# What rod is a true 8 n bait rod?



## ematsuda

I'm looking for an 8 n bait rod where this type of weight is its strong point. I'm not looking for one that can "potentially" throw 10 oz. or so but one that does it without a problem. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.


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## fish bucket

every major company makes a true "heaver"
just recently there have been some true 8nbaits in this site for sale.


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## Jesse Lockowitz

Check out the cast pro 6-10.


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## biggestsquid

I'm with Jesse --- that unit tosses 8 + bunkie head like nobodies biz. It is the real deal!


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## Samblam

Ocean Master 12' 6-12 oz. love it.


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## Oldmulletbreath

Diawa Saltiga Balistic 40


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## surfchunker

all depends on how much money you want to spend ....


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## royjd

saltiga surf


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## ematsuda

I've thrown the Ballistic 40 and it's not a true 8 n bait - more like 6 n bait. It will cast 8 n bait but you'd have to baby it. I own the 33's and 35's - two of each and throw 5 n bait with those.


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## ematsuda

surfchunker said:


> all depends on how much money you want to spend ....


What do you have in mind? On the upper end, I was looking at the CTS 1364 rated 8-12 for $500+ a piece. I'm looking to purchase 2 rods.


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## Bocefus

Ditto the Ocean Master 12'. Its a beast, heavy, but one heck of a rod for the price. I have thrown 10oz with fish head with that thing.


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## Petersen

You must have arms the size of legs to not consider a ballistic 40 a 8n bait rod. I plan on getting one built this winter. When my buddy got his 40 a bunch of us took turns throwing it with 10nbait. Knowing daiwa will replace it no questions asked if it broke he told us all to throw it like we were trying to break it. No problems with 10 so 8 definitely aint a problem


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## Oldmulletbreath

Petersen, gotta agree 100%, I aint no big feller, I have thrown 10 and a monkey head with no problem, by far the best drum rod on the market that I have had my hands on.


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## ematsuda

Sorry, the Ballistic 40 just isn't an 8 n bait rod IMO. At 10 oz. and a monkey head, that thing will bend just holding it up in the air.


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## ematsuda

Here's a dude loading it with a 3 oz. albeit a powercast. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRgg32iAGoM


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## Tommy

PM sent

Tommy


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## Garboman

Hey Hawaii man

See if you can find a Wheels Reels (WRI) Inferno or Fusion magnum or if you want to get a rod that can throw/lob 16 oz a WRI Nail. Nail is pretty stout I have one and it needs a minimum of 8 to load it.

Other wise I would get an All Star Breakway 1509 it throws 8 just fine, I have several of them and before WRI these were the ones everyone gravitated to.

None of the above rods are currently being manufactured you have to find a used one but these are the rods we use on the OBX for 8-10 and bait. I have gone through a progression of Fenwicks, Lamis, the Zippys, and after twenty five years of casting for Drum..... the Breakway and WRI seem to get it out there the best for me. These rods come up frequently on this site, and after Drum season is over then a bunch more will come up for sale due to the bad economy...

I have heard a lot of good things about Tommy's Cast pro though I will confess to never having thrown one, but Tommy seems to get it out there with them and since he is the current North American Casting Champion, I would follow him if I was looking for a currently built new blank or finished rod. 

Garbo

Hapa Houle


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## dsurf

ematsuda said:


> Sorry, the Ballistic 40 just isn't an 8 n bait rod IMO. At 10 oz. and a monkey head, that thing will bend just holding it up in the air.


Agree with Eric on this one, I own 2 40-405s and do not consider them 8nbait rods with any *power* cast........I understand not everyone's power cast is the same...........they will snap with a true power cast of 8nbait.......A lob/overhead cast works fine. I use them for 6nbait......fine lightweight rod, especially if take the custom route.

Tommy's CP and the WRI fusion mag and inferno are truely 8nbait machines.


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## sand flea

Jesse Lockowitz said:


> Check out the cast pro 6-10.


+1. I just picked one up from Tommy. My casting sucks, to put it kindly. First time I unloaded, while the lead was in mid-flight, I barked out "HOOLLLYYY ****."


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## Ryan Y

You will be surprised. I have slid some drummies on the beach with the 6-10 Cast Pro slinging ten ounces.


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## Hudak

There have been some really great rods mentioned here. That Cast Pro really is different. 

Most of the others mentioned, you have to put the muscle into the blank to get it to throw, just nature of the action of those rods. The CCP 6-10, it really seems like the rod does most of the work. I have had people throw my 6-10 and immediately just SMILE. More times then not, they question whether I really had 8oz on, how easy it was to load and throw. Overall weight, dimensions, feel, and ease of throwing, the CCP is worth a serious look. For me, at the end of the day, if I have a choice of beating myself all day with 8oz, or throw a rod that will not beat me, the choice is pretty simple. Of course, there is no rod that will appeal to everyone, but if you are looking for a true 8nbait rod, sincerely give the CCP a chance. Once I got my first CCP, I lost interest in my CTS, and Rainshadow blanks. (Nothing wrong with those blanks, I just like the CCP better after throwing it.)

Robert


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## sudshunter

i myself like my breakaway hdx for slinging 8nbait....


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## fish bucket

throwing 10oz sinker is not the same as throwing 8n a head.
the drag on the 8n head will load the rod much deeper than a bare sinker
not a fan of the daiwa series.....musc prefer the breakaway/allstars


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## AbuMike

SU 1508, 1509 or a 1569......nuff said


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## chris storrs

inferno....8-12nbait no problems..


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## AL_N_VB

Got and own the Ballistic-35 and Fusion. Each has its own function. The Daiwa loads nicely with 6-7oz and strains with 8oz. The Fusion is a true 8 and bait. Will load and cast 6-8oz+spot head. Can lob 10oz+cob head when needed.

Need to try one of em Cast Pro's.


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## surf rat

As allways when the Drum hit the Point and Piers you will see more Fusions and Infernos bowed up than all the rest put together. Daiwas would be a distant second. Walk out on the Point during a bite and see for yourself....I would go so far as to say that if 30 Drum are caught 25 will be on fusions . And by the same 3 or four guys. I have seen it many times. Seeing how Fusions are no longer made Tommys rods And Daiwas might be your best bet. I'm not a big C.T.S. fan and I have had several. I have never seen anything outcast a Fusion if the right guy is throwing it. I do own a couple Fusions and I can say they will bomb eight and bait.


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## JAM

ematsuda said:


> I've thrown the Ballistic 40 and it's not a true 8 n bait - more like 6 n bait. It will cast 8 n bait but you'd have to baby it. I own the 33's and 35's - two of each and throw 5 n bait with those.


I beg to differ, the 35 is a Dead on 7 and bait rod.. The 40 is a true 8 and bait rod.. Friend of mine can break a lami 150 with 3 out of the tip every time, he can't break the 35 even with an 8.. some of ya know him .. LUM fishes sanbridge allot.. 

The Ballistic's are the best Factory Rods on the Planet. Put down allot of Citation Drum on mine.. No rod that I can throw farther.. JMPO (Just my Professional Opinion)

JAM


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## HuskyMD

sand flea said:


> +1. I just picked one up from Tommy. My casting sucks, to put it kindly. First time I unloaded, while the lead was in mid-flight, I barked out "HOOLLLYYY ****."


Wait, you've come back to the dark side? I thought you gave up on the whole conventional thing when you had that custom rod and the 525 like 9 yrs ago.


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## AbuMike

HuskyMD said:


> Wait, you've come back to the dark side? I thought you gave up on the whole conventional thing when you had that custom rod and the 525 like 9 yrs ago.


you caught that also i see. "Come to the Darkside, we have cupcakes".....


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## troutfishr

I have an sha30 paired with an oc12 and I use 50#shock leader, do you guys go up when you use 10+ bait or does 50# do just fine? Not trying to highjack thread.


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## Plug

dsurf said:


> Agree with Eric on this one, I own 2 40-405s and do not consider them 8nbait rods with any *power* cast........I understand not everyone's power cast is the same...........they will snap with a true power cast of 8nbait.......A lob/overhead cast works fine. I use them for 6nbait......fine lightweight rod, especially if take the custom route.
> 
> Tommy's CP and the WRI fusion mag and inferno are truely 8nbait machines.


I've owned 4 fusion mags, could throw them further than any heaver I've had. Loved 'um. One I lost when I took an unscheduled swim. The other 3 I broke the tips out of at the start of the forward cast. Might try an inferno if I can pick one up at a good buy but I'm a little gun shy.

The ballistic 40' s I switched to? Two years using the same Hatt. cast that broke the mags I ain't broke one yet.


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## Fish Hunter

Just get an old Magnaflex. Throw anything you want to. It may just take til mid week for it to load and release.


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## sleepyhead

I would try to find a inferno or fusion. Like someone said there should be some good rods for sale after the season is over. Me & Al knows of a fusioin is forsale he wants a decent price for it. I have not thrown the dawia rods, or cast pros yet either.


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## Garboman

"The other 3 I broke the tips out of at the start of the forward cast. Might try an inferno if I can pick one up at a good buy but I'm a little gun shy."

Plug Man

How much of the tips broke off?

Did they break in the same general location?

Were you casting one of them little AC guys or just a regular bait?


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## surf rat

I would say it might something to do with how they were stored or transported.The only one I know of breaking during a cast was Newsjeff's. That was after he ran over it with his truck. I heard a Rumor that Loomis built those blanks for those guys. Loomis is about to market some Factory heavers and from what I hear they are going to smash everything out there right now. Check out their N.R.X. line of rods. I can tell you first hand they blow away any rod on the Planet. I have fished with about seven diffrent models. If they market a line of N.R.X. surf rods they will be the real deal. I think that the deal with building the ultimate blank can be traced back to Zziplex......That guy is cutting edge with all this resin carbon stuff...Everyone seems to forget about Terry Carol. He is really the Daddy of all this cutting edge blank stuff.


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## ematsuda

The Ballistic 40 is an awesome rod, no doubt. Just not a true 8 n bait rod TO ME. 6, at the most 7 with a bit of overload considering an average sized bait. Sorry. 

I guess, I should now post, "what do you consider a rod that'll throw a larger load than a Ballistic 40". That's what I'm looking for! I've thrown the 40 - it's not enough.


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## NTKG

surf rat said:


> I would say it might something to do with how they were stored or transported.The only one I know of breaking during a cast was Newsjeff's. That was after he ran over it with his truck. I heard a Rumor that Loomis built those blanks for those guys.


David,

He aint the only one. I've broken one during a cast. Actually the first drum trip a few years back. Everyone I know in Richmond that has wheeler blanks has one that is broken and we are all pretending one day we'll get a replacement. I hear the 10/11ft rods were even worse about breaking.


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## AbuMike

NTKG said:


> David,
> 
> He aint the only one. I've broken one during a cast. Actually the first drum trip a few years back. Everyone I know in Richmond that has wheeler blanks has one that is broken and we are all pretending one day we'll get a replacement. I hear the 10/11ft rods were even worse about breaking.


I'm not even pretending anymore. Had 2 break and 2 1023's break. they are now in some dump somewhere. Y'all want um I know where 2 or more are right now for $475 or so brand spanking new in a shop.


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## fish bucket

The Ballistic's are the best Factory Rods on the Planet.

maybe to you they are but i would rate them in the top 5.
the original breakaway/allstars are tops in my book
century,cts,wri, all make excellent heavers

any company can make a stiff stick.....to make a heaver that also has action to make fighting a fisn fun is the real trick.
thankfully there is enough variety in the marketplace that everyone should be able to find the rod for them


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## ematsuda

fish bucket said:


> The Ballistic's are the best Factory Rods on the Planet.
> 
> maybe to you they are but i would rate them in the top 5.
> the original breakaway/allstars are tops in my book
> century,cts,wri, all make excellent heavers
> 
> any company can make a stiff stick.....to make a heaver that also has action to make fighting a fisn fun is the real trick.
> thankfully there is enough variety in the marketplace that everyone should be able to find the rod for them



fish bucket, you don't have to convince me... I have 4 of them... all stock. 2 33's and 2 35's. The 40's are great rods too... they overload with 8 n a decent bait IMHO. I'm looking for something with more balls, less finesse. FYI... the 33's are my absolute favorites... for 5 and a small bait.


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## Hudak

surf rat said:


> ... I think that the deal with building the ultimate blank can be traced back to Zziplex......That guy is cutting edge with all this resin carbon stuff...Everyone seems to forget about Terry Carol. He is really the Daddy of all this cutting edge blank stuff.


My absolute favorite rod that I have had my hands on was a Zippy. The SST-XL. That particular one I owned was perfect for me. In a sincere lapse of judgement, possible insanity, I ended up selling it to Big Lou. Since they are not made anymore, I failed to mention it. But you are right, Terry is producing some very nice stuff.


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## Jesse Lockowitz

NTKG said:


> David,
> 
> He aint the only one. I've broken one during a cast. Actually the first drum trip a few years back. Everyone I know in Richmond that has wheeler blanks has one that is broken and we are all pretending one day we'll get a replacement. I hear the 10/11ft rods were even worse about breaking.


i took that inferno the other night and finally put it to use. with the cooler weather, bond fires are common, and the 8' section left on it makes for a helluva fire pokin' stick , never know when you need the distance to turn over a log so it burns justtttttttt right


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## Garboman

" i took that inferno the other night and finally put it to use. with the cooler weather, bond fires are common, and the 8' section left on it makes for a helluva fire pokin' stick , never know when you need the distance to turn over a log so it burns justtttttttt right 

Before you fellas destroy/burn/stomp these broken tip rods...how much do you want for them?


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## sleepyhead

Let me change the thread for a second. What has/did happen the WRI company. I am guessing they are make the tips good? The WRI crew use to be all over the boards promoting them. I am not knocking as I have 2 of the rods, getting ready to buy another one.


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## AbuMike

sleepyhead said:


> Let me change the thread for a second. What has/did happen the WRI company. I am guessing they are make the tips good? The WRI crew use to be all over the boards promoting them. I am not knocking as I have 2 of the rods, getting ready to buy another one.


they ain't making jack good........


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## New Kent Newbie

Ive been fishing them exclusively for 5 years never had one break. Fusion, inferno, and nail I know several people who have done the same. I know more people who have not broken them than who have.


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## Plug

Garbo, they all broke about 15" I'm guessing from the tip. Casting a chunk or a head. Surf Rat there was nothing wrong with the way they were stored or carried. One of them did break when I was casting on a steep beach, a wave ran up behind me and I stuck the sinker in a few inches of wash on the backcast. But IMO a rod ought to handle that. 

I know of at least 3 other people who have broke them in the same place. 

Again I love the rods. Best casters I ever had. And Tommy is a friend of mine. I hate like hell that they break. Other people's results may vary. But for me it is what it is.

I would have never mentioned it accept for it was stated that the ballistic 40 can't handle a loaded cast with 8nbait as well and for me that just hasn't been the case. FOR ME the same casting stroke that broke 3 fusion mags has not broke a ballistic 40 YET. But, the Daiwas don't cast as far.


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## Plug

ematsuda said:


> Sorry, the Ballistic 40 just isn't an 8 n bait rod IMO. At 10 oz. and a monkey head, that thing will bend just holding it up in the air.


Along those lines the static deflection (bend at rest) with 8 ounces is less with my ballistic 40's than it is with my 1509 which I've been told (bought it used) is a first generation all-star.


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## Garboman

I was with Brandon and Lum one afternoon and they... Brandon in particular were smoking a bait out there using 8 ounces... Red Daiwa Ballistic not a large bait, just a whittled down for distance cob head, but it was very good distance.


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## surf rat

That is a real shame about the Broken rods that were not replaced.....I know Neil takes care of his stuff...Those guys could have cornered the Surf Rod market with the right leadership. I am really sorry to hear this..The ones that are still in one piece do cast great though.


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## Big EL

IMHO if you're breaking the tip and it's not because of damage but by casting alone then you are overpowering the rod and not allowing the rod to work as it is designed to work. 

I tend to push pull very aggressively when I come around so two of my rods have a stiff tip. I also have a 12' Tica which has a soft tip. With this rod I don't punch as aggressively as to allow the tip to flex naturally and to avoid over flexing which would break the tip.

Again these are issues that can be resolved with practice.

><))))*>


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## NTKG

Big EL said:


> IMHO if you're breaking the tip and it's not because of damage but by casting alone then you are overpowering the rod and not allowing the rod to work as it is designed to work.
> 
> I tend to push pull very aggressively when I come around so two of my rods have a stiff tip. I also have a 12' Tica which has a soft tip. With this rod I don't punch as aggressively as to allow the tip to flex naturally and to avoid over flexing which would break the tip.
> 
> Again these are issues that can be resolved with practice.
> 
> ><))))*>


Darryl, are you telling me that my little korean self is too strong to cast a fusion mag without breaking it? Ima have to call BS on that one, we aint all 6'9 like you Sir


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## NTKG

surf rat said:


> That is a real shame about the Broken rods that were not replaced.....I know Neil takes care of his stuff...Those guys could have cornered the Surf Rod market with the right leadership. I am really sorry to hear this..The ones that are still in one piece do cast great though.


David, 

I hear ya. I think they really could have owned the market. I'm not quite sure what that means as far as a bottom line though. Figure how many surf rods really sell in a given year...... Either way, I love their rods, for thier casting characteristics as well as the 22mm butt sections. The 3 WRI rods I have now will not be sold anytime soon.


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## surfchunker

are Nitro's prone to it also ... love mine but afeared now


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## Big EL

Neil..........How long you been casting?????????

It's not size that determines casting ability. If it were, I'd be throwing twice as far as you..................

It's not about size or strength, it's about technique.........period!

><))))*>


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## AL_N_VB

Garboman said:


> I was with Brandon and Lum one afternoon and they... Brandon in particular were smoking a bait out there using 8 ounces... Red Daiwa Ballistic not a large bait, just a whittled down for distance cob head, but it was very good distance.


you see a lot of them Daiwa 40's on the LIP.


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## CrawFish

Get a hold of the st croix premier surf xxh 12ft. It might not throw a brick, but i will throw 2 8oz sinkers and a good size bunker head. I use it as a pier/surf, anchor, and even for yak out baits.


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## Garboman

Sounds like you fellas with the Fusions need to follow EL Man's advice and back off a bit on the power stroke, especially if Garbo and Fish are around

I mean like why take a chance?



If someone wants to get rid of their Nail let me know, they are dainty and prone to break when casting only one brick instead of two....


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## Shooter

WRI rods are great and yea before I hear from the AC or peanut gallery I know I am not a monster caster (but I do make it all the way to the water without breaking them 

I have heard that Tommys new rods cast really smooth and even I can load one, so when or if I ever bust up 1 of my 2 fussions or The Inferno I will have to give stuff a whirl,,,, *I know Tommy will stand behind anything he sells*


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## NTKG

uh.. Shooter on a serious note.... You want to sell that inferno?


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## Ralph

*1509...*



AbuMike said:


> SU 1508, 1509 or a 1569......nuff said


I realize others may have said it, but i TOTALLY AGREE with Mike!


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## Ralph

A Century Raptor will also throw 8 and bait.


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## Ralph

i'm testing my memory a bit but unless i am mistaken, Breakway made a rod called an Allstar? don't throw it if you got the runs. it too will throw 8 and bait.


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## Ralph

Zziplex, a personal favorite. but i can't think of a model that will handle that weight. but if i had to wager, i'd bet the Quatra can message that weight into the surf.


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## Garboman

Breakway made a rod called an Allstar?


All Star made a line of surf rods that Breakaway sold blanks and completed rods 1507, 1508, 1509
1507 is lightest
1509 heaviest

There were several variations of the 1509's with one version being qualified to throw 12's



All Star quit making the surf rods when their business was sold to another entity, All Star is still making light spinning and bass rods


Full length All Star 1509 in the right hands (mine) will out cast these flimsy WRI's that keep snapping their tipsopcorn:

I will not have to baby it that's for sure


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## Ralph

Garboman said:


> Breakway made a rod called an Allstar?
> 
> 
> All Star made a line of surf rods that Breakaway sold blanks and completed rods 1507, 1508, 1509
> 1507 is lightest
> 1509 heaviest
> 
> There were several variations of the 1509's with on version being qualified to throw 12's
> 
> 
> 
> All Star quit making the surf rods when their business was sold to another entity, All Star is still making light spinning and bass rods
> 
> 
> Full length All Star 1509 in the right hands (mine) will out cast these flimsy WRI's that keep snapping their tipsopcorn:


i may have the wrong name (i'm old), but yeah i'm pretty sure it was called the "Allstar". IMHO THE badest rod. what i liked most about it you had a chance to hold it (at least for a lil while over your shoulder) in the surf. Again NOTHING compares to the Breakaway 1509. it will throw 8 and a honda Fit. but you can't hold it you MUST put it in a rod holder.


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## Garboman

Again NOTHING compares to the Breakaway 1509.


All Star and the original Breakaway were one and the same

All Star made the Blanks in Texas, the Blank maker then went to Baston Enterprises when All Star quit making the heavers, I forget his name but he was the same man that worked for Lamiglas and built the Fenwick Big SurfStiks. 

Breakaway sold them out of Texas

I bought seven when they were still selling them new on the OBX where the prototypes were tested


I am not sure who makes the Breakaway HDX or LDX these days but it is a different manufacturer


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## Ralph

you know, what seems like a life time ago, a guy i considered a friend held a casting event. one of the events was an 8 & bait competition. the competitiors used any rod they like, were given an 8 ounce weight and rubber lure to simulate a fish head, lets say. the time might be ripe for someone to organize such an event. it will certinly put to rest a bunch of fallacies one has about ones castiing ability and about ones equipment.


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## Garboman

Sportcast USA used to do that after they the did the competition thing, they did it a lot at the Salvo Campground. Mike Langston won it a few times.


Across Rt 12 from the Salvo Campground is the Atlantic Ocean and that is where the fallacies about casting and who has the baddest stick are put to rest...


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## Hudak

If there were an 8nbait comp held in Central NC, who would all show up? I was attempting to put one together a few years ago, and somethings on my end fell through. They have since been resolved. If there is enough interest, I have no problem holding one. BTW, that CCP 6-10 I suggested earlier has a 22mm butt.


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## Ralph

Garboman said:


> Sportcast USA used to do that after they the did the competition thing, they did it a lot at the Salvo Campground. Mike Langston won it a few times.
> 
> 
> Across Rt 12 from the Salvo Campground is the Atlantic Ocean and that is where the fallacies about casting and who has the baddest stick are put to rest...


i have been to a couple of those tourneys and i cant' recall an 8 & bait event. but you may be right. its sounds like you have first hand knowledge. again i am old. have you heard of a cast a muck? that is the 8 & bait competition that i remember. and the Allstar rod that i am thinking of was owned by the then president of sc.


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## Hudak

Shooter said:


> WRI rods are great and yea before I hear from the AC or peanut gallery I know I am not a monster caster (but I do make it all the way to the water without breaking them
> 
> I have heard that Tommys new rods cast really smooth and even I can load one, so when or if I ever bust up 1 of my 2 fussions or The Inferno I will have to give stuff a whirl,,,, *I know Tommy will stand behind anything he sells*


I have never seen anyone try as hard to make sure a customer is happy as Tommy Farmer does. I have only owned one WRI blank, I have always heard there customer service sucked. I imagine it would be a little hard to find All* 8nbait rods now, it is even tough to find the older SU Rainshadows.


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## Garboman

"i cant' recall an 8 & bait event"

It was an informal event that was held after the regular Sport Cast tournament. Mike Langston won it the two times I was around it. Mike L is one of the three guys that I can not out cast. I have not heard of it since perhaps 2003.

Mike Langston was a teeny bopper when he first started coming around Nags Head Pier back in the eighties when I fished every day.... when Mike L is ON I have yet to see anyone out cast him Drum Fishing and that includes all of the rest of the OBX guys some of whom I would consider World Class, there are a couple others but I will not admit to having them outcast me, most everyone is within five- ten yards of each other. What really makes the difference is who bows up the most and who brings the best bait to the planks...and if you are not the best caster well then you can win just by getting there earlier and staying longer....

Anyway Drum Fishing keeps me youngopcorn:and I am not shy about talking trash especially on the Net...(I smoked Mike Langston in 1987 with my one piece lami and 7000, he was perhaps 5'8 or 5'9 and I was 6' 220 bad ass)


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## chris storrs

anytime after ya cast ya gotta crank some line back on your reel, you know your doin good haha...


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## map120277

Mike Langston is a damn good caster and fisherman. I used to work with him in a tackle shop in Kitty Hawk. He is full of knowledge on casting and fishing. I learned many things from him especially about Drum fishing. I have not seen him in years, hope is doing well.


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## Plug

Garboman said:


> Across Rt 12 from the Salvo Campground is the Atlantic Ocean and that is where the fallacies about casting and who has the baddest stick are put to rest...


Dig that! And a rod that can't be gripped and ripped when I'm standing on a bar in a fast chop slop... or I'm *** sphincter wore out... or half shot in the ass from various ingested discombobulators... or any host of other things which effect "form" ain't a beach rod. at least not for me. I ain't perfect.

Can't rush a Hatt. cast because a tip might break?


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## Jesse Lockowitz

Plug said:


> Dig that! And a rod that can't be gripped and ripped when I'm standing on a bar in a fast chop slop... or I'm *** sphincter wore out... or half shot in the ass from various ingested discombobulators... or any host of other things which effect "form" ain't a beach rod. at least not for me. I ain't perfect.
> 
> Can't rush a Hatt. cast because a tip might break?


Holy sh!t that's funny. Wore out like a *** sphincter hahahahahahaha 


Im with you. I'm not changing my discombobulaters so my tip don't break hah


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## Big EL

A true 8nbait rod.............interesting thread.

I have an Ocean Master 12 footer that I had Wayne extend the Butt on, it's about 13' now. It throws 8nbait with ease. I picked up an HDX a few years ago. It throws 8nbait like I'm throwing 6nbait. The result is more distance with the same effort. The HDX throws 10nbait like 8nbait. This works well when the wind is NE and the current is heavy. I also have a 12' Tica That I haven't extended the butt on. It's sweet spot is 6nbait. 

"A true 8nbait rod" This really will be determined by your casting style and strength. Try out as many rods as you can, find one that fits your style and doesn't wear you out after 10 casts.

The sweetest rod I ever threw was one Trey had me throw, I think he said it was an 1865 something or other. Truely the best fit for me and the way I throw.

The key to finding the "A true 8nbait rod" is practice and experimentation. No one throws the same, thats why customs are made. If you by an off the rack rod you have to adapt your style to what the rod will and won't do to avoid injury to yourself or damage to the rod.

><))))*>


----------



## JAM

A true Eight and Bait rod will be rated from 6-16 ounces.. 

JAM


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## crumbe

JAM said:


> I beg to differ, the 35 is a Dead on 7 and bait rod.. The 40 is a true 8 and bait rod.. Friend of mine can break a lami 150 with 3 out of the tip every time, he can't break the 35 even with an 8.. some of ya know him .. LUM fishes sanbridge allot..
> 
> The Ballistic's are the best Factory Rods on the Planet. Put down allot of Citation Drum on mine.. No rod that I can throw farther.. JMPO (Just my Professional Opinion)
> 
> JAM


LUM still fishing the LIP...

Geeze its been a long time since I fished out there with those guys!!


----------



## big brother

I may be wrong, but I believe it was the cast-a-muck in Smithfield in '92 that put an end to cast-a-mucks forever.
Lord, I still break a sweat just thinking about it. 
charlie


----------



## Big EL

big brother said:


> I may be wrong, but I believe it was the cast-a-muck in Smithfield in '92 that put an end to cast-a-mucks forever.
> Lord, I still break a sweat just thinking about it.
> charlie


We had a Castamuck in Smithfield in 2002.....It was really hot, the ground was really hard. Is that the one you were thinking of??

It was a great time but it sure was hot!!

><))))*>


----------



## Garboman

Plug Man brought up a point dear to my heart and it is not what the Locko Man keyed in on.....


The first ten or so Drum casts of the day are easy and if there are Drum around even easier. It is after one has been up 48 hours straight on a fishing bender and ones feet just plain hurt from the planks or sand, the rod you are still able to load and get decent distance is a true 8 and bait rod.

I will typically walk out on the planks with three heavers, four or five if there is no limit and each one has different characteristics, but they are basically stiff, stiffer, really stiff and Stiffest,

If I keep getting older and weaker you might see me out there with 5oz Sputniks and my 1507's

Anyway that wind will be bringing them on down this week or next....


----------



## big brother

yep, '02, old age is hell on memory, but I believe it was your truck that had the thermometer that would go that high. LOL. It was the one on the concrete field, not the one by the pig farm sewage pond. Casting events have not always been on manicured sod farms.
charlie


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## Big EL

Yep had a thermometer hanging on the camper. It was above 100 all day. Tommy was just getting started back then.......Look at him now.

><))))*>


----------



## Fish Hunter

Yep, that is the one that almost took out Red Dog. There was a measured 8nbait cast off. Hatteras cast or heave and chunk it. No off the ground, aierals, etc. My best was about 97 yds. Seems to my old memory someone hit one about 137 yds for the long of the day


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## Big EL

Hey Don!

Tony taught me the "blob" knot that weekend

><))))*>


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## tarponman62

Can't go wrong with an Ocean master 12 "heavy" can throw a brick with it and not bad on the wallet neither at BPS. If you want something lighter with same tensil strength then buy a carolina casting pro model (greater quality = more $$$$). 
Tightlines TM62


----------



## Don B

ematsuda,

Look what you started! 

All the folks have given you their best opinions for east coast fishing.
If you intend to use the rod in Hawaii, the requirements will (of course) be different.

I have a sample WRI Inferno that was sent for my evaluation. Although I liked the tip section, I found the short 22mm handle to be lacking.

Generally, going for big fish in Hawaii requires much greater boosting power. I believe that you may be looking for a blank with handle diameter (at the reel seat) of 26 to 28mm. 

I am not familiar with all the CTS blanks. Those that I am familiar with have a tip that is small in diameter.

There are 3 options that may suit you.

Ken Kimura should be in the final stages of development of his new line of blanks. They may be worth waiting for.

Lamiglas is converting their GSB 162 1MH into a 2 piece blank. Due to the power requirements, they believe a design into a sleeved ferrule (as opposed to a spigot ferrule) is required. It is on their list, but not on the top of their list. This is being done specially for Hawaii.

And finally, The most powerful long blank that I am aware of, is the Conoflex Makoi Extreme. It is 14' 4" long and takes a minimum of 9 ounces to begin to load the rod with a fishing pendulum. The problem with this solution is that Conoflex requires a minimum order of 5.

If you want to cast and Inferno or Extreme, send a PM and we can set up a time.
Please be advised that I do not carry WRI blanks and do not sell to the general public.


----------



## AbuMike

WRI don't sell to anyone anymore.....You will find a stray one here and there but good advice would be to spend your money on another blank or rod.


----------



## smacks fanatic

JAM said:


> A true Eight and Bait rod will be rated from 6-16 ounces..
> 
> JAM


That might be a little of an exaggeration. A 8nbait rod would be rated more like 6-12ounces


----------



## Garboman

If you intend to use the rod in Hawaii, the requirements will (of course) be different.


Don

Are you fellas in Hawaii magging 6/0's for casting anchor sinkers? I saw your post about a fishing pendulum. 

I am intrigued by the Conoflex Extreme rod, A friend on Hatteras with a custom rod business had an All Star "Hawaiian" blank that was a beast in that the butt section was massive nearly 1.75" inches diameter as I remember that was ten years or so ago. On OBX we typically like a smaller butt so we can get a good thumb on the casting reels without slippage. 

On a smaller scale on OBX we would use Abu 10000's and cast out a 10 oz sinker and slide rig a live bait for Cobia and King Mackeral, it is a good method I caught some fine fish with it.

My Mother grew up in Honolulu and I am Hapa Houle

One fine day I will make it to the Islands and show up on Kaena Point with heavers over my shoulder (Perhaps the first few times with one of my Cousins so I survive)


----------



## Big EL

Knew there was something I liked about you.............Shaka Bra! So you da kine Hapa Houle. 



><))))*>


----------



## Rockfish1

AFAW Beach, will throw 8nbait all day long...


----------



## JAM

*No Exaggeration, I build and thats what they are rated for.*



smacks fanatic said:


> That might be a little of an exaggeration. A 8nbait rod would be rated more like 6-12ounces


Like any blank, there will be a sweet spot if a rod throws 1-3 oz's then 2 should be the sweet spot.. A Lami-Glas GSB 136 1-MH is rated for 6 - 16 oz's by the manufactur.. Same with the GSB 150- 2 MH rated from the manufactur 6-16.. 

JAM


----------



## Don B

Garboman said:


> Are you fellas in Hawaii magging 6/0's for casting anchor sinkers? I saw your post about a fishing pendulum.


Hey Garboman,

I would never mag a Penn 6/0. When I did use them, the trick was to use heavy oil in the bearings and apply STP to the left spool bearing. The STP would give some initial braking and then melt as the cast continued. I'm not sure that this process would work well in a colder climate.



> I am intrigued by the Conoflex Extreme rod, A friend on Hatteras with a custom rod business had an All Star "Hawaiian" blank that was a beast in that the butt section was massive nearly 1.75" inches diameter as I remember that was ten years or so ago. On OBX we typically like a smaller butt so we can get a good thumb on the casting reels without slippage.


There were a total of 5 of the Extremes manufactured. Due to their length, they are a beast to cast. The handle is parallel. There are issues that arise when the smaller diameter handles are used. Typical complaints regard the twisting of the rods handle when cranking the handle of larger reels.



> My Mother grew up in Honolulu and I am Hapa Houle
> 
> One fine day I will make it to the Islands and show up on Kaena Point with heavers over my shoulder (Perhaps the first few times with one of my Cousins so I survive)


Give me a shout when you arrive.
Last year the US Nationals casting competition was held in New Jersey. One of the gentlemen was kind enough to share the aloha and provide me with chemical hand warmers. It was 40 degrees and my blood was far too thin. My wife did enjoy the seeing the trees turn color.

Don


----------



## rivercat

Is a 12' Tiralejo any good as a heaver? I would never buy one new but I found a good deal on one used with an avet MXL 2 speed on it.


----------



## mots reel deal

g loomis SUR 1448C


----------



## rivercat

Anyone? This thread seems to put all confidence in the WRI fusion thats unavailable anymore or the Cast pro Be nice to have other options from those who know. Thanks in advance!


----------



## Shooter

Click on here and Tommy Farmer will be able to hook you up with what ever type of rod you need and he stands behind everything he sells. I haven't heard anything bad at all about his stuff.

http://www.pierandsurf.com/fishing-forum/forumdisplay.php?46-Carolina-Cast-Pro


----------



## tarponman62

I vote for the classic Ocean Master 6-12 oz,, heavy rod but great on the budget. I also like the Casting Pro brand.

Tightlines TM62


----------



## SurffishNJ

I really like the Outcast Heaver, light powerful, and loads very well. also one for sale in the market place.


----------



## luckyOC

I own a fusion mag, CTS 8-12, and a CCP 6-10... I have owned a SUR 1508 and 1569, a OM cape point, and some others... My two go-to rods now are the CCP and the CTS... both have many pluses and near to no minuses... My casting 'style' can be described as OTG, and I cant load the WRI very well... but cant throw over 6oz on 1502's.... The CTS and CCP are nice to cast, i can hit them well, right now those are my two favorites and are always heading out.

I have thrown the old school all star 1509, and wish i could find a un-cut/built blank, but that seems to be wishful thinking.

If I would have to pic a blank that is still produced, I would look at the CTS and CCP. I only throw 8 and bait with these two, they can handle big heads to a small mullet chunk either way.


----------



## Ryan Y

I too like both the Carolina Cast Pro and the Fusion. 
The fusion I like for power. When I haven't been standing and casting for a while. Ill pick it up and sling it. I also like the hook setting power at a distance. 
I don't like the inconsistency between rods. Or that they are no longer building blanks. Near the end you couldn't get a blank replaced when they broke.
The Carolina Cast pro, I like the weight distribution. I also think it is a lot easier on me when I've been fishing for hours standing and holding the rod, casting every ten minutes. Finishing with the fish near the beach, the rod seems a little better with the tip high too. Just feels better.
The bad (for me). I like a more parabolic rod. One that bends evenly from tip towards butt. I also like a rod without a clear coat finish. (I know that's a personal issue).
So what I think people should take
away from all of these posts are that you should pick the rod that suits your casting style. Some load fast, others slow. They fight different. One should try all they can to make their decision.


----------



## Drumdum

Ryan Y said:


> I too like both the Carolina Cast Pro and the Fusion.
> The fusion I like for power. When I haven't been standing and casting for a while. Ill pick it up and sling it. I also like the hook setting power at a distance.
> I don't like the inconsistency between rods. Or that they are no longer building blanks. Near the end you couldn't get a blank replaced when they broke.
> The Carolina Cast pro, I like the weight distribution. I also think it is a lot easier on me when I've been fishing for hours standing and holding the rod, casting every ten minutes. Finishing with the fish near the beach, the rod seems a little better with the tip high too. Just feels better.
> The bad (for me). I like a more parabolic rod. One that bends evenly from tip towards butt. I also like a rod without a clear coat finish. (I know that's a personal issue).
> So what I think people should take
> away from all of these posts are that you should pick the rod that suits your casting style. Some load fast, others slow. They fight different. One should try all they can to make their decision.


 Ryan got two fusion mags with nail butts and love them,as you said,I'll be hating life if they break....


----------



## Ralph

*Breakaway Allstar Triple A*



Garboman said:


> Breakway made a rod called an Allstar?
> 
> 
> All Star made a line of surf rods that Breakaway sold blanks and completed rods 1507, 1508, 1509
> 1507 is lightest
> 1509 heaviest
> 
> There were several variations of the 1509's with one version being qualified to throw 12's
> 
> 
> 
> All Star quit making the surf rods when their business was sold to another entity, All Star is still making light spinning and bass rods
> 
> 
> Full length All Star 1509 in the right hands (mine) will out cast these flimsy WRI's that keep snapping their tipsopcorn:
> 
> I will not have to baby it that's for sure


it took a little mining, but i finally remember the name of the Breakaway rod i descrbied in my earlier post. it was call a Breakaway Allstar Triple A. Nice rod.


----------



## jlentz

Ralph said:


> it took a little mining, but i finally remember the name of the Breakaway rod i descrbied in my earlier post. it was call a Breakaway Allstar Triple A. Nice rod.


The Breakaway AAA built on the Allstar 1688-2 Blank. An awesome rod for heavy weights and good distance. Weighs a ton but can throw as much weight as you want. 

John


----------



## Ralph

*1688-2...*

i never did know the AAA's blank designation. i'm surpised that no one has tried to copy it with new technology. thanks john!


----------



## SurfPlug

I prefer the Lami 1502 for 8nbait.


----------



## Furball

Rockfish1 said:


> AFAW Beach, will throw 8nbait all day long...


That is my primary heaver. I bought it from Tommy Farmer and would not hesitate to buy from him again. He is a great guy. My backup is the Daiwa 40. I think they are both very good heavers. I consider myself to be one of the better casters with 8 and bait (not at Mike's level) and those two rods work great. I have 1509. It was my first custom heaver -- at a birthday present from my siblings when I turned 40 -- and it will cast very, very far. The problem though with the 1509 is that is not great blank for fighting a fish. It is so stiff, it feels like using a 2 by 4. I did cast a prototype of the inferno which Ryan White lent me and I was very impressed with how it casts but a 9 foot tip is a two much of a pain to transport. We are lucky. There are a number of good choices out there.


----------



## Furball

BTW - This has been a great thread.


----------



## rivercat

I bought that 12' Tiralejo no one would recommend and at first touch indoors seems to be a quality item, Also gonna pick up a CCP 6-10 13' so I will test and report. Working with avets SXs one MXL static maggd with grease and a couple of grandwave 20s. I also own a Dblue 11'3 I would put it way better then a $99 tsunami or diawa or even tica and probly above the BPS OP rod but never casted one. However the dblue is an awesome rod but it is maxed out at 8 with a little head, 9 or 10 is out. How does the st. croix premier do ?


----------



## Sandcrab

Make sure to add it all up for a true load - 8 oz sinker, 4 oz bunker, 1 oz terminal gear... A true 8-N-B8 rod needs to be able to handle it all...

I like the 14' AFAW BB I built (Thanks Tommy!)...

Sand crab


----------



## Garboman

"4 oz bunker"

You chucking out the whole Bunker?


----------



## sleepyhead

Me.. It might not be bunker. But it wuz a really large mullet head.


----------



## jlentz

Garboman said:


> "4 oz bunker"
> 
> You chucking out the whole Bunker?


I have weighed bunker heads and a medium size bunker head is about 3oz. Large bunker head is about 5oz and. Extra large bunker heads 6oz +. So you are looking at a total payload minimum of 11oz up to 14oz when using 8oz weights. Throwing the larger bunker heads when there is a strong current will require more than 8oz of weight which would bring the total payload to 1lb+.

John


----------



## WILSON

jlentz said:


> I have weighed bunker heads and a medium size bunker head is about 3oz. Large bunker head is about 5oz and. Extra large bunker heads 6oz +. So you are looking at a total payload minimum of 11oz up to 14oz when using 8oz weights. Throwing the larger bunker heads when there is a strong current will require more than 8oz of weight which would bring the total payload to 1lb+.
> 
> John


Its about the same for big cobb heads too. Thats why the Wri, 1509's and heavy action rods will always be so popular with the drum crowd. 10 ounces is thrown quite often for some us... wish some of the rod makers would get it. Maybe we can get Tommy to making something a touch heavier... bet it be a hit around this area


----------



## Garboman

I have chucked more than a few large baseball sized Mullet Heads off the Hatteras piers in October/November these larger heads seem to attract a "Rough Crowd" of clientele at night which is when the bait went out..

The Fatback heads I have chucked out all would get a Trim , we cut off the bottom section of the head for stylistic and aerodynamic reasons, I never fished them much as they bleed out too quickly but they sure look evil with the haircut..

I did lob out a whole live Fatback one time, hooked him through the nose with a 92553 cut his tail fin off and cause a school of Drum was working a large school of Fatback right in front of the pier I just flicked him out there not about fifty yards and ten minutes later the reel was smoking.

I actually have seen way more Drum caught on smaller baits versus larger baits simply because the casts were longer but I would agree you need a stiff rod and those are what I use usually All Star 1509's but I use them more to get a smaller bait out as far as I can.....as I fish the planks mostly and that is just the way it is with the planks I fished on...my favorite bait is trimmed up Roe Mullet body sections if there are enough fish around to run the pickers out the area...otherwise it is a Cob head .

If I am at the Point either Cape or Ocracoke in the spring I use small pieces of fatback for less roll in the current. I have only fished the OBX so I what I do may not make sense further North or South and it may only make sense to the me and the fellas I fish with, since Garbo just copied what the most successful Drum fishermen do as far as technique.

However if everyone around me is bowing up on large baits and that is what it takes then Garbo would not hesitate to to copy cat their technique and chuck out whatever the critters preferred that day and I certainly am one to want to oblige them..and I will pull my Nail out of the Suburban and chuck out two pounds if that is what it takes to get bit.

If I keep getting older and weaker though I may have to switch to live baiting Flounder


----------



## JAM

and thats why you need a rod rated for up to 16 ounces...JAM


----------



## blakester

Hell I'll chime in. I have thrown them all at one point or another. I think of it like this. If your rod is rated for 12ounces and you throw 10 and bait , you are using 100% load capacity on every throw.( if throwing correctly) If rated for 16ounces , as Mr. Jam states and throwing 10 and bait you would be using roughly 70% of what the rod is capable of. (If throwing correctly) This to me means I can hit it as hard as I can, at will, and not worry about if the rod can handle it. YES my rods are rated for 16 and they are St. Croix. I'm with ya Jam.


----------



## AbuMike

This is why I love my 1509's I guess. "Hit it like ya love it" sounds right to me.....hahahahahaha.


----------



## Garboman

"This to me means I can hit it as hard as I can, at will, and not worry about if the rod can handle it"

Once upon a time I was at the Point on an evening when Sportcast had held a tournament earlier in the Day and I had watched them cast at Salvo Campgrounds and spoke with Mike Langston who identified the other competitors to me. 

Anyway it was getting about dusk I was fishing in the lineup and it was time for the chewing to begin and I happened to by standing with my bait out next to two of the Tournament casters one fella was 6'7 or so and 300 plus pounds, he was new to casting and had poor form but he was big and he got it out there, way out there... the other fella was saying how much better casters they were intimating that the Bozo's like myself were to be awed....and how it gave them the advantage. The real big fellas bait was way out there and I hate to admit it but he was likely out past my bait. The other fella was not so big and his rod was more a tournament style British Rod and he was not out past my bait but he was the one talking about his advantage and Tournament prowess.......Short guy got bit by a bluefish and had to reel in.....Then he made a Hatteras cast with a lot of hip movement and with a deft flick back lashed and busted off the top three feet of that custom $600 British Stick....with that his "Tournament Advantage" was over.....he was dumbstruck at his loss.....a few moments later both the Big Fella and I (Bozo) bowed up to Drum and then Darkness fell....Advantages even out ....


----------



## Hudak

Great story, glad you shared....


----------



## Samblam

Being that I'm a noob to this and only have one 8nbait rod I'm going to have to put mine in for the ocean master heavy 6-12oz. Some people complain about it being a heavy rod but I don't mind it. I am however confident it will throw anything I put on it. Have it mated up with a saltist BG30 and it turned out to be a great set up to learn on.

All that being said, this thread needs to go in the bible.


----------



## JAM

Story time:

Built a 1418 allstar with an inch out of the tip as a spinner for a girl I was dating at the time. She wanted to Drum fish with me at the point so, I would throw the Rod and she would fish it. I was sure at the time that I was out throwing 85 percent of the guys with conventionals, was told so by Big Ed Stanley, Big Ed or Q-Ball was happy to see another spinner out there as thats all he ever threw. I was getting my WRI farther on the cast during daylight hours, but my daytime cast and night time casts are two different animals. I have a long drop to the reel and have to spot the weight at 5 oclock to start my swing, so during the daylight hours I can hump on it come night I shorten my drop and loose distance... I actualy switched over to that spinner for the rest of the 2007 spring season, (my last Drum Fishin)I am sure I could throw it farther at night, and I believe that if I were to take up fishin with splinters it would be a 136 one piece ole school lami, in spinning format... Or a 162 one piece...

JAM


----------



## rivercat

Well still need a baseball to practice with but, I am very impressed with both the ccp 6-10 and the tiralejo I had given up on the latter being no one would comment on it but I like it better so far. The ccp being a 13' stick is a beast as soon as I laid hands on it picking it up from drumboy at the fort I was intimidated by the length and mass but I will say I have held 11' cheap heavers that were heavier, the rod seems to have a fast tip vs the tiralejo thats a bit more slow and parabolic. I also like the sliding seat on the tiralejo cause I seem to do better with a wide grip. Don't come on here bashing me Im not 50+ years old I don't live at the point I don't build rods Im not a rodologist just a freshwater fisherman turning salt.


----------



## JAM

*It's the little Red ones on friday morning, someones taken the wrong meds today.....*

"Don't come on here bashing me Im not 50+ years old I don't live at the point I don't build rods Im not a rodologist just a freshwater fisherman turning salt." 

O.K.

JAM


----------



## Samblam

opcorn:opcorn:


----------



## Fish Hunter

Yeah, Jam, I like the 1418 a lot. It is not a north beach, rolling current kinda of a stick, but to casually throw 8 and a small bait for me it works well. If a rod works for you, use it. Its all about what you like and how well you can cast it.


----------



## JAM

*I can get the 1418's*

Done right to the Allstar Spec sheet. Century has an HJ-1418 the HJ stands for hatteras jacks.. They are available and re-issued.. There is one in my future, inch out of the tip and ya can hump on a 7 and a nice chunk.. One of my 3 favorite rods ever..

JAM


----------



## smacks fanatic

this thread stil going?


----------



## Garboman

"this thread stil going? 

No........... but since you asked

Feel Free to bash me

Since I am over 50, lived at the Point for weeks on end before the NPS showed up in force, thought I was a Rodologist until I checked out the Mudhole annual calendar winners and then realized I am too lazy/busy/blind to perform closed butt wraps, built around fifty rods, only the last ten or so were worth keeping, nice thing about building your rods is your own Karma that is in the Stick, and you can all ways strip it and start over, I have several Sticks from back in the Day on their third set of guides.

Mostly I fish for Drum cause it is a pure sport that rewards dedication, hard work, skill, a bit of athletic ability and timing, along with a bit of luck and good fortune thrown into the mix.

Plus I have some friends that I have fished with for decades that embody all these identified characteristics of Drum Fishermen, which happen to carry over nicely into the other facets of ones life, only non fishermen would bash this way of life and they are by far... the easiest to outcast/outfish....


----------



## fishnuttz

Garboman said:


> "this thread stil going?
> 
> No........... but since you asked
> 
> Feel Free to bash me
> 
> Since I am over 50, lived at the Point for weeks on end before the NPS showed up in force, thought I was a Rodologist until I checked out the Mudhole annual calendar winners and then realized I am too lazy/busy/blind to perform closed butt wraps, built around fifty rods, only the last ten or so were worth keeping, nice thing about building your rods is your own Karma that is in the Stick, and you can all ways strip it and start over, I have several Sticks from back in the Day on their third set of guides.
> 
> Mostly I fish for Drum cause it is a pure sport that rewards dedication, hard work, skill, a bit of athletic ability and timing, along with a bit of luck and good fortune thrown into the mix.
> 
> Plus I have some friends that I have fished with for decades that embody all these identified characteristics of Drum Fishermen, which happen to carry over nicely into the other facets of ones life, only non fishermen would bash this way of life and they are by far... the easiest to outcast/outfish....


 Rivercat Sometimes your stupidity amazes me


----------



## Drumdum

Garboman said:


> "This to me means I can hit it as hard as I can, at will, and not worry about if the rod can handle it"
> 
> Once upon a time I was at the Point on an evening when Sportcast had held a tournament earlier in the Day and I had watched them cast at Salvo Campgrounds and spoke with Mike Langston who identified the other competitors to me.
> 
> Anyway it was getting about dusk I was fishing in the lineup and it was time for the chewing to begin and I happened to by standing with my bait out next to two of the Tournament casters one fella was 6'7 or so and 300 plus pounds, he was new to casting and had poor form but he was big and he got it out there, way out there... the other fella was saying how much better casters they were intimating that the Bozo's like myself were to be awed....and how it gave them the advantage. The real big fellas bait was way out there and I hate to admit it but he was likely out past my bait. The other fella was not so big and his rod was more a tournament style British Rod and he was not out past my bait but he was the one talking about his advantage and Tournament prowess.......Short guy got bit by a bluefish and had to reel in.....Then he made a Hatteras cast with a lot of hip movement and with a deft flick back lashed and busted off the top three feet of that custom $600 British Stick....with that his "Tournament Advantage" was over.....he was dumbstruck at his loss.....a few moments later both the Big Fella and I (Bozo) bowed up to Drum and then Darkness fell....Advantages even out ....


 The only tournament caster I've seen that really was into 8nbait and REALLY caught fish was the "Hackster",that guy was relentless..Had the same attitude as the shorter guy you mentioned,and could back his mouth up by catch'n the h*ll out of some drum... There are some nowadays that fish good,but they don't have the attitude of the "Hackster" thank goodness,listening to that mouth and him backing it up with fish really s*cked...


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## Garboman

I spent a fair amount of time with Larry H when I lived in Nags Head in the later 1980's, Larry H built very nice rods and I still have one of his original ZZiplex rods that was cut down for Drum Fishing and he built for me with a Star butt wrap. The first time I ever saw anyone cast over 700' was at the Colington Airport with Larry, in those days he was the North American distance champion and the equipment was not yet advanced 12'6" rods and Abu Ultra Mag reels. Would enjoy seeing him on the end of the Tee..........especially if he is still just casting a SurfStick Even when the 1509's came on the scene every time I ran into Larry he was using a SurfStick and a 7000, he was not fishing as hard as he did in the 1980's which evened the odds for me some....


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## JAM

Being Garbo Bit I will Bite as well::

Closer to 50 then 40 and I actualy did live at the point and its suroundings for 89 days straight while I was waiting for my Camper Trailer to be delivered to Buxton. Lived out of my 91 Wrangler with my 2 Dogs and an easy up. Have been Building rods for 10 years Professionaly but do not consider myself or anyone I know a rodoligist, matter of fact first time I heard the word. Have not fished the Point since 2007, yet live one mile from it, the NPS BS has kept me away from it, and I mostly Fish out of a modified Clorox Bottle. With that said the tiralejo rod you speak of with the adjustable reel seat are pieces of GARBAGE, the moveable reel seat will move at the most un-opertune time, and can not withstand a fish of any size. 

I have never Bashed you and I don't take to Bashing Folks behind a Keyboard, if you would like to continue making SNIDE Comments, keep me out of them, or Grow a Set and come see me and tell me all your words of wisdom. I only try and help folks as I do not know or claim to know everything, just been doin it a while and like to help out where I can.. Do not know why ya got such a hard on for me, but if ya do, take it up in person, I am very easy to find.. Until then I sugest u STFU....

JAM


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## castingsfun

The ccp 6-10 throws a bunker head and an eight with no problem.
My bunker heads are cut with A 1/4 chunk attached. I could be
at around A pound of weight. Never weighed it, it could be A touch
more. If you feel like you need to beef up the rod, go custom with
some LC guides, it'll help. It's important to know after that rod
throws that massive amount of slop in the ocean. You'll also
be able to see A 2 # blue tapping. I couldn't believe what I seen.

This is a great thread.


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## sleepyhead

Warning side track.... "I mostly Fish out of a modified Clorox Bottle". That is a funnniee one.. Back with the thread.


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## smacks fanatic

JAM said:


> Being Garbo Bit I will Bite as well::
> 
> Closer to 50 then 40 and I actualy did live at the point and its suroundings for 89 days straight while I was waiting for my Camper Trailer to be delivered to Buxton. Lived out of my 91 Wrangler with my 2 Dogs and an easy up. Have been Building rods for 10 years Professionaly but do not consider myself or anyone I know a rodoligist, matter of fact first time I heard the word. Have not fished the Point since 2007, yet live one mile from it, the NPS BS has kept me away from it, and I mostly Fish out of a modified Clorox Bottle. With that said the tiralejo rod you speak of with the adjustable reel seat are pieces of GARBAGE, the moveable reel seat will move at the most un-opertune time, and can not withstand a fish of any size.
> 
> I have never Bashed you and I don't take to Bashing Folks behind a Keyboard, if you would like to continue making SNIDE Comments, keep me out of them, or Grow a Set and come see me and tell me all your words of wisdom. I only try and help folks as I do not know or claim to know everything, just been doin it a while and like to help out where I can.. Do not know why ya got such a hard on for me, but if ya do, take it up in person, I am very easy to find.. Until then I sugest u STFU....
> 
> JAM


whoa...are you really mad or joking?


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## sleepyhead

Another side track... Pass the popcorn.


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## JAM

*No I am not mad*

I don't get mad over I-Net Wonders, I just like to play with them.. JAM '


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## Hooked Up

finding the perfect heaver is trully an adventure............one that throws 8oz 135 yards loaded with bait but will throw 10 and still lets you feel the fight.....alot of trade off there.....and is the reason most of us own no less then 5 models at one time or another......cps 6-10.....century tip tornado sport....su 1569.....allstar 1509.....afwa beach.....and 1502 1506 1508 rainshadows and have tossed a om or two........average caster......if u are a true drummer the madness wont stop there.......hopin a hpr heaver is in the works......and worse with all that said you dont have to throw that far to still catch them


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## surffshr

85% of the time I throw 6oz
13% of the time I throw 8oz
2% of the time the wind blows paint off your truck.

One rod a hard to beat rod is the Diawia ballistic for a 6 and 8 rod. Shorten drop a little when using 8 and away she goes. Light weight, loads easy, has a good backbone, and won't break your back.


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## smacks fanatic

surffshr said:


> 85% of the time I throw 6oz
> 13% of the time I throw 8oz
> 2% of the time the wind blows paint off your truck.
> 
> One rod a hard to beat rod is the Diawia ballistic for a 6 and 8 rod. Shorten drop a little when using 8 and away she goes. Light weight, loads easy, has a good backbone, and won't break your back.


I do agree that is an amazing rod. My friend used it once(with approximatly 9 ounces combined bait and sinker) and he was throwing to hell and back. It was that far! The only negative thing about that rod is that it is EXPENSIVE.


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## surffshr

smacks fanatic said:


> I do agree that is an amazing rod. My friend used it once(with approximatly 9 ounces combined bait and sinker) and he was throwing to hell and back. It was that far! The only negative thing about that rod is that it is EXPENSIVE.


Amen to that


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## JAM

Ballistic is Bad Ass, I have one of the old silver tri-beams and the 35-405, there is not a rod on the planet that I can throw farther with a seven ounce weight.... But fighting the fish is another story... She fights well up to about a 47 48 inch drum, but will lock up if ya put too much heat on it, then the fish will beat you to death. My ole 1448 is the best fishting rod I have had in my hands, but the Ballistic will out throw it... Amen to the many Heavers, I have the tri beam (silver Daiwa) the 35-405 (red Daiwa) a lami 150, and a Wri Nitro, all star 1418..... traded the 1448 loomis for some truck work several years back, kickin myself still...LOVE them all for all different reasons... 

The Wri Nitro being my most versitle Rod, I am particular to Seven ounce weights and the WRI bombs it and fisght big fish well...Ain't used none of them since the Concent Decree, and most likely will sell them all off here shortly.... 
JAM


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## hifu

Was by Dillon's the other day and would have sworn I saw an old Breakaway 1418 blank left........


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## OceanMaster

> I spent a fair amount of time with Larry H when I lived in Nags Head in the later 1980's.


I also fished with Larry Hack from 1986 - 1989 on the Avon fishing pier. I still remember my first encounter with Larry...me a young Coast Guardsman from Texas hauling my pair of self-built Fenwicks with my red, black, yellow and orange diamond wraps with a pair of modified Squidder 140s (primary and backup) and a then new Newell 338J. It was my first time fishing Avon, Larry eyeballing me darn well knowing I wasn't local by the leaders and line I used. Being an old Texas surf fisherman from the early 70s, casting these old Fenwicks with a Texas setup (30lb Ande with 7 strand Sevlon leaders with 9/0 forge steel short shank tuna hooks LOL!), I stood out like a sore thumb. Larry watched me rig up and toss my first first cast, no bait, just a big blast to wet the line before rigging bait.....Larry let me rig and set before walking up and introducing himself. Smoking a cig, Larry simply said "you cast that old school stuff pretty darn good....you’re not from around here are you?" Once I replied yes sir Larry responded "You must be from Texas, you boys all rig up the same, let me show you how to rig for more distance....80lb shocker, 5 turns on the spool, drop the 30 and spool 20, build short 80lb mono fish finder leader "We don't want no GARBOs around here.....steel will have us all messed up when you hook one, we don't want them landed on the T, using mono, they bite off, re-rig and out it goes again." Well....the next weekend, I was rigged like Larry and the friendship started.

I remember one Saturday night very well. It was November, rough as snot with a ENE swell running 6 - 8ft, both of us casting 8 n bait Larry with his infamous 7000 modified with those brass frame bars and his two piece Fenwick Surf sticks casting pendulum style and me casting old school style hanging a lot of line over the back of the T and launching with a trot to the front rail to finish. I never could hit his numbers but anyone trying it old school wasn't hitting my numbers either LOL! We fished all night...with nothing but cold and wet with Larry wearing his Sponsored by Stren patched fishing jacket...smoking and waiting. Right around sunup we got into them....both of us hooked up with no one else around. We had tied the drop net off on the right side with it down ready to go but the waves were so big, it hung down many feet off the water as the swells and associated troughs blew through. I used my Newell for 8nbait and my fish was smaller, had my red to the net first but.....with both of us hooked up....the eventual outcome on my fish was doomed. We managed to somehow get her half into the net but we couldn't get our hands on the rope to bring her up, both of us with bent rods in our hands LOL! We kept looking to the top of the pier but no one….absolutely no one was there to help us. My red was around a mid 40lb fish and she popped the line on the 2nd or 3rd wave after lying over the net. It was odd looking down at this red hanging literally in midair on the net as the wave rolled by...off she swam. I put my rod down and Larry kept fighting away...he kept saying "I hope this isn't a GARBO?" Finally we see her....a nice red...we made the land and I worked her up over the rail with Larry helping me get her over the rail..DARN GOOD FISH and she hit the Avon scale at 56lbs. At that time the Texas State redfish record was only 53lbs. I simply told Larry "You just broke the Texas State record Larry congratulations!" LOL! He simply smiled and laughed a bit and said "Oh I've caught bigger!"

Darn good memories and I certainly miss fishing with him and some of the old crew at Avon. I probably fished with you a few times Garboman? I remember a fellow tossing a ABU 10000 a few times, that could hold his own with Larry at times....wondering now if that was you? There was another fellow there that threw a weird looking Australian made Alvey reel.....all of us kind of chuckled about him fishing that thing on the boards but he took it all in stride. 

I have to admit, I was so hard core then, I parked my truck at the point parking lot (no 4 wheel drive then - drove a Dodge Little Red Express truck with Texas plates and a Gilley's bumper sticker), and walked out to the point with my Fenwicks, a bait bucket and a backpack on my back. Every time I started my walk...someone would pick me up and haul me the rest of the way to the point LOL! I met one guy, can't remember his name but his trailer was full of rods and reels all lined up on the walls everywhere, we hit the point and then ran the Ferry over to Ocracoke when Noreasters had everything up North literally unfishable. We fished the sand one night, all night long, before calling it quits without one bump…all night long till sunup.

Now I'm home hitting Big Shell, Little Shell, and the 40s on South Padre Island Texas. Hope to return to OBX one day for another round of hardcore surf fishing.

Excuse the long winded thread response....just found the site and this is my first post...been wanting to talk about this experience in the hope to find out what happened to Larry and maybe rekindle enough memories that some of the others I fished with at Avon would remember.

The old Newell 338 and I got spooled one night. I had one other fellow there watching.....we were catching puppy drum on the small rods and I was the only one with long rods on then T. I hooked a Garbo that never knew it was hooked after it picked up the bait. It simply kept swimming due east till I managed to get to about half spool. The fellow was standing with the drop net watching...waiting to help. I managed to work in about 20 yards of line before Garbo realized something was wrong and kicked the last half of my spool into absolute afterburner swimming and pulling line out so fast...it was unbelievable! That fellow simply dropped the net down on the boards and simply said "This ain't gonna do us no good.....if you can turn em.....I'll go to my truck and get the shotgun to finish it off!" LMAO!!!!! Needless to say....I got spooled BIG TIME!


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## Tommy

Great story.

I never knew Larry but they say he could flat out chunk one.

Tommy



OceanMaster said:


> I also fished with Larry Hack from 1986 - 1989 on the Avon fishing pier. I still remember my first encounter with Larry...me a young Coast Guardsman from Texas hauling my pair of self-built Fenwicks with my red, black, yellow and orange diamond wraps with a pair of modified Squidder 140s (primary and backup) and a then new Newell 338J. It was my first time fishing Avon, Larry eyeballing me darn well knowing I wasn't local by the leaders and line I used. Being an old Texas surf fisherman from the early 70s, casting these old Fenwicks with a Texas setup (30lb Ande with 7 strand Sevlon leaders with 9/0 forge steel short shank tuna hooks LOL!), I stood out like a sore thumb. Larry watched me rig up and toss my first first cast, no bait, just a big blast to wet the line before rigging bait.....Larry let me rig and set before walking up and introducing himself. Smoking a cig, Larry simply said "you cast that old school stuff pretty darn good....you’re not from around here are you?" Once I replied yes sir Larry responded "You must be from Texas, you boys all rig up the same, let me show you how to rig for more distance....80lb shocker, 5 turns on the spool, drop the 30 and spool 20, build short 80lb mono fish finder leader "We don't want no GARBOs around here.....steel will have us all messed up when you hook one, we don't want them landed on the T, using mono, they bite off, re-rig and out it goes again." Well....the next weekend, I was rigged like Larry and the friendship started.
> 
> I remember one Saturday night very well. It was November, rough as snot with a ENE swell running 6 - 8ft, both of us casting 8 n bait Larry with his infamous 7000 modified with those brass frame bars and his two piece Fenwick Surf sticks casting pendulum style and me casting old school style hanging a lot of line over the back of the T and launching with a trot to the front rail to finish. I never could hit his numbers but anyone trying it old school wasn't hitting my numbers either LOL! We fished all night...with nothing but cold and wet with Larry wearing his Sponsored by Stren patched fishing jacket...smoking and waiting. Right around sunup we got into them....both of us hooked up with no one else around. We had tied the drop net off on the right side with it down ready to go but the waves were so big, it hung down many feet off the water as the swells and associated troughs blew through. I used my Newell for 8nbait and my fish was smaller, had my red to the net first but.....with both of us hooked up....the eventual outcome on my fish was doomed. We managed to somehow get her half into the net but we couldn't get our hands on the rope to bring her up, both of us with bent rods in our hands LOL! We kept looking to the top of the pier but no one….absolutely no one was there to help us. My red was around a mid 40lb fish and she popped the line on the 2nd or 3rd wave after lying over the net. It was odd looking down at this red hanging literally in midair on the net as the wave rolled by...off she swam. I put my rod down and Larry kept fighting away...he kept saying "I hope this isn't a GARBO?" Finally we see her....a nice red...we made the land and I worked her up over the rail with Larry helping me get her over the rail..DARN GOOD FISH and she hit the Avon scale at 56lbs. At that time the Texas State redfish record was only 53lbs. I simply told Larry "You just broke the Texas State record Larry congratulations!" LOL! He simply smiled and laughed a bit and said "Oh I've caught bigger!"
> 
> Darn good memories and I certainly miss fishing with him and some of the old crew at Avon. I probably fished with you a few times Garboman? I remember a fellow tossing a ABU 10000 a few times, that could hold his own with Larry at times....wondering now if that was you? There was another fellow there that threw a weird looking Australian made Alvey reel.....all of us kind of chuckled about him fishing that thing on the boards but he took it all in stride.
> 
> I have to admit, I was so hard core then, I parked my truck at the point parking lot (no 4 wheel drive then - drove a Dodge Little Red Express truck with Texas plates and a Gilley's bumper sticker), and walked out to the point with my Fenwicks, a bait bucket and a backpack on my back. Every time I started my walk...someone would pick me up and haul me the rest of the way to the point LOL! I met one guy, can't remember his name but his trailer was full of rods and reels all lined up on the walls everywhere, we hit the point and then ran the Ferry over to Ocracoke when Noreasters had everything up North literally unfishable. We fished the sand one night, all night long, before calling it quits without one bump…all night long till sunup.
> 
> Now I'm home hitting Big Shell, Little Shell, and the 40s on South Padre Island Texas. Hope to return to OBX one day for another round of hardcore surf fishing.
> 
> Excuse the long winded thread response....just found the site and this is my first post...been wanting to talk about this experience in the hope to find out what happened to Larry and maybe rekindle enough memories that some of the others I fished with at Avon would remember.
> 
> The old Newell 338 and I got spooled one night. I had one other fellow there watching.....we were catching puppy drum on the small rods and I was the only one with long rods on then T. I hooked a Garbo that never knew it was hooked after it picked up the bait. It simply kept swimming due east till I managed to get to about half spool. The fellow was standing with the drop net watching...waiting to help. I managed to work in about 20 yards of line before Garbo realized something was wrong and kicked the last half of my spool into absolute afterburner swimming and pulling line out so fast...it was unbelievable! That fellow simply dropped the net down on the boards and simply said "This ain't gonna do us no good.....if you can turn em.....I'll go to my truck and get the shotgun to finish it off!" LMAO!!!!! Needless to say....I got spooled BIG TIME!


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## Drumdum

Tommy said:


> Great story.
> 
> I never knew Larry but they say he could flat out chunk one.
> 
> Tommy


 Tommy,I fished with him for most all the years he lived in this area.. No doubt in my mind,with 8nbait the best distance man that I've seen pier fishing on a consistant basis.. As a distance caster,he was the best "true FHB" on the planks in his days here.... He flat out knew how ta smack talk too..  jmo

Can remember one day on Avon there was a school of fatback about 100plus off the end.. Had a heavy swell that day with a clean break,not too far from where the fatback were schooled up.. The break was 6 to 8' and just inside the school.. Larry was chucking that bigstick that Garbo was talking about,right into the school.. It was driving EVERYONE NUTS,because he was catching on about every cast!! With the swell you had to throw 10,but if you could chuck like Larry 8 would get over the top and stay put long enough for a bite... I've fished the piers for over 30yrs and had never seen folks just lay thier rods down and watch in frustration,but most did that day.. I casted and casted with 10 and could never even get close.. I finally put on an 8,knowing I'd get rolled back by the swell,and finally got one to the edge of the school that Hack was throwing in the middle of...(the school of fatback probably got a few feet closer  ) When the bait hit,looked at Larry and said "reackon that one is gonna get bit before it rolls back??"... He gave that funky grin he used to give and said "maybe one will sniff it out",with the sarcasim he was so famous for.. Got lucky that day and caught one,while "the TRUE FHB" caught 6....


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## Hudak

(really enjoying the stories)


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## Garboman

"Excuse the long winded thread response....just found the site and this is my first post...been wanting to talk about this experience in the hope to find out what happened to Larry"

Larry re-married and moved to Ohio

Last Time I spoke with Larry, he was at the Point Spring of 2002, he was fishing one of his Surfsticks and a 7000 spooled with Micro-dynema and he was upset about the crowds.......

No one I know has seen him since he moved off the Beach.


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## OceanMaster

Thanks Garboman - appreciate the update!

Sure hope Larry can at least fish for landlocked salmon on Lake Erie.......not the same though. Been there...done that on Lake Michigan one fall....fun but it ain't the sandy strand along the Cape.


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