# technique vs. power question



## Thumb-Burner (Dec 3, 2002)

ok... here's the deal.. 

went out to practice yesterday and while i'm actually pleased with my results for the second outing in a row, i've hit a wall big time..

I feel like my timing is pretty good (for me) and i'm getting pretty consistent, right down the middle...

but no matter what i do, i can't get more distance.... i feel like i'm hitting it pretty hard at the right time, but then again, i'm not good enough to know what i'm really supposed to be doing..

yesterday i had 4 casts in a row that were 625' down the middle.. tried to "hit it harder" each time and the result was the same.. the conditions were nearly no wind...


Do i need to learn something new about technique or do i need to get stronger and hit it harder? I will not accept that this is as far as i can cast.. LOL

my personal best (with some wind) is 680', in my previous outing... 

thoughts?? 

P.S. I told my wife i needed a new rod... she was pretty sure that was not the problem... LOL


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

Hey TB - sadly your wife is correct!

I had a similar question on my board yesterday, the answer is to stop trying to hit it harder, just take it easy and concentrate on technique and distance will come. BB


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## Thumb-Burner (Dec 3, 2002)

*nooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!*

Please don't tell me patience is the key!!! If that is it neil, it's a wonder I ever got over 400' LOL

seriously, that makes sense.. in your answer i think i understand that the finer points of technique can make a big difference right? is it also developing muscle memory with that form? i really do have to "think a lot" during the cast to make sure i'm doing things right.. it's not automatic yet..

thanks for the insight..


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## shaggy (Jun 18, 2003)

Dang guys, I was practicing for the surf out on the local lacrosse field, and using an 11' Diawa Elimintor and a Sealine - X 30 SHV, well was starting to feel happy about consistant tosses of 95 - 100 yards, pretty straight using five ounces of lead, and here you guys complain about distances twice as far  . DOes make me appreciate the guys and gals that can toss 500' - 600' plus though, and me wouldn't mind getting some consistant accurate tosses of 125 yards, so, me don't ask for much I guess. Small goals, or hurdles.

Have been using the OTG cast, and really, other than tossing during daylight on the beach (birds nest at night were a pain), this is the first time practicing with the combo. Started with red and white brakes installed (once it was pointed out no brakes were installed, maybe the reason for the multiple nesting), and then removed the white brakes, using red only domed end toward center.

That said any hints for more distance on the beach? Had some fluff yesterday, but two hours no nests, so it was fun!

Have Jeep will travel


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

TB - Technique is EVERYTHING. Technique with low power beats three grunts and fart any day of the week. The word is "CONTROL". Only put in as much power as you can control. 

Took me a long time, but I finally figured it out. Prior to that realisation I was getting thro' 3KG per year of 0.35mm mono - that's 61/2lbs or around 26,400ft of mono!!!! 

PS - not to mention thumb skin - BB


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

Shaggy - the 30 is a big reel and holds a lot of line. The problem with big reels is that the extra capacity adds weight to the spool and that weight adds to the rotational force of the spool which means you have to use more brakes which cuts distance.

Deep breath - now, if you have say 1200ft of line on the bigger reel and only cast say 400ft then you are having to brake 800ft of line that never sees the light of day - unless Moby comes along....

If you need 1200ft of 30lb line then hey, go for it. But if 900ft of 17lb will do - and this will cover most anything except big skate and shark go for a smaller reel and less hassle - BB


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## shaggy (Jun 18, 2003)

BB, so might the Slosh be better for me than the SHV? On the beach, use 15 pound Ande line with 50 pound (about 25' shock leader), and not out for Moby Dick, just decent stripers, drums and blues.

Like I said new to the conventional world of casting!

Thanks for the response, and finally am learning, maybe slowly, but learning!

Have Jeep will travel


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

Hey TB,

BB is right.

You're looking at the past king of "just hit it harder"!!! I was stuck at 550' for about 18 months before finally deciding that if I ever wanted to improve then I'd have to suck it up and learn from better casters. It really is about technique over power. 

Slow down, concentrate on coming around slowly and hitting the rod after you are squared up to the target. Left hand extension can't be stressed enough.

And remember, even after you think you have got it all figured out every now and then it will just disappear and you get to go back to square one...  

This game can be very frustrating but is one of the best hobbies I have experienced. Challenging, great fun and some of the best people you will ever meet.

Keep hitting it,

Tommy


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## Don B (Jul 28, 2001)

I had a similar experience this past Sunday. At least you were on the high side of 600'.

My distances were 185, 199, 199, 199, 199, 195. The 199s were about 10 yards right of center and plus or minus 1 foot of 199 yards. Each cast was harder than the previous cast. When I hit 195 I knew I was out of energy and put away my casting equipment.

After that I took out my fishing equipment to get some practice with it. 14' 4" rod, Newell S-338, 40# mono, 200 gram sinker. My first cast was low and left and went about 125 yards. I therefore focused on my left arm extension and cast 140, then 142. 

By using heavier equipment I was able to determine my casting deficiency and at least correct that major flaw. I was just fortunate to having stumbled across the problem. It's extremely difficult to improve without the aid of others. I can identify with your frustration.

Best wishes,
Don


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

Hey Don, how are things in the middle of the Pacific?

As Don says, a heavy outfit will often provide answers to flaws in technique. 

Not least because 200g at full power done wrong hurts! BB


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

Hey Tommy - I think we all go through the "Gotta hit it HARDER" phase at some time or other. And the left arm thing is spot on, a lazy left arm is a real distance killer - BB


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## Thumb-Burner (Dec 3, 2002)

*thanks to all*

.. a lot of great advice here.. thanks


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## rattler (Jul 3, 2004)

try a flyrod...helped me...improved my technic 1000%.


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## Big Lou (Jul 29, 2001)

*Hey T B*

If I might join in,,,,,I still have not perfected a technique as some have told me. But being that as it may, I have gone thru a LOT of transistions. One thing I have found, is you can not copy someone else and expect near the results. There are basics and one of the main things to (has already been touched on) is to be able to FEEL your weight all way thru the cast. You should be able to feel the weight getting heavier as you increase power/speed. Like Neil stresses technique,, translated to smooth . fluid, progressive power delivered to weight. First 90 %(?) of cast is using body to develop power to start weight and bend rod(?) last 10 % is to add acceleration of weight. THE PULL. 
To add distance I have found (for me) that if my casting technique is working satisfactory,,,I just try to speed everything up. NOT JUST A PART. But the entire motion.
This means Start into the swing a little faster turn a little faster and pull with everything I got.
You must still feel the weight thru whole motion.
If you have your technique working power is easily added but it must be by the whole casting motion, not one part will work.


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## Don B (Jul 28, 2001)

Black Beard said:


> Hey Don, how are things in the middle of the Pacific?
> 
> As Don says, a heavy outfit will often provide answers to flaws in technique.
> 
> Not least because 200g at full power done wrong hurts! BB


Hi Neil,

Summer is almost on us and it can get hot and muggy in paradise.

This coming August we will be having a two day casting workshop. I will be providing a few rods and reels for people to work with. The smallest will probably be a GS 535 and the largest will be our favorite 114HLW. 

Regarding the 200 grams, it sure is a pretty sight when it is towing 40# florescent yellow mono.

Best wishes,
Don


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

Lou - will you please stop making sensible posts that I have to keep agreeing with! BB - LOL


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