# Making Fishing Leaders



## twcrawford

Hey guys, I need your help. I'm tired of store brought crap fishing leaders that tangle after 2 casts. I'm ready to start making my own leaders. Can someone help me make a grocery list of what I'll need? 

Type of Fishing:

Freshwater/Saltwater bottom fishing.

I'd like to look at fishing above the bottom as well, but I think that's another thread right? 

Thanks in advance for any help you can lend.

TW


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## Croaker D

Wasup TW haven't seen you in a while! But holla at kmw, when i talked to him at spsp he had some sweet fishfinder rigs that he had made up, in fact he gave me one that im gonna mimic myself. Even though they are ff rigs you can use the same principles for bottom high/low rigs! 



tight lines...


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## markedwards

i think KMW is using clipped down pulley rigs. if so you can google it and get an idea on what to do.


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## twcrawford

http://www.sea-fishing-rigs.co.uk/beach-saltwater-sea-fishing-rigs.html

Thanks D and Mark.

Is this less tangle prone? Anyone using these type of rigs?


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## bloodworm

I prefer a spool of 30 or 50 lb test 
cut off 3ft of line tie a surgeons knot at the bottom to hold the sinker then tie a dropper loop knot above the sinker and tie a barrel swivel at the top w a palomar knot.
Learn these knots first though


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## twcrawford

bloodworm said:


> I prefer a spool of 30 or 50 lb test
> cut off 3ft of line tie a surgeons knot at the bottom to hold the sinker then tie a dropper loop knot above the sinker and tie a barrel swivel at the top w a palomar knot.
> Learn these knots first though


Check those setups Bloodworm ^^^^^


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## markedwards

twcrawford said:


> http://www.sea-fishing-rigs.co.uk/beach-saltwater-sea-fishing-rigs.html
> 
> Thanks D and Mark.
> 
> Is this less tangle prone? Anyone using these type of rigs?


yes as long as you use leader material instead of line.


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## Kwesi W.

I use them all.. I'm going to try and get some pictures up tonight.. Nothing professional but they work for me..


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## Kwesi W.

Ok here is my version of the FF Rig... I use this type of rig when Im fishing with spinning reels (with Braid) and want to use big bait... As you can see this design gives you the option to swap out hook leaders.. Swivels, Rig Material and Coastal snaps are all 80lb test...










then I make hook leaders different types and style hooks to suit any type of fishing i'm doing..


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## Kwesi W.

This is a rig (Single Dropper ) I used on Saturday.. As u can see by the hooked it's been worked pretty good...


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## Kwesi W.

This rig (Double Dropper) is made from Sufix Rig material which is very soft so i tie knots and not crimp... it's rated at 50lb test so I only use it when I'm using 4oz of less.


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## bloodworm

twcrawford said:


> Check those setups Bloodworm ^^^^^


yeah i meant to say a surgeons end loop knot


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## Kwesi W.

When Distance (130yds plus) is Key then the Pulley Clip Down rig is the Ticket. I use the Gemini Splashdown sinker because it's the best sinker I've found for the OTG cast. Most other bait clips will come undone mid flight. 

Gemini Sinker









Here is the Pulley Rig minus the hook leader..









Total Rig









Locked up and ready to go!


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## twcrawford

Kmw your the man. Thank for the tips and the pics sir.


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## Kwesi W.

No Problem..

Each one Teach one!


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## Hysteresis

KMW's sinker looks like this thing, the Solar Probe Plus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_Probe_Plus

I am just a small potato among all the scientists and engineers working hard to launch it near the sun (8.5 solar radii) in the year of 2015. We sure can use your help if you can cast that far, but it would not be made of lead since it will melt long before it can get close to the orbit near the sun (1400-1700 Celsius).


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## Kwesi W.

http://www.gemini-tackle.co.uk/listings.asp?id=233


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## Hysteresis

kmw21230 said:


> http://www.gemini-tackle.co.uk/listings.asp?id=233


It looks like cosmetic bling-bling site with foreign currency exchange confusions to me. I still have so much to learn. Thank you.


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## twcrawford

markedwards said:


> yes as long as you use leader material instead of line.


Flourocarbon? What test?


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## markedwards

For the rig body at least 50lb test and hook leader 20lb test minimum.


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## twcrawford

markedwards said:


> For the rig body at least 50lb test and hook leader 20lb test minimum.


Thanks Mark


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## surfnsam

for simple t&B rigs jans netcraft has the arms and ive been using AMF red 7 strand nylon coated wire in 40#. some crimps and beads and a duolock or breakaway fast clip for the sinker. i got tired of tangled mono rigs i tied and they always seemed to twist up and tangle when casting their ok on my kayak but when casting in the surf i like the wire arms because they are free spinning. i use 20# fluro for leader to hook


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## twcrawford

surfnsam said:


> for simple t&B rigs jans netcraft has the arms and ive been using AMF red 7 strand nylon coated wire in 40#. some crimps and beads and a duolock or breakaway fast clip for the sinker. i got tired of tangled mono rigs i tied and they always seemed to twist up and tangle when casting their ok on my kayak but when casting in the surf i like the wire arms because they are free spinning. i use 20# fluro for leader to hook


Do you think wire spooks the fish? 

KMW inspired me! I've ordered some 60# flouro, barrels, cast locks, sleeves and a crimping tool also a 20# flouro for the hooks and some Owner circles. I should have them by Thursday. I'll be posting my rigs for critiques. How's that sound? I did see some spreaders...hope I can do without them to start.


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## markedwards

twcrawford said:


> Do you think wire spooks the fish?
> 
> KMW inspired me! I've ordered some 60# flouro, barrels, cast locks, sleeves and a crimping tool also a 20# flouro for the hooks and some Owner circles. I should have them by Thursday. I'll be posting my rigs for critiques. How's that sound? I did see some spreaders...hope I can do without them to start.


surfnsam and twcrawford look at the link KMW posted and take a close look at the 2 hook flapper. its a top n bottom rig with trapped swivels on the rig body this lets your hook rotate in 2 different directions. also the swivels are smaller than the wire arms and can help when the fish get leader/hardware shy.


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## Kwesi W.

Some will say yes, but I personally have not had any issues with wire leaders spooking anything.... 

Im glad I inspired you.. It's a great feeling to catch a personal best on a rig you made..... 




twcrawford said:


> Do you think wire spooks the fish?
> 
> KMW inspired me! I've ordered some 60# flouro, barrels, cast locks, sleeves and a crimping tool also a 20# flouro for the hooks and some Owner circles. I should have them by Thursday. I'll be posting my rigs for critiques. How's that sound? I did see some spreaders...hope I can do without them to start.


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## Kwesi W.

These are really good for areas where you have lots of rocks. When you have a fish on it pulls the sinker off the ground so it won't get snagged..


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## tacklemake

Here is some pic's............woody


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## Croaker D

TW I told you kmw made up rigs were neat!


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## MetroMan

kmw (or anyone that know)

How do you know which size crimps to use for say...50lb leader, or 80lb leader, etc. Do you just size them by sight, using the fitting that provides the closest fit prior to crimping? 

I'm impressed and inspired...


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## Kwesi W.

they will say on the package.. the ones I use are sold on ebay as "Crimps for 80lb test"

example

http://www.basspro.com/Offshore-Angler&153;-Mini-Double-Sleeves/product/8565/-582569


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## MetroMan

Gotcha. Thanks!


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## scavengerj

Also Metro, make sure to get the crimps for the type of line you are using...there are two types, one for mono and one for steel. Also be sure to get the right crimping tool for the crimps you have. There are also two types of crimping tools.


DMS #525
AMSA #1102
OBPA


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## MetroMan

kmw21230 said:


> Ok here is my version of the FF Rig... I use this type of rig when Im fishing with spinning reels (with Braid) and want to use big bait... As you can see this design gives you the option to swap out hook leaders.. Swivels, Rig Material and Coastal snaps are all 80lb test...


That clip where your hook leader attaches to the rig...

What is the name of that? It looks like a bobby pin. At first glace I think "can't the swivel slide off somehow?"

But am I right in assuming the pressure on the fish keeps the swivel down at the bottom of that clip?


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## Croaker D

Metro Man them clips are called genie clips, haven't found any in the u.s. but very very popular in the uk. go to ebay uk and they have various styles and types and believe it or not are very strong!


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## Kwesi W.

MetroMan said:


> That clip where your hook leader attaches to the rig...
> 
> What is the name of that? It looks like a bobby pin. At first glace I think "can't the swivel slide off somehow?"
> 
> But am I right in assuming the pressure on the fish keeps the swivel down at the bottom of that clip?


I have a friend in the UK that sends them to me, but ebay would be a good source too... I got these on Monday... Maybe you should hold off on ordering them.. I'll give you a dozen of so for you to play with... If you like them you can order them in bulk.. these are 80lb clips every once in awhile will need to be replaced but they hold up well overall.


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## MetroMan

Royal Mail...nice. 

Thanks for the info guys. Why would you use this over a standard snap swivel? In your FF rig, why would you not use this genie clip for the sinker as well?

I see the dinnerence in form, but the function appears to be the same as the ole snap swivel.


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## MetroMan

And by "dinnerence", I mean "difference". Drugs are bad...mmkay


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## transamsam98

for those of you going for distance and fishing from piers may I recommend a shock leader knot with a drop loop for your sinker and hooks. my terminology is most likely wrong but it works great and allows a big more ignorance when landing fish.


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## surfnsam

i havent had a problem with wire leader and in red may attract some fish. be careful crimping the sleeves on the mono leader you can cut or nick it and it will fail on a big fish. 

i like those genie clips the breakaway fast links are nice also. for a snaggy place like spsp i like to use small duo lock snaps, they break off when snagged.

i like that pulley rig, going to watch that video a couple times and tie one up. 

weather looks like crap this weekend but thats good for fishing plus a new moon woohoo


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## Kwesi W.

Good question..

The snap swivels are more $$$$, and I get more use with the Genie Clips. I tie the clips to the end of my shockleader (snap swivels dont fit through the guides), as well as make rigs with them.. They make hot swapping your tackle very easy.




MetroMan said:


> Royal Mail...nice.
> 
> Thanks for the info guys. Why would you use this over a standard snap swivel? In your FF rig, why would you not use this genie clip for the sinker as well?
> 
> I see the dinnerence in form, but the function appears to be the same as the ole snap swivel.


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## Kwesi W.

Next time I see you I'll give you one of mine... Mine are just my version on them, it's not like mine are the standard. 



surfnsam said:


> i havent had a problem with wire leader and in red may attract some fish. be careful crimping the sleeves on the mono leader you can cut or nick it and it will fail on a big fish.
> 
> i like those genie clips the breakaway fast links are nice also. for a snaggy place like spsp i like to use small duo lock snaps, they break off when snagged.
> 
> i like that pulley rig, going to watch that video a couple times and tie one up.
> 
> weather looks like crap this weekend but thats good for fishing plus a new moon woohoo


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## Andre

Hey kid
Do you remember this pretty Lil guy


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## Kwesi W.

That's at PLO last year... LOL That was one of my earlier creations... I've dropped the colorful beads since them, but I remember that rig catching fish..


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## Big Rad

I'd like to give this tip to those who might need it....
When snelling your hooks it is good to keep in mind the pound test of that. A hook snelled with 10lb test attached to 30lb power pro makes the hook snell the failure point. Learned this from experience.........Think about this when you buy the pre-snelled packs of hooks off the shelf.
AS KMW said it is a wonderful thing to catch a nice fish on a rig you tied yourself. It is also a good lesson when you lose one....


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## twcrawford




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## surfnsam

found some of my breakaway impact shields, this looks like a good weekend to tie some pulley rigs while sitting in my truck waiting for a bell to go off


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## markedwards

i bumped this one to see how you guys are doing with your rigs.


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## MetroMan

I got a few two hook flapper rigs made with different color beads. I also got a few fish finder rigs made as well. 60lb mono leader material, 20 lb flouro for the hooks. I didn't want to go overboard making a bunch of leaders. They're easy to make...if I find myself in need while fishing, I'll make some then and there. 

It literally takes less than two minutes to make the flapper (top/bottom) rig. I hope it works out for me. I'll give my stuff a try this coming Saturday.


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## twcrawford

markedwards said:


> i bumped this one to see how you guys are doing with your rigs.


 I fished the point at Ft Washington Park and ended up snagged about a hundred times, both with my homemade rigs and the store brought variety. I'll have to try again somewhere without so many boulders in the water. Folks there warned me. The point is painful to the bottom fisher, they mostly bass fish at that spot. It may have been less troublesome if thenfish were biting. Its harder to get hung up when your hooks attached to the lip of a fish instead of a branch or some hydrilla lol.

Hmmm, I did notice hook breakoffs. I used 20lb test on the hooks and 50 on my leaders, so I guess that makes sense. I snelled my hooks, but probably could've tied stronger knots.


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## markedwards

metroman- i'm glad to see you worked your crimp issues. and i'm guessing you're using beads on the hook leaders instead of the rig body.

twcrawford- try this knot http://www.animatedknots.com/snell/index.php


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## MetroMan

I still need to get smaller crimps. The ones I have only work when the line (60lb test) is doubled thru the sleeve. I forget what size crimps I got, but they are like 40-80 or something like that. By reading the pack, I thought they would be ok for either single or double passage. I need smaller ones that will cinch down on the single strand to stop stuff from sliding. Overhand knots are working fine for this purpose temporarily though.

I only have the beads on the rig body. For the flapper rigs, the beads are at the swivels. For the fish finder rigs, the beads are on each side of the sinker slide.


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## Kwesi W.

you may want to like at Double Barrell Sleves..


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## MetroMan

10-4


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## Kwesi W.

Question for Mark..


What's the advantages with the Flapper if compared to the Double Dropper Rig...?? Here's how I see it.. The Double dropper has less moving parts which means less of a chance of having something fail... Plus when using crimps to hold beads and swivels you risk the chance of over crimping and damaging your line, or not crimping with enough force and having your bead\hook leader slid down the rig during a hard cast.. I cant tell you how many times I had the bead go over the crimp.....


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## Kwesi W.

MetroMan said:


> 10-4


The the beginning of your rig and the end... that is....


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## MetroMan

kmw21230 said:


> The the beginning of your rig and the end... that is....


Gotcha. My current crimps have been working well thus far at the two ends though. I'll show you on Saturday


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## markedwards

kmw21230 said:


> Question for Mark..
> 
> 
> What's the advantages with the Flapper if compared to the Double Dropper Rig...?? Here's how I see it.. The Double dropper has less moving parts which means less of a chance of having something fail... Plus when using crimps to hold beads and swivels you risk the chance of over crimping and damaging your line, or not crimping with enough force and having your bead\hook leader slid down the rig during a hard cast.. I cant tell you how many times I had the bead go over the crimp.....


i answered this in whole in your email. but if your bead and hook swivel are sliding over your crimp maybe the hole the in bead is bigger than your crimp. know what i mean?


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## surfnsam

snelled a couple chs but i think the palomar is a better knot because it doubles the line through the hook eye and simple to tie, i even double the line when making an improved chinch knot. fingers were too cold sat. morning for rig making


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