# 525 help



## Fenner (Feb 25, 2004)

just got a 525 with ho conversion.made 3 casts on # 8(slow) setting.only got about 80 yards, then moved to # 6. Nested and cracked off next two casts.   Question is, do you always keep your thumb on the spool or do you let her free spool until the weight hits the ground. Im just a novice  , please help, thanks Fenner i know this sounds like a dumb question but i read on neils site some one was casting 5 ozs with the same rig and let the reel free spool from the beginning of the cast until it hit the ground


----------



## aero993 (Jan 19, 2001)

I never put my thumb on the spool until the lead hits the ground or the water.


----------



## Fenner (Feb 25, 2004)

thanks aero993  I must need thicker oil or more brakes,but most of all some casting lessons


----------



## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

its not the reel fenner, curious if ur any of the fenners i know in nova. dont mess with oils or the bearings or anything. take a coupla trips to go cast, and im sure you'll hit good distance.


neil


----------



## Fenner (Feb 25, 2004)

*Ntkg*

thanks for the info,must keep throwing.  first names Fenner,down here in N C,near the Pamlico sound  thanks again


----------



## Orest (Jul 28, 2003)

*This link might help you*

http://neilmackellow.sea-angler.org/reel_tuning.html


----------



## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

*525 upgrade*

Fenner, I highly recommend the 525 magnetic upgrade from hattera outfitters. Easy to install and worth every cent.

BTW- I had same problem, was scared to dial mag off max setting, with plenty of practice I will now dial it down to 3 or 4, depending on conditions


----------



## Capt. Kim CG Ret (Sep 27, 2004)

*recommend the 525 magnetic upgrade from hattera outfitters*

I am far from being proficient with a conventional reel, but from reading the first post, it appears he purchased the HO Magged 525. I don't have that reel, but I have a 525 mag and a 30SHV. The one thing I learned the hard way, casting with a conventional is almost all form and technique. You can't just wing it like a spinner. And it is almost like you are casting in slow motion. Go fast and you will break off at lot of times. If you watch any of the videos of distance casters, it is almost like you want to speed up the movie, they seem to be going sooooo sloooow. But watch as that rod gets progressively more bend as they are coming around.

I'd like to sugest that before you develop habits that are hard to correct, take the rod and visit the Outer Banks or the beaches at Virginia Beach and watch the guys who are really slinging the baits. I don't know of anyone who would not be willing to take the time to help you. I am sure there are a lot of casters on this board who would be willing to give you pointers, in person. If you are on the Outer Banks and want to get lessons from a professional rod builder/distance caster, call Ryan White, the owner at Hatteras Jacks. $50 gets you 1-1/2 hours of personal instruction. Will probably be the best $50 you ever spent.

After that, its practice, practice, practice.

Good luck.


----------



## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

*Capt. KIm*

Yep, I missed that he already had the HO upgrade. I agree with what you said about casting technique with conventionals. Need to start slow and build power at end of cast. No snap casting! Took me a long time to get the hang of it, lots of bad habits from heaving with spinning gear.


----------



## Fenner (Feb 25, 2004)

*Orest, Surf Cat, Capt. Kim*

 Thanks for the info.  I have a 10,000 Abu that I was throwing before the 525 and I had to thumb it or it would explode


----------



## aero993 (Jan 19, 2001)

Fenner,

I have friends that have the 525's with the HO mag conversion and friends that don't. On my last trip to Hatteras, I took two brand new 525's. My friend clean the bearings and we added thicker oil. I never had any problems.


----------



## surf rat (Jun 30, 2004)

*Thick oil, Thin oil*

It's all relative to temperature. Even thin oil is thick oil when it's 35 outside. The first couple casts are allways goeing to be tight. As you heat up the bearings the reel will loosen up. Leave your tension or and magnets set for when things loosen up. If you back everything off you will blow up for sure after a few casts.I have seen it happen too many times to count. Someone walks up, makes a short cast and starts turning knobs. Makes another cast and POW. Back to the truck they go.Even with a mag upgrade the 525 is hard to control.I don't know many people that can control them below 6 even with the upgrade.Of all the reels that I've fished the 525's have eaten the most line hands down.It is a good reel though.


----------



## Fenner (Feb 25, 2004)

*thanks Surf Rat*

watched the breakaway video again,  went out and made about 15 casts. started off slower and tried to bring the power in at the last. didnt blow up once.   left the mag on full  but still my best throw was only 90 yards.just like anything else,practice,practice and more practice  thanks again


----------



## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

definately... your on the right track bud!


neil


----------



## Tres Irby (Dec 15, 2002)

*Maybe this will help clear up a few things....*

My newer 525 mag conversion (at least 3yrs old now) that has the 4 smaller magnets drilled and friction fitted in behind the original magnets is really meant to be used in conjunction with either XS Rocket Fuel (smooth casters, cooler weather) or Liquid Grease RF (less advanced or hot weather). 

After much testing, and I use these things all the time and it's still my favorite all-around reel, I found this setup to be superior to using larger magnets with faster oils. Whether they are slapped on the back of the carrier, as some recommend, or as replacements for the originals as in my 1st conversions. 

I am convinced, especially in "fishing" reels where you're not normally coming off the magnets during the cast, that there is a fine line between having to use too much magnet to make up for using too fast an oil and using to slow an oil with little to no magnets. Since the 525s have no brake blocks and it’s tension knob shouldn’t really be used as a cast control (it will ruin the bearings if too much pressure is applied), I've purposely left them out of this discussion.

My theory is that too much magnet really has an ill effect on the spool, and thus the cast, and is especially noticeable after the initial burst and while the lead is still ascending. In testing, we've even found the mag setup can actually cause vibration, even if the spool is properly balanced. Experienced conventional casters can feel and sometimes even hear the spool being dragged down by too much magnet. What you don't really notice as much is how having too much magnet kills the cast right at the very start, where it's most important. The lead will never be traveling with more force than it is right after it's released. If you kill it then, it only goes down hill from there. If you use the wrong kind of oil and have to use too much magnet to control that initial burst, it not only kills the cast from the start but it continues to kill it more and more as the lead goes out, more so than it would using less mag with the correct oil. Obviously, if too heavy an oil/grease is used, to the point you couldn't blow it up even set to zero with the wind in your face, that's not good either. 

Off the subject for a minute but that brings up another popular subject of late, using static non adjustable magnets in reels such as the Avets, etc. If you think about it, in order to set the reel up properly using magnets you can't adjust and assuming there are no other cast controls, you must set the reel up permanently to cast under the worst conditions you are likely to encounter. By doing this, how much distance do you lose when you have good conditions and can’t adjust spool control accordingly? It is a cheap fix, but far from ideal.

Back to the subject.......

By using the above-mentioned oils in the spool bearings, along with the setup I have in the mag carrier, I think I've found a happy medium between the two and I can fill the spool up as full as I please. “Ideally”, I want to be able to throw 6-8 oz with the cast control set on “4" under good no wind conditions. That leaves me with equal amounts of adjustment either way as conditions improve or degrade. At most I want 2-3 threads of line to lift up on release and then lay right back down, at night I don’t want any threads coming up at all. I never want to have to touch the spool or the line until the lead hits the water. If you have to touch the spool or the line while the leads in flight, (1) you’ve hurt or even killed the cast and (2) you are too close to the edge and much more likely to blowup, especially at night. If you have the conversion, have pretty good technique and are still having to throw on “6" or more most of the time, you might want to give the LG a try, at least in the summer. The more you put in the bearings, the slower they get and I’d rather have a little LG than a lot of XS. I normally use no more than half a drop per bearing but some might require a little more.


Many of you have heard me say, and I’m sure some of you more times than you care to, I’d much rather be relaxed and confident in my reel and maybe lose a few feet and still have a bait in the water than be sitting there watching fish flop on the beach while I’m re-spooling and re-rigging, or picking backlashes with no bait in the water.

How much does casting technique effect spool control? A bunch. As some of the guys have already mentioned, a smooooth cast and release is essential with conventional reels, especially the bigger they get. You might have the best casting rod and reel in the world but if you don’t have them set up properly and more importantly, don’t get your cast down, no amount of money in the world can buy you the distance others are getting.

A little more on how I set up the 525s.....

Unless otherwise requested, on new reels with the conversion, I add a small drop of XS to the spool bearings in late Fall, Winter and early Spring and LG in the summer. Where it’s being shipped also plays a role.

For beginners or the less advanced, if I know ahead of time I will always add a good drop of LG to each bearing. I had much rather you not worry about distance at all until you feel confident in the reel and your cast. Don’t worry about it if you have to leave it set on 8 to keep it under control at first. Let the reel and your distances tell you when you’ve improved enough to reduce the magnets and/or go to a thinner oil. If your cast is progressing, so will your distances, even with the control still set on the same mark.

Hope this clears up a few questions some of you had and thanks to all of you that have purchased them and for the kind words, I’m glad they’ve helped. Any of you that might be having problems controlling any of my reels, please feel free to call me so I can help you get it set up right for your needs, I’m not happy if you’re not!

BTW Fenner, I did a 525 a few weeks ago that was PRIMO! - almost kept it for myself it was so smooth and balanced - you just mighta got it.....???


----------



## Fenner (Feb 25, 2004)

*Tres*

I probably did get it  I just dont know what Im doing yet  I love the reel and am determined to figure it out  Ive been throwing a spinning reel for 45 Years and a few small baitcasters and have very little trouble with them.But this is a whole new ballgame.I have trouble seeing a picture of somebody casting (like on the front of the breakaway video) with the rod 90 degrees to thier side bent back like a bow and arrow and Im trying to understand how you start off SLOW and acomplish that.But with enough practice ill figure it out. Thank you for the advice and thanks to everyone who replied to this post. MAYBE one day ill be able to cast like a Pro.    Thanks again to all Fenner


----------



## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

Fenner, 

come out to the field saturday, they'll be some guys who im sure are more than willing to help out.


tres thanks for all the info. i know when i first got a 525 it was a bit of a dissappointment when i first fished with it. i got your mag conversion and a coupla other things, and the 525 on the breakaway is definately the go to rig for me now. many others after castin that setup found a reason to put their 525's back on their rods.

thanks again

neil


----------



## Fenner (Feb 25, 2004)

*Ntkg*

Thanks so much for the invite  Im guessing you guys are somewhere around Richmond.Cant make it this weekend but thanks again for all the help  You guys have really been GREAT  Fenner


----------



## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

yea its gonna be at vabeach, yeah this website has a lot of good info when people wanna be nice and share


----------



## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

*That's some good info, Tres*



> it’s tension knob shouldn’t really be used as a cast control (it will ruin the bearings if too much pressure is applied


 I just cleaned my 525mag. The reel was running very rough before I took it apart. After cleaning it and putting Red Rocket Fuel on all the bearings, I put it back together. It was an improvement, but it was still running very rough. After spending way too much time playing with the reel, I finally found the problem. The bearing that attaches to the main gear (bearing 20A in the schematic) was destroyed. I thought maybe it got sand in it? That's what it sounded like, anyway. I've got a replacement on the way.
Do you think too much torque on the tension knob could have killed this bearing?


----------



## Tres Irby (Dec 15, 2002)

Hi Jeff, no the tension knob has nothing at all to do with the drive shaft bearing. I've never even heard of one of them going bad. If saltwater and/or sand were to be left in it, that would do it for sure.

The two spool bearings are the ones I was speaking of.


----------

