# Back Bay NWR Public Notice!



## Dr. Bubba (Nov 9, 1999)

This will probably be in the newspaper this weekend as well. I know a lot of you are interested in this opportunity of expanded access at BBNWR. The comment period is short, and there will not be any changes to the time period set forth for this nighttime access. So, a simple letter or email supporting the enhancement will do the trick. PM me if you would like text of an already prepared comment letter.

July 30, 2007



PUBLIC NOTICE

Implement Refuge Fresh and Saltwater Fishing and Crabbing Program, to Include Night Oceanfront Surfcasting.

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (Service) is evaluating a proposal to allow fresh and saltwater fishing and crabbing in designated areas of the Refuge. The proposal expands the current fishing program to permit night surfcasting along a designated section of the Refuge’s oceanfront, between the Seaside Trail and Dune Trail boardwalks. As proposed, night surf fishing activity would be allowed by special use permit, until 12:00 a.m. daily during the month of October, excluding seven days designated for the Refuge’s annual feral hog/deer hunt. Individuals permitted to fish through the evening would not be permitted vehicle access to the beach, and the fishing activity would be governed by all state and federal licensing and regulatory requirements, as well as Refuge permit stipulations.

Prior to allowing this use on the Refuge, federal law requires that the Service first determine that fresh and saltwater fishing and crabbing is a compatible use. A compatible use is a proposed or existing wildlife-dependent recreational use or any other use of a national wildlife refuge that, based on sound professional judgment, will not materially interfere with or detract from the fulfillment of the National Wildlife Refuge System or the purposes of the national wildlife refuge. We develop a compatibility determination document to facilitate evaluation of such uses. 

(OVER)



The National Wildlife Refuge System mission is to administer a national network of lands and waters for the conservation, management, and where appropriate, restoration of the fish, wildlife, and plant resources and their habitats within the United States for the benefit of present and future generations of Americans. The purpose for establishing Back Bay National Wildlife Refuge was to serve as winter resting and feeding grounds for migratory birds. 

The Service would like to know what you think about this proposed Refuge use. We are especially interested in information or studies you are aware of regarding the effects of such uses. A compatibility determination has been drafted, and is available for public review and comment. All comments received within 14 days following the date of this notice will be considered in finalizing that determination. We hope to make a final decision on this proposed use within 10 days following the closure of the public comment period.

To request a copy of the compatibility determination, to learn the final decision regarding this proposed use, or for more information, contact Chris Lowie, Back Bay National Wildlife Refuge Deputy Manager, by mail at: 4005 Sandpiper Road, Virginia Beach, VA, 23456; by telephone at 757-721-2412; or by email at [email protected]


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

Thanks Dave- you beat me to it.

Regarding the short comment period:

- what time do we have to be in the Park to have access to the nite time priveledge? I believe there was some debate about a specific time, nite time permit holders were allowed.

- Will the cost stay @ $35.00 per permit for the month of October?

-Will the permit be available for only those that have a valid VA fishing license...err... >16 y/o or <72 y/o


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## Dr. Bubba (Nov 9, 1999)

Al, here are the answers to your questions. But, just so you and everyone else knows, they have nothing to do with the comment period. The comment period is a requirement before the USFWS decides on this enhanced access at this particular NWR. 

_- what time do we have to be in the Park to have access to the nite time priveledge? I believe there was some debate about a specific time, nite time permit holders were allowed._
Time to be determined

_- Will the cost stay @ $35.00 per permit for the month of October?_ 
Yes

_-Will the permit be available for only those that have a valid VA fishing license...err... >16 y/o or <72 y/o_
No one under 16 will be able to purchase a permit. Permit holders 16 and 17 years of age will need to have a parent present. And, I assume the parent would need to be a permit holder as well. Persons 65 or older are not required to hold a VA saltwater license, but would be able to purchase a special use permit.

These small particulars are not going to change no matter what you write. If this opportunity becomes a reality, there are likely to be other stipulations. How strict or how lenient they become in years to come will probably be a result of permit holder behavior.

This is a pretty interesting development in my opinion. The USFWS is actually offering SOMETHING to the fishing community. We can nit pick the rules or we can embrace the opportunity. My hope is the true drum fishermen and those interested in enhanced beach access will embrace the opportunity!


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

Thanks Dave.

We gonna see you this weekend?


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## Dr. Bubba (Nov 9, 1999)

Nserch4Drum said:


> We gonna see you this weekend?


Probably tomorrow morning!


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## dirtyhandslopez (Nov 17, 2006)

Thanks a heap. From what I understand also, is camping and fishing is allowed 24/7 further south, with the neccessary permits and a damn strong pair of legs to get there. Surely, a weekend trip could be had down there. S2S an I have been talkin'...


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## tom_s (Oct 20, 2006)

does anyone know if they are limiting the number of permits?and will they also limit the number of permit holders allowed on the beach at one time?


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## Dr. Bubba (Nov 9, 1999)

good question, Tom. Nothing I have heard of to this point has been discussed about a limit on permit holders or holders allowed at any given time.

Newsjeff, you know anything about this?


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

I dunno about any limits on either permits or the number of people allowed at one time.

As far as I can gather, they are lookin' to sell as many permits as possible. 

To be honest, I'm not 100 percent sure.


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

Heard from someone that tried to pickup their permit today, that BBNP did not file the regulatons on time w/ NPS and there will be "No night time fishing" @ the Refuge this year.

They are optimistic that the paper work and the rule revisions will be completed for next year's drum run.

OH well...do what I did last year and the years before that...try ta catchem up during the day.

don't shoot the messenger.


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## Cdog (Mar 18, 2002)

Nserch4Drum said:


> Heard from someone that tried to pickup their permit today, that BBNP did not file the regulatons on time w/ NPS and there will be "No night time fishing" @ the Refuge this year.
> 
> They are optimistic that the paper work and the rule revisions will be completed for next year's drum run.
> 
> ...


I talked to a buddy that talked directly to the refuge manager today. The refuge had all their ducks in a row but the call came from DC,So bottom line no night fishing this year . They will put out a press release tommorow explaining what happened.


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## 8nb8 (Aug 30, 2005)

*bummer*

 Although I have trouble casting at night; I was really looking forward to night fishing at the refuge. That place is awesome during the day. It's gotta be even better at night.


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## Dr. Bubba (Nov 9, 1999)

Cdog is correct. The USFWS currently has a moratorium on ammendments to their fishing and hunting programs--that means no changes, for or against. All protocalls were handled correctly by BBNWR staff, but the USFWS was unable to approve the measure due to the moratorium. It's an unfortunate setback, but this is gonna happen. Even if we gotta wait til next year.

For those of you who fish Back Bay. Be sure to thank any of the BBNWR staff for their efforts on our behalf!


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

wonder what their gonna do with the 'beefed up' staff. They were so optimistic that this was going to happen. Heart sunk when I got the news.




> For those of you who fish Back Bay. Be sure to thank any of the BBNWR staff for their efforts on our behalf!


DR.B...most deffinite..Gladis, Dean...ect all were optimistic that this was going to be a good thing for the Refuge.

Also a special shout out to the VCAN members that piloted the nite time fishing last year.


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## Fishman (Apr 23, 2000)

#%&*^% I was looking forward to my first big drum from that place this year, now I guess Ill have to stand in that cluster F$%^K at LIP to do it.


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## tom_s (Oct 20, 2006)

Fishman said:


> #%&*^% I was looking forward to my first big drum from that place this year, now I guess Ill have to stand in that cluster F$%^K at LIP to do it.


oh I'm still gonna get my first big drum from that place this year!!!!!!!!!!!


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## dirtyhandslopez (Nov 17, 2006)

I know you guys may think I talk a load of ship sometimes, but what about this; Does anyone have any contacts with the peeps that rent the four wheeled bikes on the oceanfront at VB? If so, what about seeing if they will rent one or two for a night or two, to get down to False Cape State Park where night fishing is allowed all night, every day of the year for only 10$ a night, including camping rights. I reckon carrying gear on those would be a breeze and four or two or whatever peeps, peddling, woud be a easy. The drum are heading south aren't they? I am not crazy or drunk, yet:beer::fishing:


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## Sea2aeS (Jan 7, 2005)

Nothing crazy bout thinking outside the box darren... Somebody has to be willing to walk outside the line to discover new things... applause for willingness :beer:


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

Nserch4Drum said:


> Also a special shout out to the VCAN members that piloted the nite time fishing last year.


Yeah, too bad I wasn't a part of that.


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## Fishman (Apr 23, 2000)

Newsjeff said:


> Yeah, too bad I wasn't a part of that.


I did manage to make one trip down there last year. What a blast. Most everyone but me caught a drum me just those pesky Japanese flatfish :--|


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## in2win (Dec 18, 2003)

dirtyhandslopez said:


> I know you guys may think I talk a load of ship sometimes, but what about this; Does anyone have any contacts with the peeps that rent the four wheeled bikes on the oceanfront at VB? If so, what about seeing if they will rent one or two for a night or two, to get down to False Cape State Park where night fishing is allowed all night, every day of the year for only 10$ a night, including camping rights. I reckon carrying gear on those would be a breeze and four or two or whatever peeps, peddling, woud be a easy. The drum are heading south aren't they? I am not crazy or drunk, yet:beer::fishing:


Sounds like a design/build operation for Shooter and Catman... 4wheel/duel peddle driven bicycle/dunebuggy with rod racks and rumble seat :fishing:


CATCHEMUP,

Mike


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

in2win said:


> Sounds like a design/build operation for Shooter and Catman... 4wheel/duel peddle driven bicycle/dunebuggy with rod racks and rumble seat :fishing:
> 
> 
> CATCHEMUP,
> ...


dont forget the knee brace for each wheel!


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## Shooter (Nov 14, 2004)

NTKG said:


> dont forget the knee brace for each wheel!


Now if that is a direct shot at my bad knee I will have you know I been working out this summer and I am sure I can get my knee up high enough to kick some butt and if I can't thats why I have Catman


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

Shooter said:


> Now if that is a direct shot at my bad knee I will have you know I been working out this summer and I am sure I can get my knee up high enough to kick some butt and if I can't thats why I have Catman


whats happened to you man? i mean you used to take pride in things.... now you want credit for doin nothin!!!!

i mean yah shooter, there you go. be proud you can kick an asian in the azz! so exactly how high can you lift your knee again? 2 inches?


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

Shooter said:


> I been working out this summer and I am sure I can get my knee up high enough to kick some butt.


Those 12oz curls don't help, old man.


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## dirtyhandslopez (Nov 17, 2006)

Good idea in2win. What about it Shooter?


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## Lafayette_River (Apr 12, 2005)

heres the story from back bay reps in a press release

http://www.vcanaccess.com/


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