# Daiwa Tournament SS2600 vs. Shimano Sustain 5000FE (2008 Version)



## dsurf

How would the renoun, much acclaimed Daiwa SS2600 fair in a distance contest with the newly designed Shimano Sustain 5000FE? The Daiwa has been on the market many years and has a devoted following, myself included. The Shimano Sustain FE was newly designed this year.......

*Specs:*
Daiwa:
13.7 oz
10lb-270 yds
Max Drag 17.6 lb
4.6 gear ratio
29.9" line retrieve
Spool width (or height), top to bottom-26mm, hence the SS2600.

Shimano:
13.9 oz (although the box says 13.6 oz)..isn't it odd how often the literature (hard copy) does not sync up with the web-site information....I've found this to be true of most manufacturers, including both Daiwa and Shimano.
10lb-240 yds
Max drag 25 lb
5.7 hear ratio
37" line retrieve
Spool width (or height), top to bottom-21mm.

Could the Shimano's aero wrap and line propulsion system offsite any distance advantage of Daiwa's 26mm spool (as compared to 21mm for the Shimano)?

*Setup:*
Rod = Daiwa Hatteras SZ 30-405 custom built with low riders, 2-4 oz rod, 13'3".

Sinker was 2 oz pyramid (wanted to simulate the 2 oz sting silver popular with Spanish).

Hatteras cast used in all cases.

All distances measured with a range finder.

The emphasis is not on the distance, but the comparison........

Line (not apples to apples)...the Daiwa had 20lb Power Pro while the Shimano had 15 lb Power Pro......not the best comparison test but the best I could manage under the circumstances. Both had 50lb PP casting leader. Never, repeat never, did I have any problems with the Power Pro......performed flawlessly.

Hot Carolina day (90 deg) with light wind crossing and at back.

To get to the chase....had approx 10 casts with each reel. They were neck and neck.....never more than 3-4 yards difference. The max distance with the Daiwa was 140 yds, max with the Shimano was 141 yds.

*Observations:*
Without question the time tested Daiwa performed very well.......the long cast 26mm spool deserves much of the credit. It's without question, in my mind, the best performer in it's weight class for the money. However, it's wobbly, not as good a drag as the Shimano, and certainly not as smooth as the Shimano.....but if distance/costs are high on your list, it will get the job done very well.

The Shimano Sustain Fe is a sight to behold and to HOLD....one more smooth performer. And I must say, there is more to their Line Management/Propulsion system than marketing ploy\affect.....I'm convinced the areo wrap combined with the line propulsion system (primarily the lip design) contributed to and offset the extra 5mm spool width/height of the Daiwa). This is consistent with my test results of the Shimano Aero Technium vs the Daiwa Basia.....where I attribute the consistent extra distance by the Shimano directly to their Aero wrap system....No, I don't own stock in either company, but consistent test results are my barometer and difficult to argue......

You could argue that the 20lb line on the Daiwa held it back a bit....and probably true..........perhaps a yard or two????

Certainly one advantage of the 20 lb line was that it did not dig into the spool like the 15 lb......this was a problem for me as my sinker would hang in the grass....never did it dig with the 20lb line.....

*Note:* I would expect to get the same distance results with the 2008 Shimano Stradic FI.....it's same as Sustain with exception of bearings, weight, and color design.

I welcome any comments, suggestions, contradictions....etc.


----------



## AtlantaKing

Daiwa's biggest strategic mistake in their new gear is not basing the newer reels on the Tournament SS. Imagine how sweet a updated Tournament SS would be like: aluminum frame and rotor, IAR, a couple more high-grade bearings and updated drags. 

Hey, dsurf, is the new Sustain still made in Japan, or did they move production to Malaysia?


----------



## dsurf

*Comparison*

Ak, nope, these are made in Malaysia. I just cannot justify spending $900+ to get the Stella SW............Japan made.


----------



## Newsjeff

Nice comparison.

I think you nailed it. 

That's purdy much my thoughts on both the SS and the Stradic FI, too.

The Daiwa is more like a workhorse truck. 

And the Shimano a smooth sportscar. 

Both get the job done well. The Shimano just does it on a more refined level. 

Now if Shimano just used a long-cast spool ... .

And Diawa updated the SS ... .


----------



## HellRhaY

again, another nice experiment. 
Dsurf, actually the new stella SW '08 is at around $790. 

The JDM stella has the same spool design as the Biomaster and the new '08 twinpower. I think (thru gossip and chatter on the japanese front) Japan Shimano is coming out with a new twinpower in the 5k size and up which will incorporate the new propulsion line management system later this year aound september or october(don't quote me on that).

here's a close up of the line coming off the spools; one with the propulsion line management and the other without.









shimano has move production to Malaysia. All models except the stella. Also in the Japanese market.


----------



## D-22

Excellent post and great comparison man!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to share my thoughts on the '08 stella, and on some more reasonably priced JDM alternatives as well.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In my opinion there really is no other offshore/inshore spinning reel that compares to '08 stella SW. The hype is true. Once you fish these reels you will do whatever it takes to own another one. Sh*t man I'm trying to complete the set. For me it's about the reel I truly desire, and not settling for less. I'm not a wealthy guy, but I'm not living in poverty either. Hard work and buying at the right time is worth the wait for me now. Rather than buying something on a whim without research, like I've done in the past. 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The twinpower HG/PG is a great reel. I kept hearing about how similar it performed to stella FA, and was eager to compare the reels with a local tarpon guide here who swears by them. When I finally fished the 8000's on the same charter, there was indeed a minimal difference in the way they performed. The drag was slightly smoother on the FA.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The stella FA is a dinosaur though, and it disgusts me they still list for what they do here. If I needed an inshore reel and didn't want to break the bank on the '08 stella 5000XG SW, especially for the surf, I would purchase twinpower 5000 HG/PG.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Or maybe the newest U.S. daiwa TDA(3500 and 4000 are made in Japan) or even spring for the new JDM version, daiwa caldia kix custom 3500PE/4000(all kix CUSTOM models made in Japan)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Concerning the daiwa's, the MORETHAN BRANZINO is on the high end of the spectrum, and the CALDIA KIX CUSTOM is on the lower end. The caldia kix custom 3500PE, and the newest U.S. daiwa Team Daiwa Advantage, other than the spool, slightly different max drag specs according to daiwa, and more CRBB's on the JDM, are virtually the same reel. It looks like a scaled down certate 3500 HD custom, a highly proven reel. But superior to the older kix models, of which I know the smaller series were made in Malaysia.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No doubt a good overall deal is the Twinpower HG/PG, which is a tough reel that still stomps on most of the reels they market here. It saddens me that the '08 twinpower 4000 and down series are no longer made in Japan. These were great freshwater bass and flats reels, and I'm going to put some away for a rainy day.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I refuse to give in to shimano and daiwa "genius marketing". I will never purchase a reel that isn't made in Japan from them again. I buy once and never look back. I'm not suggesting that all shimano and daiwa reels manufactured outside of Japan are junk and incapable of high performance. But I'm personally done with them.


----------



## dsurf

*Comparison*

D22, excellent commentary...!!!
My attraction to the 2008 versions was because of the propulsion line management system and aero wrap II design.....I'm a believer in both!! I don't believe the Twinpower has these features..........
For me, one obstacle to owning a Stella 2008 version, in addition to the costs, is the lack of an anti-reverse lever....I don't believe it's available on any of the Stella models, but it is on both the Stradic and Sustain, except the 6000 and 8000 (I believe Shimano refers to this as Stopperless design). All my spinners currently have this feature and I would expect it takes a while to get used to not having it. I like to simply position the rotor prior to the cast with a flip of the lever.......*are you, others??, challenged with not having the lever.*


----------



## HellRhaY

the twinpower 08 model have the the features you mention. however, the sizes are from 4k and smaller. they said shimano is releasing a redesigned twinpower 08 on september or october sizes 5k and bigger. don't quote me on that though, it's just a gossip.


----------



## DougVNg

*Daiwa Hatteras Sz 30-405 low riders 2-4 oz 13'3"*

Can You tell me Where you custom built this rod and for how much?Thank you for the info!Doug.


----------



## dsurf

*Comparison*

Doug, arrangements were through a friend....if I gave you those details I'd have to shoot you! lol


----------



## KingKrimpet

Great review, I would love to have a comparision between one of these reels and a VS150 to see how much distance the VS would give up... any chance?


----------



## KingKrimpet

One other question if I may, is the Daiwa Hatteras SZ 30-405 similar to the ballistic 33-405?


----------



## Tacpayne

KingKrimpet said:


> One other question if I may, is the Daiwa Hatteras SZ 30-405 similar to the ballistic 33-405?


Yes, it is except the 33 is a perfect 6 n bait rod. The 30's sweet spot seems to be around 3-4 oz


----------



## KingKrimpet

I figured the 33 would be to light for a 6nbait rod


----------



## dsurf

Tacpayne said:


> Yes, it is except the 33 is a perfect 6 n bait rod. The 30's sweet spot seems to be around 3-4 oz


KK excellent question.......My experience/recommendation is somewhat different from TacP. The two rods *are* very similar. I have a recently acquired custom ballistic 33-405 built more in line with Fuji's guide placement recommendations for low riders, using titanium low riders (only weighs 16.5 oz). The Hatteras 30 is just a tad softer and 2-4 oz., imo, is best weight range with 4 being absolute max. I will not power cast it with more than 3 oz. The ballistic 33 is slightly stiffer and is rated by factory at 2-10 oz, which, imo, is grossly misstated. It will throw 2 oz comparably with the Hatteras, maybe further, but I give 5 oz the absolute max with any power cast. Sure, with a lob you'll get away with slightly more. I've even had it to cave with a 4 oz Hatteras power cast.......and I do not plan to power cast it with anything above 4 oz. (By cave, I mean bend further than I'm comfortable with and too much movement into the butt section). 

I certainly do not consider the ballistic 33 a perfect 6 n bait rod since I could never power cast that weight range.


----------

