.

[racewire20]

Using 4-6 nbait, Always figured more weight would relate to faster spool speed, but from the post here it sounds like the more weight relates to more spool control. Am I correct here. Never tried throwing 8, I know with most of my other set ups (spinning) I seem to get more distance with lighter weight.

[racewire20]

I started out with the penn 525. have gotten pretty good with it and went out and bought 3 more.

Had I done more research before hand, I would own a 525 mag right now, But we have to learn from our mistakes! As soon as I can, I'll be purchasing a 525 and investing in a good rod.

[darrel]

According to the guy who designed the Penn mag 525 Neil Mackellow four ounces is about the least weight to put on that reel. I believe the reel spinning to fast was the rationale. So for three ounces or less perhaps a spinning outfit could be hassle free.

[drumjunkie]

In your initial post, you mentioned that you went with the 10000 size due to concerns over line capacity. The 525 is a great reel, good drag and good castability. It's one drawback is capacity. A great reel with higher capacity is the Daiwa Saltist 30h. Consider what conditions you will most often face and what fish you are targeting. 250-300yds. of 14-20lb line seems to be adequate for most species targeted from the surf. There are exceptions though.

[Digger]

Had I done more research before hand, I would own a 525 mag right now, But we have to learn from our mistakes! As soon as I can, I'll be purchasing a 525 and investing in a good rod.


That is probably the best in the long run. But if you take a good long hard look at you casting techinque. The blows can be greatly reduced and the distance improved. You want a long slow arc, with the push at the end. Especially with a slow action rod like you have.

[drawinout]

I'm fairly new to the conventional casting game as well racewire. Let me start by saying I have no experience with the abu reels, or that particular rod. I'm using an 11'6" tica, matched up with a daiwa x30sha high speed reel. It was trial and error for me. My suggestion would be to start with a simple "over head" cast. Hang your weight 1-2 feet off of your rod tip. Don't rest it on the surf or pier, let it hang in the air. Put your arms over your head, left elbow will be around forehead level, right elbow at around chin level, weight hanging rather than resting on the sand or pier. In one steady motion, take your cast. I started learning with 8 ounces, but now I can throw 5nbait almost as far with the same cast. It's fairly easy sailing from there. I use different casts now, and can throw the hell out of it!!! I used to think it was the brake blocks in my reel, but once you get the hang of it, you'll find it's all technique. Now I'm throwing without brakes and don't have any problems. Make sure your line is fed onto your reel properly, and make sure your shock leader is tied with a solid line to line knot! One time I was using mine as an anchor rod and the damn shock leader broke off at the knot, reel came back and hit me in the face leaving me a half inch gash and a black eye!! lol Not a big deal, but you want to avoid that, obviously. Make sure your shock leader is tied well!!!

[Cerberus]

Using 4-6 nbait, Always figured more weight would relate to faster spool speed, but from the post here it sounds like the more weight relates to more spool control. Am I correct here. Never tried throwing 8, I know with most of my other set ups (spinning) I seem to get more distance with lighter weight.

The reason you get backlashes with a conventional reel is from the spool spinning faster then the outgoing line.

At the beginning of the cast the line, pulled by the weight, starts the spool spinning at roughly the same speed as the line is going out. Air drag slows the weight and line, the line is no longer "pulling" on the spool and the spool is being spun by it's own inertia, faster than the outgoing line. The spool then overruns and you get a backlash.

A heavier and/or more aerodynamic payload will maintain outgoing line speed longer and allow the spool to "catch up", and no backlash. You should also set your spool tension correctly.

Using the weight you will throw, with the rod held horizontal and about a foot of line out, put the reel into free spool and let the weight drop. You want the spool tension set so that the spool will not overrun when the weight hits the ground. This will be a god starting point for adjusting the reel and working on your casting techniques.

BTW I have a 525 mag and regularly cast with as little as 1oz, and sometimes even 1/2 oz and it works fine, but distance is reduced.

The 4oz minimum on the 525's is to maximize casting distance.

[racewire20]

Let me start out by saying, thanks for all the good tips. Drum is the target fish, but the occasional shark,or large ray will run off with it, hence the need for line capacity. I've been studying the distance technique and will apply more weight and try again. As for the tension I have set it as Cerberus mentioned. Shock leaders are new to me (not really understanding there purpose), but have recently added to all my heavier set ups. I've never have problems with break offs on launch until recently, and with 30# braid, but this was mostly due to wear at the end eye during transport up and down the beach,but now I check it more, especially on my first cast.

So what your saying is what I have is OK, work on technique?

I think I will still invest in more applicable equipment in the near future.

Again, Thanks for everyone's advice.

[Cerberus]

So what your saying is what I have is OK, work on technique?



Yes

[Digger]

Technique is most important. You can't buy distance. But I do feel you can do much better on the equipment which will make the fishing more enjoyable. Oh a Diawa 30 class reel is about as big as you need for what you are doing. A shark that dump's that reel will most likely dump the 10,000 too. Remember you can walk the beach a long way (many people over buy size on reels, I know I did) Also the Ugly stick, well there are better for the money. But what you have will do well enough and technique is most important. Learn the "Off the Ground" 1st.

[drawinout]

Let me start out by saying, thanks for all the good tips. Drum is the target fish, but the occasional shark,or large ray will run off with it, hence the need for line capacity. I've been studying the distance technique and will apply more weight and try again. As for the tension I have set it as Cerberus mentioned. Shock leaders are new to me (not really understanding there purpose), but have recently added to all my heavier set ups. I've never have problems with break offs on launch until recently, and with 30# braid, but this was mostly due to wear at the end eye during transport up and down the beach,but now I check it more, especially on my first cast.

So what your saying is what I have is OK, work on technique?

I think I will still invest in more applicable equipment in the near future.

Again, Thanks for everyone's advice.


The shock leader is to support the load when casting. This is EXTREMELY important on piers! I had 8 ounces go flying on the pier one time when I decided to be a dumb!@# and not us a shock leader!!! Thank god it wasn't crowded, and nobody got hit. Needless to say, I always use a shock leader now.

[racewire20]

Failed to mention this is a levelwind reel. You may already know this, but my question is should I remove the levelwind, or leave it alone?

[Digger]

The levelwind does affect your distance. But not enough to worry about, yet.

Actually it is acting as a brake right now, slowing the spool. So until the blow-ups stop I would not worry about it.

[racewire20]

Went out past two afternoons, yesterday, started out brakes full on with 8oz, started off the ground 65-70 yds no flare ups. Started trying the pendulum and started getting 80-90yrds consistently ,loosened the brakes a little, started getting small fluffs, no problem until the weight broke off. No more large weights so I started throwing a 5-5.5oz lacrosse ball, and the flare ups got a little worse
until she snapped off mid flight. Added 3oz egg with the ball and got back to 90yds consistently, got brave, backing off the brakes little at a time until she blew.

One thing, with the pendulum, one problem I seem to have is I tend to bump the ground with th weight when loading the rod on the way around. I've got the weight hanging about reel height or a little higher. Is this correct?

What should I expect (distance wise) from this set up, so I know what to work towards.

All in all from everyones help, I feel more comfortable slinging this thing.

[kingfisherman23]

I would work an OTG to get used to the rod before winding up a pendulum. The pendulum is a technical cast that works best on a specific type of rod. The OTG and its variants (Hatteras, Unitech, etc) are more common and more useful from the beach.

Evan

[Sandcrab]

Failed to mention this is a levelwind reel. You may already know this, but my question is should I remove the levelwind, or leave it alone?


I used a ABU 10000CL (levelwind - capability 400 yds of 30 lb test mono) and a 12' Ugly Stick for years in the surf. Do not use any more than 20 lb test, tie on a good shocker, and practice. The Uglies have a tendency to be over rated as far a recommended weights are concerned. My Ugly handed 4 and 5 oz OK...

Like they said - techique...

Sandcrab

[Hannibal]

I started out with the penn 525. have gotten pretty good with it and went out and bought 3 more.


Same for me. Started with the 525 mag then added a couple more. Then expanded my arsenal with a few Daiwa Slosh 20/30's.