# Akios 656 CTM or CSM



## NightHawker

Greetings, One and All: Back in my youth, I initially learned how to fish from my grandfather who taught me bait casting/conventional style. I still have his old Penn reel and rod he gave me that he used back in the 1950's. Fast forward with years of spinning, I'd like to reconnect myself with bait casting off the shoreline. I've done much research and it seems that Akios 656 S-line looks like a winner to me. Anyone have experience with the Akios line? Also, what length/brand of conventional rod do you suggest I purchase? I am considering something in the 11' range. All replies graciously welcome! Thanks!


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## bronzbck1

If your going to be casting lures I would get a level wind but if you need distance go with a non-level wind. I fish 6 Akios reels year round and love mine. They hold up nice I just wash them off with freshwater daily. As for a 11 foot rod Carolina Cast Pro makes the best 11' rod out there. They have a 2-5 oz and a 3-6 oz 11' rod. I wouldn't trade my 2-5 oz rod for any rod out there. That one is parabolic and throws really easy!


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## DANtheJDMan

I have a 12ft Star Stellar Surf with a 656 Shuttle. I think it sits a little lower than a CTM because of the composite frame. This reel is the cat's a** and really casts well. I don't really throw that hard. I fish with that set up and a few shorter rods with Abu 6500s without mags.
I was at a flat beach a couple of weeks ago and I wish I would have had the 11ft 2-5 because the bite detection on the 4-12 star is good but not good enough for pomps and whiting.
I love a rod with parabolic action.
I would prolly trade my 40-405 for something lighter action because I thought I needed a heaver and it will probably be years before I am in Hatteras when its drum season and need something that can throw over 10.
Someone like AbuMike can set me straight but an Akios is a good made Abu as far as I can tell. 
I like bronzbck1's idea about throws easy. I like the Star because of the parabolic throws easy part. I have the 9ft Star Stella Surf. I suppose I could try to pick up the two in the middle.
The CCP sounds sweet.


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## Raymo

and theres a 2-5 for sale for a great price in the Marketplace...wink



bronzbck1 said:


> If your going to be casting lures I would get a level wind but if you need distance go with a non-level wind. I fish 6 Akios reels year round and love mine. They hold up nice I just wash them off with freshwater daily. As for a 11 foot rod Carolina Cast Pro makes the best 11' rod out there. They have a 2-5 oz and a 3-6 oz 11' rod. I wouldn't trade my 2-5 oz rod for any rod out there. That one is parabolic and throws really easy!


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## Don B

bronzbck1 said:


> If your going to be casting lures I would get a level wind but if you need distance go with a non-level wind.


Although true, the gap can be narrowed.

Here's a level wind spin check:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=354553711371995&set=vb.241125069381527&type=2&theater

It would be interesting to see the actual casting performance as compared to a CT.


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## AbuMike

Don B said:


> Although true, the gap can be narrowed.
> 
> Here's a level wind spin check:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=354553711371995&set=vb.241125069381527&type=2&theater
> 
> It would be interesting to see the actual casting performance as compared to a CT.


That is one smooth FASSSSSSST reel. I would venture to say it will be most uncontrollable in real fishing conditions without some kind of breaking. Thus defeating the purpose of all the extra money spent in this reel. FASSSSSST does not always mean GOOOOD....Looks to be a GREAT Grass Carp fishing reel but thats all....


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## kingfish

Not to mention the maintenance nightmare if you fished it.


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## AbuMike

kingfish said:


> Not to mention the maintenance nightmare if you fished it.


+1, yep this too..A lot of bearings that will get wet...


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## NightHawker

So, AbuMike...based on your comments, and with me reconnecting to the baitcasting/conventional world of surf fishing, what would you recommend I look for in a conventional reel? Conventional rod? Your insight will be greatly appreciated.


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## Don B

AbuMike said:


> That is one smooth FASSSSSSST reel. I would venture to say it will be most uncontrollable in real fishing conditions without some kind of breaking. Thus defeating the purpose of all the extra money spent in this reel. FASSSSSST does not always mean GOOOOD....Looks to be a GREAT Grass Carp fishing reel but thats all....


Hi Mike,

Although I consider your points to be accurate, there are some other considerations.

From a different point of view. It is sometimes desirable have a reel that can run very fast and then set it up to run properly for the existing conditions. I do not track ABU model numbers, but would expect most bait casters to come with centrifugal brakes. Other than brake blocks, oil viscosity can slow down a reel. I suspect the only true way to assess the reel is to take it to the field on a couple of occasions and test it initially using high viscosity oil and brake blocks. If a 2-pin brake block system does not do the job, 6-pin brake block systems are available.

Due to a lack of magnetic control, the reel would have limited use in catching grass carp.

From what is known at this point, I expect the reel to be a good base to adjust to a persons needs. The addition of a magnetic braking system would be desirable.


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## Don B

kingfish said:


> Not to mention the maintenance nightmare if you fished it.


Hi kingfish,

The facebook page the video was posted on, is centered around catfish.
Their reel configuration is unique and exposure to fresh water should not be a major concern.

My intent of posting the video was to show how level wind reels could be tuned.

Although I have never had to maintain a level wind reel, it does not seem to be too difficult based on the following video.
It shows the installation of kits available from ABU and Omoto.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzZ1DzRPZlQ

The kit adds one bearing in the oscillation cog wheel and two bearings in the worm shaft assembly.

There are privately done mods that add a second bearing to the oscillation cog wheel.


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## kingfish

Nighthawker, the Akios line will be a fine reel to fish with. If you can cast the old 50's reels, you will love how much tune and control you can get out of the box with Akios. It has plenty of precision and toughness as well. Not trying to derail your thread but i'm going to answer Don and you may find that tinkering with reels is a good way to get what you want from them.


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## kingfish

Hello Don,

I fish the salt, so maintenance is more of a problem than fresh. However, wet bearings are going to rust and fail without maintenance. Unless they are completely ceramic, but then i would say they need to be cleaned for best operation. lots of things contribute to water in bearings. ride twenty or thirty miles to a favorite beach in the hot summer and take your reels from the cool car and into the sun..,,condensation, if you use them, they get wet and need to be cleaned .

I look at the level wind as just another variable in the chain to tune a reel. It has to take energy from the cast to operate and I have found I do not need to speed it up to get more distance but still need to slow a well maintained levelwind down. I use the abu pro shop mostly and have one black brake filed about halfway down, one standard issue bearing and and one bush in the spool. That gives me a two bearing reel and one of those is anti-reverse. I like to keep it oiled up or it gets a little fast. I have hit slightly over 500 feet in the field with a two drop rig and plastic sandfleas, 90 gram sinker....My preferred pomp rod these days is a CPS 11' 2-5. I was not casting against the wind in the field.....lol... I can hit it as hard as I like, without blowing it up,(most of the time), if I am pretty smooth.

The reel with extra bearings and fine tune will have to be slowed to cast very well, just as ABU Mike suggests. It would be interesting to see if an adjustable mag might get a little more distance. I still would hate to take care of nine bearings. Hell, I can't even figure where the last two are, unless they are in the each of the paddles on a twin paddle handle.


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## Don B

Hi Kingfish,

It is rare for me to cast smaller reels. I have cast some great reels that had bushings. The only issue was ensuring you had heavy enough oil in the bushings.
Regarding the reel in the video, the only real way to determine its functionality is to cast it. We do not know the characteristics of the bearings. 

I consider the number of bearings to be somewhat of a fad. It is what people want. Often we have to look around and see what others are doing and ask ourselves WHY ? 

One IAR
Two spool bearings
One in the oscillation cog wheel.
Two in the worm assembly.
That makes 6 and should be all that is necessary for performance.

Other possible bearing locations
A second in the oscillation cog wheel
A bearing in the left tensioner
A total of 4 bearings in a handle (2 in each knob of a double paddle handle)
And if you have a thumb release spool (thumb bar), that's a target for two more bearings.

Did I miss any?


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## poloman

The CPS might have my favor for a rod choice. It loads nice and easy, and recovers smoothly. I'll be picking one up in the future for lighter duty beach fishing, most likely in a spinning configuration.


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## ShoreBird

bronzbck1 said:


> If your going to be casting lures I would get a level wind but if you need distance go with a non-level wind. I fish 6 Akios reels year round and love mine. They hold up nice I just wash them off with freshwater daily. As for a 11 foot rod Carolina Cast Pro makes the best 11' rod out there. They have a 2-5 oz and a 3-6 oz 11' rod. I wouldn't trade my 2-5 oz rod for any rod out there. That one is parabolic and throws really easy!


+1

the Akios level wind will get you back into conventionals with the least amount of headaches


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## Tommy

NH,

The Akios reels are top quality and cast great. Out of the box they are user friendly and with just a little tuning can be speed demons, if that's what you like.... 

The 656 CSM is a GREAT casting levelwind reel. You give up a little distance to the CTM but not as much as you may think. If you just don't want the hassle of laying down the line then it is a very good choice.

The 656/666w CTM are my favorite surf reels. The casting performance is top shelf, the drag performs great and they are easy on the eyes and wallet. As with the CSM, safe right out of the box but can be tuned to be as fast as you want.

The CPS rods are a perfect match with Akios reels.

Tommy


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