# Knots for a Knot Head



## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

OK the only knot I know how to tie is an improved cinch. I know that won't work so I have been reading up on knots. The set up I plan on is #20 mainline #80 shock #100 hook. I'm thinking coastlock at end of shock and barrel swivels on Snell hook for easy change out. Is this ok? Bimini twist on mainline then what to join mainline to shock? Then what for coastlock and barrel? I want to tie several Snells up. What different size hooks should I use?


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

go to the bible section of this forum and there is a great thread on shock knots. absoultley use a bimini or a surgeons loop to double your mainline then knot of your choice, my two go to knots are slim beauty and the uni to nail combo. both easy to learn and strong. as far as your other questions need a little bit more info. what are you fishing for?


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## DANtheJDMan (Aug 29, 2012)

Jwalker said:


> OK the only knot I know how to tie is an improved cinch. I know that won't work so I have been reading up on knots. The set up I plan on is #20 mainline #80 shock #100 hook. I'm thinking coastlock at end of shock and barrel swivels on Snell hook for easy change out. Is this ok? Bimini twist on mainline then what to join mainline to shock? Then what for coastlock and barrel? I want to tie several Snells up. What different size hooks should I use?


Your asking the right questions.

I can't tie a Bimini twist so I use a surgeons loop to a Yucatan knot for my main line to the shock leader. Its easy to tie. I tried an Albright but was not too happy with it. 

On heavy line over 20 lb I use the Polymer knot with good success. It seems to work well with heavy mono. 

With braid I use a figure 8 knot and use a loop to loop knot to hook it to a swivel. Seems to work really well. 

Just my 2 cents.

Just my 2 cents.


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

Drum specifically but honestly anything that grabs the bait.


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

Also how long should the loop be on a BT?


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## lil red jeep (Aug 17, 2007)

Look in the Bible section for the "Easy short spider hitch" knot. Very easy to tie and holds like a beat to keep a line doubled. From there a No Name to add on the shock leader and you're fishing.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Bimini to a Slim beauty........


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

Jwalker said:


> Drum specifically but honestly anything that grabs the bait.


for drum i usually stick to a cannonball rig or a 1" to 1.5" snell. hook size for ya hit up a 10/0. Abumike just posted a great pic of what your bimini to slim should look like so that should answer your question about bimini loop size, i try not to have a loop over 6". anything over i think starts to add to line slap


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

My first a temp at the Bimini Twist. Give it to me straight. How did I do?


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## JPChase (Jul 31, 2010)

Much better than my first attempt at one!

That being said, the coils below the hitch knot should be stacked on top of each other without any space between. This could be as simple as tightening up knot a bit more.

The coils above the hitch appear to have wrapped on top of each other. Ideally you want the coils to snugged up to one another and they should look nearly identical above and below the hitch.


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

Thanks. I think with a little time, four more hands, vise-grips, duct tape and some Crown Royal I'll have it.


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## ez2cdave (Oct 13, 2008)

DANtheJDMan said:


> On heavy line over 20 lb I use the Polymer knot with good success. It seems to work well with heavy mono.


Did you mean the "PALOMAR" knot ???


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## DANtheJDMan (Aug 29, 2012)

ez2cdave said:


> Did you mean the "PALOMAR" knot ???


Prolly, I can't spell. Should have googled it first. Sorry.
DAN


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## pods (Sep 10, 2013)

Are you throwing conventional or spinning? I got all excited about shock knots, read the bible post on shock knots, and proceeded to tie up some very nice BT to SB knots. Went out on the field, and had my knot slap my guides much worse than my Albright.
Later I found out that doubling you main line and having two knots in close proximity is no good for spinning setups.
So I made a knot. I make a double overhand knot in my shock, thread the mainline (not doubled) through it like a SB, then tie it around the shock with a uni knot. Knot is super small and won't slip. I basically modified a Buxton Bunnie IIRC. It used a single overhand shock, which my main line kept pulling out. 
pods


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## Manlystanley (Sep 22, 2010)

pods said:


> Are you throwing conventional or spinning? I got all excited about shock knots, read the bible post on shock knots, and proceeded to tie up some very nice BT to SB knots. Went out on the field, and had my knot slap my guides much worse than my Albright.


Did the SB slap the guides on the way out or in? I nver had it slap the guides on the way out. But, I use 50 lb braid on my surf casting reels; followed by a 50 lb mono shock leader.

Best Regards,
Stan


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## pods (Sep 10, 2013)

On the way out. I figured that the SB was hitting the guides, which is normal. But that hitting the guide slows down the BT or SH behind it enough so it will catch harder. Someone here told me that you cannot double up your mainline with a spinner due to this phenomenon as well as the line coming off in a loop around the spool. On the way in I noticed it, but it was manageable. 
Since I went to my new knot, no problems at all.
pods


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

Jwalker said:


> View attachment 11214
> 
> 
> My first a temp at the Bimini Twist. Give it to me straight. How did I do?


looks a heck of a lot better than the first time i tried one


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## Manlystanley (Sep 22, 2010)

pods said:


> On the way out. I figured that the SB was hitting the guides, which is normal. But that hitting the guide slows down the BT or SH behind it enough so it will catch harder. Someone here told me that you cannot double up your mainline with a spinner due to this phenomenon as well as the line coming off in a loop around the spool. On the way in I noticed it, but it was manageable.
> Since I went to my new knot, no problems at all.
> pods


What type of line do you use??


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

Conventional


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## pods (Sep 10, 2013)

Jwalker said:


> Conventional


Conventional you can get away with a doubled main line. I don't have much experience with those (just bait casters in fresh water). Spinners they worked out terrible no matter how long the doubled section was.
pods


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## pods (Sep 10, 2013)

Manlystanley said:


> What type of line do you use??


Either 15 lb mono or 30-65 lb braid mainline and 60 lb mono shock.
Doubled main line just didn't fly well on a spinner.
pods


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

Jwalker said:


> OK the only knot I know how to tie is an improved cinch. I know that won't work so I have been reading up on knots. The set up I plan on is #20 mainline #80 shock #100 hook. I'm thinking coastlock at end of shock and barrel swivels on Snell hook for easy change out. Is this ok? Bimini twist on mainline then what to join mainline to shock? Then what for coastlock and barrel? I want to tie several Snells up. What different size hooks should I use?


 This thread in the Fishing Bible gives it straight as far as which knot is stronger.. http://www.pierandsurf.com/fishing-...ific-proof-of-the-strongest-shock-knot!/page7

I use nail-uni,because IT IS the strongest that I've tested,and have been using it for 30yrs now without fail.. So,I stick with my bimini to a uni-nail.. That's just me though,there are plenty of options,some that I could tie easier and faster as well..As far as your bimini,you can also tie a spider or triple surgeons,both work well for a double line.. Far as the knot to the double line a no-name or slimbeauty will work great and can be tied quick and are easy to learn as well.. If you are using conventional you should not have a problem with it hanging in the guides.. It does,can,and will happen,but it is extremely rare..

There is another thread in the bible about a short bimini as well as a quick way to tie a short spider as well..

Bimini in bible.. http://www.pierandsurf.com/fishing-forum/showthread.php?35917-Bimini-Twist

Easy short spider.. http://www.pierandsurf.com/fishing-forum/showthread.php?48369-Easy-short-spider


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

I have been reading the Bible and I just don't understand some things. Like when you say you use a nail-uni. I look up these knots and I find a nail and a uni but not a combination of the two. What an I missing? Is it a different knot or a combination of both? I see this with a lot of different knots people are talking about.


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

Jwalker said:


> I have been reading the Bible and I just don't understand some things. Like when you say you use a nail-uni. I look up these knots and I find a nail and a uni but not a combination of the two. What an I missing? Is it a different knot or a combination of both? I see this with a lot of different knots people are talking about.


he's talking about tying a combo of the two do a 4 turn uni knot with your mainline onto your shock and tying a 3 turn nail knot with your shock. look up a uni to uni knot connection but do a nail not instead of one of the uni's. its a great knot. one of my two go to knots.


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

Jwalker said:


> I have been reading the Bible and I just don't understand some things. Like when you say you use a nail-uni. I look up these knots and I find a nail and a uni but not a combination of the two. What an I missing? Is it a different knot or a combination of both? I see this with a lot of different knots people are talking about.


 What Cooper said.. I found a 3 wrap nail in the shock to a 4 wrap uni in the doubled running line to be the strongest connection I could find.. ALTHOUGH!! This evening,Tater and I both tied knots in competition.. He tied a bimini to a slimbeauty (modified with uni),I tied a bimini to a nail-uni combo... We both were connected by the 20lb test running line,both with 50lb shock.. IT BROKE IN THE CENTER OF THE 20LB RUNNING LINE!!! I have pitted the nail-uni to MANY other knots,this is a first.. The slim beauty is DEFINATLY a strong knot to do that... Cooper you have picked the two strongest knots,jmho....


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

How about I just head south and meet up with you all and you can teach me how to tie all these knots. Sure would be better than shoveling all this snow.


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## DANtheJDMan (Aug 29, 2012)

pods said:


> Conventional you can get away with a doubled main line. I don't have much experience with those (just bait casters in fresh water). Spinners they worked out terrible no matter how long the doubled section was.
> pods


http://www.netknots.com/fishing_knots/yucatan-knot

Surgeons Loop to a Yucatan knot.

I'm just a beginner so I got this knot combination from reading this forum. I used it to tie 40# Ande mono shock to 30#PP Slick 8.

I threw it at least 50 times with 12 onces and bait over a three day period and it never caught or damaged a knot using a spinner.

I was even using a rod everybody hates because the knots hang up. 40-405I Diawa Saltiga Balistic Interline. I was using a 6000 Battle on it.

I could not even hear the knot going out. I threw it kind of jingerly the first couple of times and it worked good so I gave it everything I had and it held up.

I was also throwing a 12 ft conventional with 10 onces and bait with 40# Ande shock and 17# Tritanium. I could hear this rattling through the guides on every cast.

Never caught on this one either.
I snagged a rock out at Seagull and had to break off. I rapped the braid around the arm of my coat the really had try a couple three times to get it to break. It broke the 40# Ande just before the knot.
I snagged the 17# Tritanium and it broke in the surgeons knot. 
These two knots are easy to tie, even I can do it.
Just my very humble opinion.


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## Manlystanley (Sep 22, 2010)

What do you guys think of this study?? http://www.sportfishingmag.com/techniques/sport-fishing-knot-challenge

Best Regards,
Stan


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Drumdum said:


> What Cooper said.. I found a 3 wrap nail in the shock to a 4 wrap uni in the doubled running line to be the strongest connection I could find.. ALTHOUGH!! This evening,Tater and I both tied knots in competition.. He tied a bimini to a slimbeauty (modified with uni),I tied a bimini to a nail-uni combo... We both were connected by the 20lb test running line,both with 50lb shock.. IT BROKE IN THE CENTER OF THE 20LB RUNNING LINE!!! I have pitted the nail-uni to MANY other knots,this is a first.. The slim beauty is DEFINATLY a strong knot to do that... Cooper you have picked the two strongest knots,jmho....


Told you that SB is a great knot....


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Manlystanley said:


> What do you guys think of this study?? http://www.sportfishingmag.com/techniques/sport-fishing-knot-challenge
> 
> Best Regards,
> Stan


Prolly fine if using braid.


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

AbuMike said:


> Told you that SB is a great knot....


 Mike I had Tater tie the beauty.. I can tie it,although not nearly as fast or efficiently as uni-nail.. That could be because that is what I tie on a reg basis and can tie it by feel.. In double line it is definatly a good knot.. Wish he would have tested it in the bible thread,although when something breaks at 42lbs and the line strength was 17 or 20 in the test he ran,would say uni-nail is fairly strong as well... Like has been said many times on here,use the one you have confidence in,can tie it correctly 100% of the time,and can tie in the dark,and tie it with some speed..


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

Manlystanley said:


> What do you guys think of this study?? http://www.sportfishingmag.com/techniques/sport-fishing-knot-challenge
> 
> Best Regards,
> Stan


 If you look at the tying times on the comments,you'll see why I tie a bimini to no-name (I am thinking they are calling it a brystol) in braid.. Many knots that are strong with mono fall short in braid to mono,uni-nail is a good example of that.. Not going to take 5min or more to tie an fg when I can tie a bimini then no-name (improved doesn't take any longer) in probably one third the time.. If fish are there,time can cost you fish....


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## Manlystanley (Sep 22, 2010)

So, got to ask the question, what about a plain Slim Beauty knot for joining braid to mono? That is my goto shock leader knot. I never have had it fail, but that's not saying much (have not caught much of any sized fish).

Best Regards,
Stan


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

Drumdum said:


> What Cooper said.. I found a 3 wrap nail in the shock to a 4 wrap uni in the doubled running line to be the strongest connection I could find.. ALTHOUGH!! This evening,Tater and I both tied knots in competition.. He tied a bimini to a slimbeauty (modified with uni),I tied a bimini to a nail-uni combo... We both were connected by the 20lb test running line,both with 50lb shock.. IT BROKE IN THE CENTER OF THE 20LB RUNNING LINE!!! I have pitted the nail-uni to MANY other knots,this is a first.. The slim beauty is DEFINATLY a strong knot to do that... Cooper you have picked the two strongest knots,jmho....


 well i learned about the uni nail combo from from you lurking around here a few years ago so thank you for that. Anyhow you have again peaked my interest when you said slimbeauty with a modified uni? im assuming you just still pass the mainline through the figure 8 as normal but instead tie a uni instead of the wrap up and wrap down yada yada? that sounds great if its just as strong, my toughest problem with the beauty is getting the main line back under itself to finish it up, especially at night or in a hurry. can do a uni in my sleep so im really interested in your modification to it, how many wraps did you do?


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

Manlystanley said:


> So, got to ask the question, what about a plain Slim Beauty knot for joining braid to mono? That is my goto shock leader knot. I never have had it fail, but that's not saying much (have not caught much of any sized fish).
> 
> Best Regards,
> Stan


 i have a few braid set ups and my choice now is a sebile knot. to be honest at first it was a real PIA to figure out from watching a video and there are a few differnet ways to do it, i settled on the method that has you individually cross wrap the braid over under. messed it up everytime until i figured out the trick was to keep the braid very tight on everywrap. once i figured that out that knot is really easy and fairly fast. small and strong.


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## lil red jeep (Aug 17, 2007)

Jwalker said:


> How about I just head south and meet up with you all and you can teach me how to tie all these knots. Sure would be better than shoveling all this snow.


Great idea, with one small problem. I fish with a bunch of guys I love like brothers who I know if the poop hit the fan, they had my back and know I had theirs. The problem is every time, and I mean EVERY time we go fishing, I spend a third of my time tying their knots. I've shown them a million ways to Sunday how to tie certain knots that I rely on and have done me well, and if you don't practice them, you will forget how to do them when you need them. When they read this thread, they'll know who I'm talking about and I hope they know I'll tie their knots all day for them, but wouldn't mind if they learned a few themselves. Moral of the story, if you learn some knots, practice them!


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## lil red jeep (Aug 17, 2007)

Another option for knots is if you use an android smart phone, there is a great app for knots. Saw it on a mid day fishing show call knot wars and for a free app that show animated knots, pretty good deal.


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## Jwalker (Jan 18, 2014)

The way things look around here with the weather I'm going to have plenty of time to practice. To cold to do anything else. I have till September 13th to learn. I want to be able to tie all the knots I need before I get to the OBX. The Bimini Twist is a very easy knot to understand how to tie but tieing it correctly is a SOB. Once I can tie it I'm going to move on to the others. I have a lot of practicing to do. Tieing knots tieing rigs and casting.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

SB with a Uni .... Now that's an idea...


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## pods (Sep 10, 2013)

Jwalker said:


> The way things look around here with the weather I'm going to have plenty of time to practice. To cold to do anything else. I have till September 13th to learn. I want to be able to tie all the knots I need before I get to the OBX. The Bimini Twist is a very easy knot to understand how to tie but tieing it correctly is a SOB. Once I can tie it I'm going to move on to the others. I have a lot of practicing to do. Tieing knots tieing rigs and casting.


Well you could always dig for gold? That is my other favorite past time. Something about those little flakes gets the blood pumping. Sort of like hearing a drag getting a workout.
pods


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## pods (Sep 10, 2013)

AbuMike said:


> SB with a Uni .... Now that's an idea...


I think that is sort of what I am using. I looked at the Red Phillips (?) or Buxton Bunnie knot which was an overhand shock and a uni through that. Mine kept slipping through, so I doubled the overhand (like a SB) and thread the mainline through and wrap a uni around the shock to secure it. Been working pretty well so far. Probably not the strongest, but it is small and flies well.
pods


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

AbuMike said:


> SB with a Uni .... Now that's an idea...


yeah im really interested to see how that works out, can call it a slimdrumdum knot or the slimtater


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## Drumdum (Jan 6, 2003)

AbuMike said:


> SB with a Uni .... Now that's an idea...


 Dern,Mike,thought that was what you tied??? Forget who even told me to try it that way..? See,I haven't changed my knot uni-nail,because there has been no need.. Was using no-name,and still do,if it is a super rush,same with spider vs bimini.. Now Tater's a different story,he ties uni-nail,but will take on and test any new knot.. Like the sebile knot cooper's talking.. Guess I'm getting too ole to have that kinda patience..


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Drumdum said:


> Dern,Mike,thought that was what you tied??? Forget who even told me to try it that way..? See,I haven't changed my knot uni-nail,because there has been no need.. Was using no-name,and still do,if it is a super rush,same with spider vs bimini.. Now Tater's a different story,he ties uni-nail,but will take on and test any new knot.. Like the sebile knot cooper's talking.. Guess I'm getting too ole to have that kinda patience..


Nope, I tie it the traditional way. 4 down and 3 up but the UNI may be a very good alternative in the dark and cold.


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## SteveMcD (Sep 7, 2013)

I went an bought "Notley's Ultimate Guide - Saltwater Fishing Rigs & Knots" off of Amazon. Pretty good reference book - everything you need to know all in one book.


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