# shock leader knot



## free spool (May 15, 2006)

I need an ideal shock leader knot that casts smooth, holds and is fairly easy to tie. I have been using the albright but it just isnt cutting it 

thanks for the advice


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## AndyMedic (Mar 22, 2003)

free spool said:


> I need an ideal shock leader knot that casts smooth, holds and is fairly easy to tie. I have been using the albright but it just isnt cutting it
> 
> thanks for the advice


try an improoved albright..i use it and have had really no problems with it..i re-tie my knots every tiem i go out too tho


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## eklutna (Mar 12, 2006)

I had the same problem with my Albright leader knots. I switched to the “Standard Leader Knot”. The knot is actually bigger than the Albright but the way it is tapered it goes through the guides much easier. You second option is to use a tapered leader. A tapered leader is made in a way that most of the leader is 75# test and a short section that attaches to the main line is tapered until it is 17 pound test. You can use a blood knot or a nail to nail knot to attach the lines. Hope this helps

Here is a website that explains the standard leader knot.

http://neilmackellow.sea-angler.org/knot5.html


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## Bassboy (Dec 21, 2003)

I showed you a knot to tie moron! Come with us tomorrow after school to the park and we will try it out man. If you need to see how the knot is tied again ill show you tomorrow. later bud


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## Clyde (Oct 18, 2003)

The ideal connection is to tie a bimini twist in your running line and then connect the shock line to the loop with a no-name knot. This will not fail you if tied correctly.

Another similar connection is to tie a loop in your running line with a spider hitch and then tie the doubled line from the loop to the shocker with a double uni. This is a very good connection as well.


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

Clyde, do you think a double uni is better than a double nail?

Or even a uni/nail combo?


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## Cdog (Mar 18, 2002)

Clyde said:


> The ideal connection is to tie a bimini twist in your running line and then connect the shock line to the loop with a no-name knot. This will not fail you if tied correctly.
> 
> Another similar connection is to tie a loop in your running line with a spider hitch and then tie the doubled line from the loop to the shocker with a double uni. This is a very good connection as well.


I agree with Clyde except I couldn't tie a real bimmini if ya held a gun to my head. So I do th spider/no name. Aint failed me yet....


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## CrawFish (Sep 23, 2003)

Cdog said:


> I agree with Clyde except I couldn't tie a real bimmini if ya held a gun to my head. So I do th spider/no name. Aint failed me yet....


If my retarded @$$ could tie a bimini, I'm sure you could do it as well. I'll show you the way Neil showed me the next time I see you.


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## Clyde (Oct 18, 2003)

I've been tieing uni knots since I was 5 so it's just automatic for me to use it now. Nothing wrong with the nail but a uni is just simple to tie and strong as heck.


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

CrawFish said:


> If my retarded @$$ could tie a bimini, I'm sure you could do it as well. I'll show you the way Neil showed me the next time I see you.



Funny thing....I learned from the same 'tard. 

Bimmini knot is pretty simple ta tie,if ya do it enuff times....but the spider hitch to no-name is a good knot when ya had way too many


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## Digger (Jan 4, 2000)

free spool are you using a levelwind?


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## free spool (May 15, 2006)

no, not using a level wind 
im casting a sealine-x 30
on a 12 foot tica


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## rattler (Jul 3, 2004)

i like the slim beauty...works for me...


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## Digger (Jan 4, 2000)

Free spool Clyde and C-Dog have what you need to learn. There are few things in life like loosing a good fish and getting back a pigtail. Most of the time I tye the Spider to no-name. Unless I'm taking my time then it is the B-twist to no-name


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## Lip Ripper (Dec 8, 2003)

what do you guys have against the improved allbright? its never failed me, and it looks cool.


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## JDimig (Jan 23, 2004)

*Slim Beauty*

Here ya go:

http://www.midcurrent.com/articles/knots/slim_beauty.aspx


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## CrawFish (Sep 23, 2003)

Lip Ripper said:


> what do you guys have against the improved allbright? its never failed me, and it looks cool.


Nothing against it, just that there are better knots


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## Lip Ripper (Dec 8, 2003)

*slim beauty directions?*

WORST DIRECTIONS EVER!!!!!!! I cant get the damn thing to work.   

But then again i never could follow directions.


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## flathead (Dec 18, 2003)

I use a triple surgeon's loop to a no name.Simple,quick,and strong.

Back to back uni is all you really need if you have quality line and know what a drag is and use it properly.

Improved Albright is also excellent,but not as quick and simple to tie as the others on a dark windy night.

That Slim Beauty diagram shows it being tied with the doubled line.It works just as well finished with a single to an improved clinch or uni and it works even better with the single when using a level wind.


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## striperswiper (Nov 30, 2004)

i will stick with the albright i can tie it with my eyes closed if i had to and its small i have never had a problem with it and its only one knot you got to cast


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## bstarling (Apr 24, 2005)

*Knot*

I've found that a variation of the Slim Beauty that is simply an overhand knot in the shock and a clinch in the running line makes a super small and quite strong knot. No double anything so there isn't a bunch to hang on guides or levelwinds. 

Bill


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

*free spool*

IMO Learn one of these connections,and you'll be glad ya did.. Find one that you can tie easily and quick,test them and you will gain confidence in them.. 



1 Bimini,Spider or Triple Surgeon's for double line. Tie it to double uni, uni-nail,nail to nail,or no-name.. IMO,feel that a double line connection to your shock knot is the best.. I have tested a bunch of knots,and these tied with a double line are much stronger when pitted against the others I have tried,especially single line connections..

2 Single line knots alberto,slimbeauty,or improved albright... These are all good knots,but in the testing I have done they won't cut it against those double line connections.. I'm sure that these can be tied with double line connections as well and it will increase strength. These IMO are a little more difficult to tie,so I don't use them,but they are good connections..


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

> Tie it to double uni, uni-nail,nail to nail,or no-name..


Kenny, do you think any of those knots better than the others?


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

Those three are pretty "nip n tuck" when tied to a double line.. You can pull one against the other one time,and one will win,then another and the other will.. Depends on how well each is tied..

I'd just pick from those three as to which you can tie the best,easiest,and fastest,cause all of those are strong.. JMO


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## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

*uni to uni ?*

How many wraps are you taking on the uni connection. I like the knot but find it gets bulky when wrapping a uni with 50 lb shock. I have been using the spider to albright without problem so far, but might go back to the uni/uni combo I used to use.


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

bimmini, to double nail or no-name....



Clay, i can promise you i can teach you how to tie one. if i can teach alkoholiks to tie one, i cant teach you brother


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## fyremanjef (Feb 17, 2005)

*the albright*



Lip Ripper said:


> what do you guys have against the improved allbright? its never failed me, and it looks cool.


Crawfish taught me about using the albright when I was at Sandy Point this spring when I had a huge rock break off right at the beach, and it broke at my SL. Teo asked what knot i was tying and I told him the albright. He asked me to retie it and he very easily pulled on the lines and it broke right off

He then tied a spider hitch with a noname and asked me to try to pull them apart. Well, I have been using the spider hitch ever since. One day, I will tackle the Bimini.


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## Lipyourown (May 11, 2005)

Albright works well, need to retie each day.


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## cygnus-x1 (Oct 12, 2005)

How does the spider hitch perform on a spinning combo? I had a thread going about the KER-POWW factor ... I was experiencing lots of them. Someone posted that a double line knot like the bimini or spider won't do well in a spinning combo unless you are a ssteady and smooth caster. If you try for distance and snap the rod the double line knots would go outside the collector guide and cause a POWW.

whats your opinions on the spider + spinning ?


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## derekxec (Apr 26, 2006)

ive been trying a clinch to clinch lately and it seems to be really strong but im not sure how well it goes through guides but its easy to tie and might be worth a try


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## rndhededflip (Apr 19, 2006)

*UNI to UNI*

uni to uni is the ticket for me... easy to tie... has never failed me but you got to spit on that know to get to come together right... and it tightens up nicely.. the more you pull the tighter it gets... its good stuff... 

G


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

Surf Cat said:


> How many wraps are you taking on the uni connection. I like the knot but find it gets bulky when wrapping a uni with 50 lb shock. I have been using the spider to albright without problem so far, but might go back to the uni/uni combo I used to use.


 Surf Cat,I use 4wraps in the double and 3wraps in the 50.. Usually I tie a uni with 4wraps in double and a nail with 3wraps in the 50..



> Crawfish taught me about using the albright when I was at Sandy Point this spring when I had a huge rock break off right at the beach, and it broke at my SL. Teo asked what knot i was tying and I told him the albright. He asked me to retie it and he very easily pulled on the lines and it broke right off
> 
> He then tied a spider hitch with a noname and asked me to try to pull them apart. Well, I have been using the spider hitch ever since. One day, I will tackle the Bimini.


 Yeap,Crawfish ain't the only one that loves breaking bloodknots and albrights... Pretty easy on the hands....


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

there aint much of a discussion about it. if you want the strongest possible connexxxxion. double your line and tie a no-name sosin, nail, uni.... thats it. its one thing if your catchin croaker or bluefish, but gusy like kenny and dem catch them fish that swim fast and you gotta make sure your knots are good....


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## longcast (Jan 9, 2005)

I'll throw this into the pile again.

With a double knot combination and a spinning reel there will be quite a few times that one knot will go outside the collector guide and the other knot will go inside, KAPOW. In days of old, when I was useing large dia spooled reels like Penn 706, 704, or Crack 300's I was cracking off POUNDS of sinkers a day & tearing the collector ring off the rods. When I switched to conventional the problem was reduced but not gone. The culprit is the induced coil in the 40, 50 or 60lb shock leader. A new leader was more kinky(coily) whatever you want to call it, and it would throw one knot outside the guide.

Things like presoaking the line & streching helped to straighten the line. Useing just a single knot, uni-uni, blood-blood, whatever reduced the crackoffs, but it still happened. When I tried to put extra (power) into the cast would bring out the problem.

When I found tapered shock leader tied with a small knot combo like uni-uni makes it now a non issue.

Braid will have the same problem because it is so limp, if there is any coil in the shock leader it can throw one knot outside the guide with a spinning reel. I think it was on a Japanise Fugi site where there is a photograph of this happening. From what I have come to understand spinning rods with Lowrider guides is the new hot ticket. The shape of the guide feet helps to cause the knots not to hang up. A braid shock leader would not have any coil in it, but when there is a fish in the wash the braid shock has a new set of problems.

Something else I have thought about, is putting something like a playing card against (around) the reel spool lightly touching the line. It would put slight friction on the line causing the line to straighten comming off the spool, when cast. That should cause the line to go straight into the collector guide.

Braid running line on a conventional does it, but slight thumb touch as the cast is released causes the line to go out straight. But doing that cuts distance, & is hard to do. 

Sorry for the length, but this comes up every few months, & I have corrected my problem of shock leader crackoff's with the tapered leader. This leader is 13 meters(40 feet) long & tapers from 18lb test to 70lb test. I join it with a uni-uni knot to my 17, 20, or 25lb line. There is enough of the 70lb line to go around the reel spool 10 times up & back down the length of my 13'6" rods. 

I wonder why nobody here in the States will sell it. There are many tackle shops that cater to long distance casting, big fish, fishermen. If anybody wants my source PM or email me.
longcast


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## Clyde (Oct 18, 2003)

Well all I can say is that my experience differs from yours. I've had zero problems with the two knot system with either spinning or conventional reels. The bimini and no-name are so small that the knots just don't get hung up in my experience.


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## Teddy (May 14, 2006)

*Shock Knot*

I got this one off HOs site from knots and rigs simple and very strong. Have had no problem running thru guides if the heavier line is clipped close which yu do anyway right? tie an overhand knot in the 40 or 50 dont tighten run your main line thru the loop and tie a 5 turn uni over lapping the 40 or 50 pull the uni a little at a time as to not over lap the loops, snug up the overhand knot and then lube up and slide both knots together a little at a time, once both knots are touching tighten them up, pull pull pull if it breaks you tied it wrong! if it doesnt break you got a great easy to tie in the dark shock knot. HO has this animated.


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

Clyde said:


> Well all I can say is that my experience differs from yours. I've had zero problems with the two knot system with either spinning or conventional reels. The bimini and no-name are so small that the knots just don't get hung up in my experience.


 I used to have that problem from time to time with bimini to nail-uni,back when we used carborloid (MISSPELLED ) guides.. I can't think of but maybe two times in the last 10 or 15 yrs I had a breakoff from casting a two knot system with the newer guides.. I've had plenty from backlashes,but they don't count right??


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## big brother (May 15, 2002)

i've heard lots of folks complain about their knots and knot tying. if you are having problems with crack-offs on your casts, learn to tie the no name, i have never seen much difference between doubling your line or not in landing fish. if you are breaking off after you have hooked your fish, you need someone to show you how to use the drag on your reel. there are more than two positions [full on-full off].
charlie


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

Big Brother,I do recall you saying you haven't "Planker Feeshed" in a while?? You get a good ne'r at about 25plus and a fish under the pilings,that's when a double line to shocker shines...


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

Drumdum said:


> Those three are pretty "nip n tuck" when tied to a double line.. You can pull one against the other one time,and one will win,then another and the other will.. Depends on how well each is tied..
> 
> I'd just pick from those three as to which you can tie the best,easiest,and fastest,cause all of those are strong.. JMO


Thanks, Kenny. I've had to break off twice in the last few weeks. Once with a big ray on a pier and once after I threw my lead on top of the CBBT.  

Both times I was using 17lb main line to a 40lb shocker. And both times the line broke at the double nail tied to a spider. 

The spider didn't break. The double nail on the 40lb. shocker to 100lb leader (3-foot section) didn't break. The 100lb uni knot to the hook swivel didn't break, either. 

I guess this is normal. The line had to break somewhere, and the double nail seems to be the weakest link. I was just wondering if a double uni or nail/uni might be a better combination than a double nail. 

Honestly, a double uni is easier for me to tie. I might start using it more often.


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

Newsjeff said:


> Thanks, Kenny. I've had to break off twice in the last few weeks. Once with a big ray on a pier and once after I threw my lead on top of the CBBT.
> 
> Both times I was using 17lb main line to a 40lb shocker. And both times the line broke at the double nail tied to a spider.
> 
> ...


dood jeff. ok brother here's whats up. i've been so pumped to fish and had to work that as you all know i sit and play with extra line.... what you described does happen... BUT ONLY when you tie the knots incorrectly. if you "cinch" down on the nail or uni from the tag end too tight before you pull the knots together, it will break at teh knot, bc you flatten the joining section... just get it snug, spit all over that thing then PULL the knots tight, dont pull from the tag ends of either knot. if you do this, i promise you'll break your running line somewhere. we'll try all this out during that week in june(thanks DD for getting me pumped about it!)


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