# casting break offs, etc.



## NJbruce (Mar 30, 2018)

Hi Casters,

Where I'm fishing its poor at best so enjoying a long cast is part of my fun. I use good spinning (fixed spool) reels and started conventional (multipliers) after a 20 year lay off. I had boats. I bought a rod last season and started practice. Agility II, 13'6" shakespeare from UK. When I let it really go I have break offs just after the FG not and away goes 150 gram fondera roma witith 20 feet of seaguar. I've never found the leads. I need glitter leader. I've discovered the cause as the line biting into itself. I use 20 or 25 pound braid, good stuff too. 40 or 50 pound leader. 
I will have to either switch to level wind or learn a tedious method of X winding?
I build my reels and they spin easily and are quieter than the videos I watch. Bearings I'm guessing.
Is there a level wind that will give me 500 to 700 feet? I can't buy a custom rod until I solve this.
My reels are diawa tuned millionaire and regular millionaire, seigler sm with custom magged end plate (PMR) and the penn 525 i build and tune. 
Thanks for any tips.


----------



## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

Spider hitch to a Bristol is what I use on all my conventionals, but I don't use braid on them either. Spinning gear a loop knot will break off slapping guides from my experience, I don't use spinners with shock leader anymore. When I did, the most reliable but worst casting knot I had was a uni to uni


----------



## Don B (Jul 28, 2001)

Wow, so many questions!

Agility II, 13'6" Shakespeare: rated at 5 to 6 ounces. Often the rating relates to fishing and not tournament conditions. 4 to 5 ounces may be more appropriate for tournament use.

"I have break offs just after the FG not and away goes 150 gram fondera roma witith 20 feet of Seaguar." "40 or 50 pound leader."

Consider using about 80# leader. Here's a link to a non-commercial site with casting rules: https://www.sportcast-usa.org/index.php?topic=7.0 
About 10 turns of the shockleader around the spool works best for me.

" I need glitter leader." On eBay, you can find plastic glasses for viewing red laser beams. About $5. They make blaze orange leaders stand out as white on the field.

"Is there a level wind that will give me 500 to 700 feet? " Yes/No/Maybe

I have cast an Omoto synchronous level-wind 165 yards a week before surgery and I did not want to stress an body parts. However, due to the complaint coming from the line guide, it may not be able to increase the distance very much.

On older style ABU there were 2 style level wind reels that were non-synchronous. On one, the line guide would detach and follow the line feed from the spool. On the other type, the line guide stayed in one position while the spool was turning.

A Daiwa LP T-Wing (TW) might be helpful. In this system, the guide mechanism moves vertically out of the way of the line during the cast.

My recommendation: Put 20 pound main line mono on the 525 along with 80# low stretch Hi Viz Orange shock leader. Use a 125 gram lead and you should be good to start working on form. Slowly start to change one thing at a time and learn what works best. If you should need stronger magnets, they can be temporarily placed under/behind your existing magnets.


----------



## NH Paul (Sep 7, 2017)

On the break-offs, a 20 foot leader on a 13.5 foot rod does not sound long enough. You should have at least 6 turns of leader around the reel. If your drop is any more than about four feet then the leader is too short. 

Most heavers use 17 fo 20 lb mono main line and 50 - 80 lb mono leaders. The thin 20 - 25 braid combined with 40-50 lb leader sounds like a good combo to cut the line. Try using 17 lb mono main with 60 lb mono leader long enough to wrap around the reel 6-10 times with your drop extended.


----------



## Guest (Apr 25, 2018)

NJbruce said:


> I will have to either switch to level wind or learn a tedious method of X winding?
> 
> Thanks for any tips.


Or you could always switch to Mono.


----------



## NJbruce (Mar 30, 2018)

thank you all much. my magnets are custom, no problems with that, its the slick line digging into the spool after the leader passes then a jerk and pop. I looked for 60-80 orange blaze and only found 2000 yard spools. cost as much as a reel. 20 mono no problem. I found a abu claiming 900 feet, level wind. Unmagged. thats an educated thumb reel for sure. would love to see it backed up.
I know a guy who builds bling abu, akios so i know they can run into big bucks. 
I'll try the mono for casting and then make adjustments.
When i watch casting competions i see green line and it doesnt look coiled so i assumed it was braid. I bought 3 spools of 1000 yard braid, I'll use it as backing.
Thanks again, any more tips I will appreciate them.


----------



## Don B (Jul 28, 2001)

"I looked for 60-80 orange blaze and only found 2000 yard spools."

I used a poor choice of words. 
http://gardnertackle.co.uk/product/sure-shock/
It's very common. This company uses the terms Neon Orange and Neon Yellow. 150 meter ring spools. It can be purchased from more common sources.

Paul brings up an important point about shock leader length. 20 feet may be short. If your handle length, butt to center of reel is 34 inches, the leaves about 10.5 feet. Reel to tiptop and back is 21 feet. Add 4 to 5 feet for the turns around the spool and another foot for redoing knots. That makes 26 to 27 feet if you cast with the lead at the reel position. If you cast with the lead higher, perhaps next to the butt ring, you can subtract around 3 feet.

There are many factors that impact reel control:
Centrifugal brakes
Magnetic control
Oil Viscosity
Line Diameter
Amount of Line (How full the spool is)
Shock leader stretch
Weather conditions

There are surely more.


----------



## NJbruce (Mar 30, 2018)

yes, i typo the leader length, it was two rod lengths and 5 wraps, closer to 30 feet. i only had half a rod length out, about 20 feet, on the cast when it popped. i can stop at a big tackle shop and get 60 feet of of leader. tackle direct or bass pro is on my way to the beach. I buy quite a bit of my supplies from UK so i'll search UK ebay and tackle shops., thank you much. I ordered green 20 lb low memory mono.
if I continue to break, I'll cut down on the spinach. When I played tennis I crushed serves, smoked fastballs as a pitcher. I just might be loading the rod too fast and stopping it too abruptly. I have snapped off rods and spun off tips on a St. Croix. Now I try to go smooth start and power the finish. I will get a reel with mag and cetrifugal brakes. I just listed my sweet 525magT on ebay and have only a brand new 2018 left. (i bought all the parts from penn parts and am making a video of its construction.)


----------



## Don B (Jul 28, 2001)

"I will get a reel with mag and cetrifugal brakes."
Some people use centrifugal brakes, others do not. Then may be helpful during your learning process.


----------



## NJbruce (Mar 30, 2018)

Don, 
I watch PMR build ciustom reels for specific needs and he adds centrifugal brakes and magged controls with ball bearing everthing. I can do it to an abu or akios. 
I changed the search on amazon and sure shock Gardner leader pops up neon orange; ordered. Seaguar is nearly a dollar a foot, no color.
I put my penn for sale, its new and last of my own reels. I have an abu coming, couldnt get anywhere with omoto so when i get the bugs out i'll try again. You and the others help is fantastic, never thought mono may be a soultion to long casts. I'll post a update when I get some progress. 
I know I do cast hard, when braid came out i went right to it on aspinner, my hand were entirely callused from tennis. The braid would have taken off my finger tip if it wasnt for the calluses. Like a giant paper cut in salt water. Two new knees ended my tournament tennis, trying for casting now, ha ha. 30 years of muscle memory and torsion put lots of energy into the cast. relearning isnt easy for me. Thanks again everyone, you've put me in the right direction.

For anyone interested, Fonderia Roma is an italian foundry that makes more leads than you can imagine. ebay.it wont ship and the foundry won't sell, so i go through tsouros marine in greece to get the leads. mig 21 is an amazing fishing lead, aerodynamic and gains flight, longest caster they make. C bomb is the course practice lead. i used breakaway prior and now leads are close to extinct in NJ. Ill take some shots of the mig 21, its very unique. one reason I need to fix the break offs. They are expensive after all the shipping. Cant afford to feed the ocean expensive tackle.
Thought id share something in return for the help you've given me. Thank you all.


----------

