# Should I buy it?



## Tater639 (Apr 6, 2011)

I have been looking for a black powder rifle to hunt this season, but after I shot my first deer with a bow, I thought I would just keep using bow to rifle. My buddy told me he needed some extra money and has a Traditions .54 cal sidelock that wanted to get rid of as he uses his Hawkens 10 ft musket more (Kidding on the length, but it is almost taller than he is)! It is in great shape, he always takes care of his guns. One of those mutli-color stocks, stainless barrell, 24 in barrell I think and a Bushnell Red Dot. He has speed loaders, 3 measuring powder holders, sling, extra powder and balls, and other accessories for it. Also uses #11 percussion caps. Said he would let it go for $150.

He said the longest shot he ever took with it was 60-70 yards and didn't know if it would go much more as it does shoot loose powder with ball loads. Said he tried pellets in it, but the accuracy wasn't consistent. I spoke with a Deputy I work with who said there is something about sidelocks that can't help but love them, but they aren't as good as your inlines for consistentsy and convenience. I've never shot any version of black powder, but I think I would like them. He said I could use it to hunt a couple times to try it out or just take it to a field and shoot it some.

My questions are:
1. Can I use something other than just a ball for ammo or could I use other more streamlined bullets?
2. Is this a decent gun to buy or will it break down on me b/c of bad quality?
3. Am I going to have a lot of trouble keeping the caps dry from moisture?
4. Is loose powder any more difficult than pellets if you have the measuring tools?
5. Would you buy this gun with your own money?


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## SmoothLures (Feb 13, 2008)

1. It will depend on the era its from...it sounds like it's modern with the laminated stock so you should be able to use saboted bullets or Powerbelts if you desire. 
2. Never owned or heard of anyone who has one, good or bad. Google will help. 
3. I wouldn't hut with it if it's raining. 209 primers are much more reliable. A friend had a Hawkins that was converted to rifle primers instead of percussion caps that I wouldn't hesitate to use. 
4. Loose powder works just fine and is more consistent than pellets last time I checked. The pellets can weigh +/- 8 grains of the 50 they're supposed to. With a measure you're at least getting the same volume every time. Consistency is what matters with muzzleloading. 
5. It seems fine especially with a scope and the extras. You'd pay much more than that to get your own setup.

Just a few thoughts - Google will find the manual for you on the mfg's website so check that out. Percussion caps are outclassed by 209 inlines but they do work. You could potentially change it out to rifle primers like I mentioned but it will depend on the make of the gun and if that's available. You'll also need to realize the amount of cleaning that goes on...I love shooting muzzleloaders, they're fun, but I dread cleaning them. You need to clean between shots as well if you're trying for long range accuracy. And when you clean for storage, it's certainly easier to back out a breech plug on an inline than a sidelock... 

It's certainly not a rifle though if you spend the time tuning you can get a 2-4" 200 yard gun.

Go watch this and decide if you want it. 
http://www.cva.com/videos.php

IMO $150 seems like a deal if you want everything that comes with muzzleloading.


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## Carolina Rebel (Aug 25, 2005)

This isn't fully relevant, but when I first started muzzleloading I had one of those cheap CVA Bobcat $50 Wal-Mart jobs. Plastic stock, cheaply made, but it worked. Killed several deer with it, never a misfire (did kill a couple deer on dreary days), and with the right load (it took some experimenting) I got 1" groups at 50 yards. I see no reason why the Hawken wouldn't do even better. I switched to an inline mainly because my crappy eyes needed a scope, but wouldn't hesitate to take a side lock again.


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## Finger_Mullet (Aug 19, 2005)

I refuse to buy used muzzleloaders because you never know how they were taken care of. If you know the guy and know he took care of it I would go for it. If it is stainless with a laminate stock even better. Stainless will rust but at a slower rate. I have a nickle plated CVA and it has never rusted. Even when I forgot to clean it for a month. 

You need to know the rate of twist to know what type bullet to shoot. Get a patch and place it on the jag. push it all the way to the bottom of the barrel. Mark the ram rod. Slowely pull it out of the gun. As you pull it will twist. When the rod has made one full rotation measure the distance from the end of the barrel to the mark on the rod. That will give you the rate of twist. Also as you push the patch in the gun feel for rough spots in the barrel. That will let you know if you have rust issues. 

You can use conical bullets in a faster rate of twist. 1 in 28 is ideal for sabots or conical bullets. A slower rate is more of a round ball gun. You can get a few different kinds of bullets and give them a go.


Side hammer guns have issues with pellets. Pellets were designed for in-line guns. You will have ignition issues with a side hammer gun with pellets. Stick to loose powder and invest in a good brass powder measurer. I just pre measure my loads in a quick load. 

I got started on a side hammer gun. I got tire of popped caps that did not ignite the powder. I picked up a adaptor that used small rifle primers. It went off every single time with no hang fire at all. It took a little longer to put a cap on the gun but was well worth the extra effort.
I am sure you can still get them. If not a few grains of powder under the nipple will work wonders. 

Traditions made really good guns all the way to cheap guns. I bet if it is stainless and laminate it is one of the good ones. You shoudl be able to put a scope on it as well. I would just use iron sights this year though. My eyesight sucks these days but within 100 yards it would be a dead deer if the sights are good.

Darin


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

just remember also black powder is measured by volume and not weight ... if you use 100 grains weight it will rock your world ... for me that's why I use pellets ... loose powder can be packed giving you a hotter load or if it's fluffy you get a light load ... they can get it more consistent than I can ...


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## Shooter (Nov 14, 2004)

I am not sure what the gun it's self is worth but don't let it shooting ball scare ya, the guys that I use to hunt with started laughing when I broke out my Browning long smoke pole (yup long grandpaw lookn beast) and dropped in 120grains of powder and shoved in a 54 cal round ball,,, funny how they stopped laughn when I kept a solid pattern in a pie plate at 100 yards with open sights. 

Yea I know the fancey dancey in-lines can shoot out to 200 yards with high-zoot scopes but when ya learn what to use, such as before I load mine I usally snap a cap with the barrel close to the ground till it blows the leaves away, also use a nipple pick (ok you perves) for those that doesnt know that is a small round file used for cleaning the cap hole.

My buds use to tell me they could reload so much faster, I told them to make a much better first shot and reloadn wouldn't be such an issue 

Besides, ya ever seen what a 54 cal round ball does to a deer with a well placed shot 

True enough the new in-lines are so much easier to clean but sometimes it isn't always about just the killen

Do some checking and see if the gun is worth the money and if it is Go for it.


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