# is hiring a charter to go trolling go really "fishing?"



## kurazy kracka (Oct 14, 2008)

saw this discussion on another board.

so if you are hiring a charter to take you out fishing where the captain puts you on fish and the mate does all the rigging work and all you do is crank once hooked up is that really fishing? to me that's not a fish you can take credit for since all the work was done for you as far as finding the fish, making them bite, and hooking them. it doesn't take any of your own skill or know-how.


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## Orest (Jul 28, 2003)

I don't think you can made a fish bite your hook.


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## Kellercl (Jan 28, 2010)

I have done it and I found it boring. And frankly I didn't find it that effective either. We caught two kings, one was a keeper, and one spanish. I think trolling is something worth doing when going from fishing spot "A" to spot "B."


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## kurazy kracka (Oct 14, 2008)

Kellercl said:


> I have done it and I found it boring. And frankly I didn't find it that effective either. We caught two kings, one was a keeper, and one spanish. I think trolling is something worth doing when going from fishing spot "A" to spot "B."


I've seen so many people who hire a charter and nail like a 50" rock and then take credit for it when in reality they did nothing but wind it in.


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## JAM (Jul 22, 2002)

How else would you Catch a Blue Marlin?? Do you have your Own 50 Foot Sport Fisher?


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## JAM (Jul 22, 2002)

Kellercl said:


> I have done it and I found it boring. And frankly I didn't find it that effective either. We caught two kings, one was a keeper, and one spanish. I think trolling is something worth doing when going from fishing spot "A" to spot "B."


Sounds to me like you did a Half Day Near shore Trip... Trolling is very effective for: YellowFin Tuna, BlackFin Tuna BlueFin Tuna, Blue Marlin, White Marlin, SailFish, Hatchet Marlin, Mahi ...It depends more what time of year you are going, looks to me you went in the Fall... 

Believe me if you Crank in a 450+ Pound Blue Marlin or a 500 Pound BlueFin Tuna, you caught the fish, and your Body will tell you that for a Week. Sure the Capt. puts you on the Fish, the Mate Rigs the Bait, but once hooked that fish is YOURS to lose...Or Catch... JMHO.... 

JAM


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## Kellercl (Jan 28, 2010)

JAM said:


> Sounds to me like you did a Half Day Near shore Trip... Trolling is very effective for: YellowFin Tuna, BlackFin Tuna BlueFin Tuna, Blue Marlin, White Marlin, SailFish, Hatchet Marlin, Mahi ...It depends more what time of year you are going, looks to me you went in the Fall...
> 
> Believe me if you Crank in a 450+ Pound Blue Marlin or a 500 Pound BlueFin Tuna, you caught the fish, and your Body will tell you that for a Week. Sure the Capt. puts you on the Fish, the Mate Rigs the Bait, but once hooked that fish is YOURS to lose...Or Catch... JMHO....
> 
> JAM


The give away should have been when I said we caught kings and spanish. Yes it was inshore, but not in the fall, it was July. If people enjoy trolling, so be it. I just don't/didn't.


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## bigjim5589 (Jul 23, 2005)

Opinions always vary. Most folks who go out on charters are looking to put fish in the freezer. They pay for the service & expect charter captains to find the fish. The angler still has to bring the fish into the boat. Skill levels also vary so, it's not necessarily easy for everyone to wind them in. If a person brings in a true trophy size fish, there's nothing wrong with being proud of it or doing some bragging. In the end it hurts no one! Let them have their fun, they paid for the privilege.

As far as "taking credit", who cares? Unless the angler is fishing a tournament within specific rules or trying to get credit for an IGFA record it doesn't matter. If they're attempting to "cheat" for financial gain, that's a different issue IMO. 

Many years back, myself, & some family & friends went out on charters 3 years in a row from Chesapeake Beach for a single day get together. It's not something we did much of & have not done so since. However, it was a good way to get family & some friends together for a day of fishing. My wife even cranked in some fish & she had never fished before in her life. We caught fish & brought home some for the table & freezer. We had a great time too in the process all 3 years. That's as much as we expected even had we not caught any fish. Two of the years we trolled & the one year we did a little trolling for Spanishs Macs on the way out & back in, & the rest of our time was spent bottom fishing. The captain & mate we hired were easy to get along with & was willing to try different things to make the day a good one. Some of us were experienced, some were not, so having a mate who knew what he was doing helped those with less or no experience immensely. 

IMO hiring a charter is not bad way to spend a day if you get a good captain & mate. Sure they do most of the "work" but that's what you're paying for. It's not the kind of fishing I like to do best, but for what it was, a day out fishing with family & friends, I would do it again, and if I crank in a 50" rockfish I'm darn sure going to take credit for it.


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## dialout (Feb 5, 2011)

Right on JAM... I don't have a boat, but I like fishing offshore. I count on the Capt. To put me on the fish, and the mate to help me do some rigging, although I am capable of that myself so more often than not the mate helps someone else much more. 

Limiting out on tuna the last few times with a bunch of big Mahi mixed in...topped of with a few of the obligatory follow along sharks ....and I think I caught a lot of dinner


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## BigWillJ (Jan 21, 2001)

kurazy kracka said:


> saw this discussion on another board.
> 
> so if you are hiring a charter to take you out fishing where the captain puts you on fish and the mate does all the rigging work and all you do is crank once hooked up is that really fishing? to me that's not a fish you can take credit for since all the work was done for you as far as finding the fish, making them bite, and hooking them. it doesn't take any of your own skill or know-how.


In a word, yes, you are really fishing. And generally speaking, you can be allowed credit for the fish *you* caught. But saying "not a fish you can take credit for" could open up a bigger discussion with as many replies as there are people with opinions. For instance, there are rules around claiming a world record catch.....or, you might not take home the exact fish you caught....or, you certainly wouldn't want credit for an undersize fish you might have caught, which the captain or mate threw in the "community" box. 
I say go fishing, and enjoy yourself, by whatever ways are available to you.


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## akhan (Mar 17, 2011)

Gonna start a new business, I'll cast out a bunch of lines at Sandy Point while you chill at home, when the fish start biting, I'll call you up, so you can come by to reel em' in -- actually I'll do you one better, i'll bring in the fish, clean it, filet it, wrap it in a styrafoam tray and deliver it to your house - just pay me for your fishing experience and my time and gas.


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## don brinson (Apr 8, 2011)

I mated on a charter back in mid 70's out of Sneads Ferry NC. We put a ton of fish and huge smiles on that boat trolling. We caught every thing from sails to bonita andeverything inbetween. Most of our customers were first timers. But they land that fish. They listen to what you tell them. They play the fish . It was normally the people who knew everything and would not listen who lost there fish and then bitched at the mate.
I think the get credit For catching the fish,but it meant I did my job as the mate to


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

just another type of fishing ... I would prefer that to catching these so call trout that people chase after the stock trucks to catch. like catching somebodys pet fish they raised


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## BigWillJ (Jan 21, 2001)

kurazy kracka said:


> I've seen so many people who hire a charter and nail like a 50" rock and then take credit for it when in reality they did nothing but wind it in.


Trying not to sound like a smart ass, you seem to be more hung up on someone taking credit for a fish they caught, depending on the method used in catching it, then comparing that to whether or not it's "really" fishing. If you chartered a boat, took control of a rod and reel, and landed a fish, what are you telling your friends you did.....went bowling?......no, you're gonna say you went fishing and caught a 50" rock. At the same time, you might give credit to the captain for putting you on that fish.


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

kurazy kracka said:


> saw this discussion on another board.
> 
> so if you are hiring a charter to take you out fishing where the captain puts you on fish and the mate does all the rigging work and all you do is crank once hooked up is that really fishing? to me that's not a fish you can take credit for since all the work was done for you as far as finding the fish, making them bite, and hooking them. it doesn't take any of your own skill or know-how.


The skill involved is acquiring the funds to charter the boat in the first place, $1800 per day in discretionary funds takes real skill. 

Keep in mind that after you get to dock and the mate chucks the day's catch out on the planks, for the all the bystanders to see...................the Mate has to wash down the boat...........the Captain has to pay the fuel bill and slip fees.......................all this give you the extra time to claim that you were the one who caught the big one...........the one who did not get away......................if the big one was lost...............it was the Mate and or Captain's fault....

With out you the *fisherman* the Boat stays at the dock and Mate sits around Sam and Omie's all day drinking.....


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## sand flea (Oct 24, 1999)

I think it counts when people like us put a trip together and go out. They're intensely focused on fishing, talking technique with the mates, staying sharp and focusing on hooking up. Where chartering gets its bad rep is when they haul out ding dongs who want to spend the trip getting drunk, killing everything they catch, and forgetting about fishing the second their feet hit the dock in the afternoon. They get their shot with a dead fish so they can post it on Facebook and stumble home. Can't blame the boats for that, though: you're either a fisherman or a bozo on a boat.


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## don brinson (Apr 8, 2011)

I think most of you on here love to fish. I know I do. And over the years I heard that 75 % of the fish are caught by 25 % of the fisherman. That 25% spends the time to learn their craft. Well if I invited one of you guys up to Michigan next October and we drove to certain spot in a certain river. I let you use a pair of waders and one of my steelhead rods and hand made spinners and said cast right by that log and let it sink down . Then crank just fast enough for the current to made the blade turn and let it sweep across by the speed of the current. Then that 10lb. steelhead just about takes the rod out of your hand kicks your ass up and down that little river but you land him.
Did You Catch That Fish, or did I . I say you did because you listened and learned to what you were told. you can cast in the same river all day and not catch one , but because I learned my craft from some one else 30 years ago I could help you out in the first few minutes of fishing. Just my two cents worth. Not much difference from what a Charter does but you pay.


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## [email protected] (Jul 12, 2006)

A Charter boat is a system. You can't drive it , mate it and fish it all by yourself. It's a team deal. 

Next time you go out, ask the mate to show you how to rig a ballyhoo or make a haywire twist.


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## Kellercl (Jan 28, 2010)

don brinson said:


> I think most of you on here love to fish. I know I do. And over the years I heard that 75 % of the fish are caught by 25 % of the fisherman. That 25% spends the time to learn their craft. Well if I invited one of you guys up to Michigan next October and we drove to certain spot in a certain river. I let you use a pair of waders and one of my steelhead rods and hand made spinners and said cast right by that log and let it sink down . Then crank just fast enough for the current to made the blade turn and let it sweep across by the speed of the current. Then that 10lb. steelhead just about takes the rod out of your hand kicks your ass up and down that little river but you land him.
> Did You Catch That Fish, or did I . I say you did because you listened and learned to what you were told. you can cast in the same river all day and not catch one , but because I learned my craft from some one else 30 years ago I could help you out in the first few minutes of fishing. Just my two cents worth. Not much difference from what a Charter does but you pay.


Fair point, though I do see what the OP is attempting to say, at least I think so. We all know those people who don't know the difference between a spin reel and a baitcaster but yet walk around pretending to be the world's best fisherman because he paid some dude to hook him up.


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## bigjim5589 (Jul 23, 2005)

> Fair point, though I do see what the OP is attempting to say, at least I think so. We all know those people who don't know the difference between a spin reel and a baitcaster but yet walk around pretending to be the world's best fisherman because he paid some dude to hook him up.


Yes, and everyone has to start somewhere too. No one starts out as an expert, although like you say there are those that pretend to be. IMO, anyone who goes out on a charter or with a guide, no matter where that may be, (bay, river, ocean, great lakes etc) and wishes to learn in the process, and of course chooses a captain/guide who is willing to teach them something, will be ahead of the game & the learning curve. Goes with what Don said. Not all go to learn. 

There will always be those who will go out & fish on a charter, but may not be serious about the sport, yet may brag about their "accomplishments". So be it! In the over all scheme of things, as far as fishing goes it matters diddly! If they're ever in a position they actually have to rely on their own "skills", then they'll struggle. Most of that type then simply make excuses why they didn't catch anything. It's always easier to brag if you have fish to show for it! 

Those type of people give us something to discuss in the winter time! opcorn:


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

Speaking of winter time we all know boat fish don't count.


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## Benji (Nov 19, 2014)

Charter boat is the cheapest way to go tuna fishing iv ever found. Most captains iv been with don't care if you want to bait your own hook, it's your dollar.


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## Benji (Nov 19, 2014)

I'd like to have a charter that would drop me in the Gulf steam in a kayak. Cast at sum dolphin or hook up on a nice wahoo and go for the ride... But not everyone has the money to go out there and f* off.


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## JAM (Jul 22, 2002)

Benji Mothershipping Can be arranged, I have a deal with a few Captains...... 
JAM


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## Benji (Nov 19, 2014)

At the moment I get to go offshore once a year if I'm lucky, and if I'm going to spend 300 sum bucks or more for a day. Iv gotta put meat in the freezer. When money gets better definitely going to look into the mothership kayak trip Jam. Out of Carolina?


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## Mastrbaitr (May 7, 2014)

If you reel, it you catch it. The difference, after awhile catching fish in a barrel gets boring.


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## JAM (Jul 22, 2002)

Benji said:


> At the moment I get to go offshore once a year if I'm lucky, and if I'm going to spend 300 sum bucks or more for a day. Iv gotta put meat in the freezer. When money gets better definitely going to look into the mothership kayak trip Jam. Out of Carolina?


Hatteras out of Teach's Lair Marina...


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## Benji (Nov 19, 2014)

JAM said:


> Hatteras out of Teach's Lair Marina...


Just bookmarked your website


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## greasemonkey54 (May 12, 2010)

I say its your fish. Most people i take on my boat have me set lines,set hooks, leader the fish. Its that persons fish who reeled it in. 

Some charters allow you to set lines and do all the work under their direction


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## JAM (Jul 22, 2002)

We have a few boats at Teach's where you are the Mate, more of a hands on experience, where the Captain directs you o what to do. Both Inshore and OffShore. Kicker is its less money too.... JAM


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## bluefish1928 (Jun 9, 2007)

Benji said:


> Charter boat is the cheapest way to go tuna fishing iv ever found. Most captains iv been with don't care if you want to bait your own hook, it's your dollar.


A party boat out of San Diego can be the cheapest. During the prime time, you can get tuna on a 3/4 day trip for about $130.


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## Lipyourown (May 11, 2005)

JAM said:


> We have a few boats at Teach's where you are the Mate, more of a hands on experience, where the Captain directs you o what to do. Both Inshore and OffShore. Kicker is its less money too.... JAM


Yep, I recall the tall- blonde- surfer guy on the Stalker used to let us do just that. What ever happened to the Stalker? Ditto on Beach Bum.

To answer the original question- of course it is fishing. Some of the most challenging situations I have been in fishing was while on a charter....a typical land lover would have begged the capt to turn around and other times surf fishing is the least challenging of any type of fishing...but it is all fishing.


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