# Mono vs. Braid



## JACKC

I need some advice. For surf fishing would you recommend mono or braided line and what are the advantages and disadvantages of both? I own a PENN Sargus 6000 reel coupled with a 10" surf rod. What lb. weight would you recommend for braided line? Also, would you use a backing of mono if using braided line? Thanks!


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## dudeondacouch

http://bit.ly/Q4X9C7


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## AbuMike

dudeondacouch said:


> http://bit.ly/Q4X9C7


+1...what he said...


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## RuddeDogg

Here we go...............


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## solid7

Come on now, fellas... This topic NEVER gets old!


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## River

I have a few things I'd like to say about Braid:

1. It tears up you reels - reel weren't built for all the sudden shock but reel manufacturers luv it and will build reels suggesting you use it, naturally.
2. It tears up you rods with all the sudden shock, it'll jerk the rings outta your guides but rod manufacturers luv it and will build rods suggesting you use it, naturally.
3. It tears up other people line when you cross over them or you break off in the surf ( somebody cut their braid off cause they couldn't break it on South Beach last summer, numerous people hung up on it numerous times, including me - probably caused at least several hundred dollars of damage till somebody (Me) waded out and cut it off as short as I could, I musta cut off 30 or 40 yards.
4. It tears up drive shafts, front wheel and main, prop seals on boat, lawn mower blade seals, etc. when people leave sections of it laying on the beach, campgrounds or throw it in the water, etc. - Mono's bad enough, Braids terrible (Braid line, abrazing the world !!)
5. Backlashes, fluffs and wind knots are just about impossible to get out, ya'll may not get those but I do ----

I have lots of good friends/good fisherman that use it and luv it, I've tried it numerous times and don't like it - several line manufactures are making Fluorocarbon - Mono line mixes trying to duplicate the no stretch values of braid, I have that on a small conventional rig I use for Flounders now but I don't like it either, to much memory - I'm getting ready to take it off and go back to my faverite Sakuma Line - Sakuma's Ice Crystal is good enough for me, Anybody wanna take the shocks and springs off your Truck so you can feel the road, My Opinion Only - Tell me the good things ---- if I sound negative, I am --- River


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## Charlie2

I'm with you; River..

I use the best grade of mono that I can get and have no problems with it.

I; too, have braid on one freshwater reel but I'm not overly enthused about it. JMHO C2


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## solid7

River said:


> 1. It tears up you reels - reel weren't built for all the sudden shock but reel manufacturers luv it and will build reels suggesting you use it, naturally.


I got an AVET Raptor, which *IS* specifically made for braid. I got it for pulling large fish from the surf - as this time of year, I frequently hook up with sharks and tarpon. I don't like losing line, and I don't like screwing around with fighting big fish that I'm not targeting, when my fishing time is so limited. I want it over and done with, ASAP. This reel is not much larger than a standard 6500 class reel, but holds 400 yards of 50 lb. braid. Where I use it, there isn't a lot of structure to get hung up on. 



River said:


> 3. It tears up other people line when you cross over them or you break off in the surf


I know we live in different parts of the world, so call me spoiled; if you are fishing close enough to me *in the surf* to cross my line, rest assured, you are losing a piece of your line, one way or another. Around here, that's considered very bad manners.


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## RuddeDogg

Well, speaking for me, I use braid on all of my surf set ups, except one. I have 3 Daiwa Emblem Pros, 1 Emblem Pro A and Pen 525. They all have a mono backing and 50lb Power Pro. I have never had any issues with my rods or reels. I dont have to really worry about other people as I don't fish in a crowd or near people unless it's unavoidible. I have crossed lines and have my lines crossed and yes, it does tear up mono, but that's surf fishin. It happens. As for wind knots, birs nests, etc, that's the price some pay for using braid. It's happeend to me several times, especially when I first started using it. I have used several brands, Power Pro, Suffix, Berkley, Fire Line, Spider Wire, and Gorilla Tough, just to name a few. For me, the regular Power Pro work great. I do have the new Power Pro Silk, and do not like it at all. but that is another thread. Bottom line is, you go with what works for you.


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## River

Solid7, I understand what you say about fishing to close, here on Hatteras Island, we have the Point (Diamond Shoals) where when the big Drum are biting, they form a Congo Line. I don't fish any there when thats going on but I do head there in the late afternoon to enjoy (just one of) my faverite beverages and watch the action, I'm a lob'er, not a long distance caster. When the Congo line forms you better not show up with braid or you'll get boo'ed away, braid's dang near a fightin word there so thats basically what I'm referrin to when I mentioned crossing other fisherman's lines - River


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## solid7

Yep, I've heard all about the Point, River. When in Rome, I would do as the Romans. Down here, where I can enjoy some prime surf fishing with no pressure, I have no qualms about using braid. For all things, a purpose, I say...


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## RuddeDogg

River said:


> Solid7, I understand what you say about fishing to close, here on Hatteras Island, we have the Point (Diamond Shoals) where when the big Drum are biting, they form a Congo Line. I don't fish any there when thats going on but I do head there in the late afternoon to enjoy (just one of) my faverite beverages and watch the action, I'm a lob'er, not a long distance caster. When the Congo line forms you better not show up with braid or you'll get boo'ed away, braid's dang near a fightin word there so thats basically what I'm referrin to when I mentioned crossing other fisherman's lines - River


Yup. Booed away or worse. I have heard some horror stories about guys showin up to the Point with braid. I know with me, if there are other guys fshin around me, I tell em I'm using braid. That way they know, so we don't have any issues.


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## dudeondacouch

Ah, the point. The holy grail of fishing! (Unless you want to enjoy yourself, that is.)


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## River

RuddeDogg - I repair Reels and Rods here on the Island, Some Reels with minimal moving parts resist damage from Braid very well, its the ones with Level winds that take a beating - braid will snatch the corners off the grooves in the worm gears and cause a sudden stop or clicking noise when you cast but the non-level winds do take Braid well. Braid will wear groove in the bail roller on Spinners causing them to stop rolling - it takes lots of use to do that but it happens. I do a lot of guide repairs on the older Rods because of braid, especially the more inexpensive ones but the newer Rods especially Customs with good guides will take the Braid beating well. I do understand, if it works for you - use it, a lot of my good friends and good fisherman like you use it - Jam, SusanOBX and Bronzbk1 use it, I think Kelvis the Troutmaster here on the island uses it - especially when they're Trout and Flounder fishin - throwin grubs so I'm around it a lot - River


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## greg12345

Main advantages in surf fishing is line capacity (can put a lot more on), casting distance lb for lb-test IMO, and less need to respool...I change my mono several times a year but I have had the same braid on for 3-5 years. I don't really care about no-stretch/sensitivity when surf fishing b/c I spike my rods w/circle hooks. The cons are well covered by River. 

Sheepshead fishing from the pier you will only find me using braid...


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## yerbyray

greg12345 said:


> Sheepshead fishing from the pier you will only find me using braid...


I was under the assumption that braid was not very abrasive resistant and fishing against pilings would be rather abrasive wouldn't it?

I don't like braid because it can cut to the bone rather quickly and is expensive. Knots fail and with braid you have a knot between the mono backing, the knot to the shock leader, a knot to rig/lure....plus you have to use specific knots so I tend to stick with mono which has worked for 50+ years.

I'm not against it, I just don't use it.


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## River

greg12345, an you hit the best Pro I've heard so far, Sheephead fishin around pilin's - I'm sure it works well for that -


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## J Barbosa

This is easy...braid.

mono is for rigs


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## solid7

yerbyray said:


> I was under the assumption that braid was not very abrasive resistant and fishing against pilings would be rather abrasive wouldn't it?


The point is to winch them out quickly, before they get a chance to make off into the pilings. Similar to catching fish on a reef... Get them out of there as quickly as you can, before they can find a place to run into, and risk breaking you off or just plain hunkering down.




yerbyray said:


> Knots fail and with braid you have a knot between the mono backing, the knot to the shock leader, a knot to rig/lure....plus you have to use specific knots so I tend to stick with mono which has worked for 50+ years.



I'd have to say no to using special knots. I use all of the same knots in braid that I use in mono. Braid is a million times easier to tie than mono or fluoro. In fact, knots are the one reason may guys hate braid. Not because they're hard to put in, but because they tend to stay in. I also don't think well tied join knots braid to mono are weak, or subject to higher failure rates. Braid really holds well by friction alone. One could argue that it weakens mono near the knot if not well lubricated when tied, but that would be another issue...


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## lil red jeep

dudeondacouch said:


> http://bit.ly/Q4X9C7


Thats classic!


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## dudeondacouch

solid7 said:


> I'd have to say no to using special knots. I use all of the same knots in braid that I use in mono.



Gonna have to disagree with you for once. Some knots slip very easily with braid. (Blood knot for example, is utterly useless with braid.)


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## solid7

dudeondacouch said:


> Gonna have to disagree with you for once. Some knots slip very easily with braid. (Blood knot for example, is utterly useless with braid.)


Fair enough - I didn't know... I don't use blood knots, so I stand corrected.


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## dudeondacouch

There are some others as well, terminal knots, but I don't remember which ones, because I don't use them any more. 

Palomar any time it's remotely feasible and uni when it isn't, Uni-uni for splices, modified albright for braid to mono, hollow-core splice for wind-on leader when targeting toothies.


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## Drumdum

River,like Jam,Susan,and Percy,I love me some braid... Back when fireline first hit the market: Was fishing Cheasapeake tunnel for stripers.. You'd cast a jig under bridge,allow it to drift while slightly jigging the bucktail.. It would be a VERY SUTTLE bite,just a tap.. I was using mono for this.. The first day I used the braid I found out just HOW MANY fish I missed with the mono... When sightcasting cobia or drum it IS A MUST.. Changed that out the same way..

No doubt there are many uses for mono,and I use it when it calls for it,such as at the point or on the planks.. Bottomfishing with braid off the planks and expecting to hold bottom as well as mono will surprise you.. Braid,no stretch so it slides the sinker,you will be using a 10 instead of an 8 because your mess won't hold bottom because of breaking waves or current..

All in all when it comes to lure fishing,braid has been an answer,and haven't had problems with guides nor reels failing because of the braid.. Maybe from me not being as big on keeping care of my stuff as well as I should,but not from the braid... jmo and 2 cents thrown in...


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## River

I respect your opinion Drumdum and believe what you say - but I still don't like it, just seems to many negatives for me --


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## tjbjornsen

Yeah, And that was my move, but I've been fishing so much somebody beat me to it!
But it never fails to make me smile...

I've lost track, has the OP been back yet?
;-)



lil red jeep said:


> Thats classic!


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## KevinImX0

...its just fishing line... line that gets tossed into an abyss of unknown structures and natural obstacles. highly likey you will snag, tangle, etc etc and end up cutting off line. Whether its mono or braid. Braid is a crapton stronger for the diameter so depending what lb u use, you can probably pull through snags. 

So just use mono and attach a shock leader. i go 15 lbs main with a 50lb shock leader. When i made a thread about my 50 lb shock leader everybody was so suprised... "what are you fishing for? Tuna??" but others said 10lbs per lead oz is rule of thumb. 

With a 50lb shock leader, i can pull out of most snags and problems i encounter, i might have some bent hooks, but i get all my crap back. And if i do have to cut it off, to me its just mono that cost me $2.50 for 300 yards. 

i mean its just fishing line...

but i feel like there are exeptions, when i went to New jersey at Indian inlet to fish for tautog... all the pros use 100lb braid... and i can see why... That inlet is deep too, and its like a wall of rocks straight down and the bottom has rocks that must be shaped like claws... jesus. And the tautog bite down and dive straight down with the current and go scurrying all up against rocks. Mono would get decked in this situation.


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## tjbjornsen

hollow-core splice for wind-on leader when targeting toothies"

I don't know what this is, (I can guess what the "toothies" are) and you have no idea how happy I am that this is not a knot that I feel the need to learn!


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## NC KingFisher

tjbjornsen said:


> hollow-core splice for wind-on leader when targeting toothies"
> 
> I don't know what this is, (I can guess what the "toothies" are) and you have no idea how happy I am that this is not a knot that I feel the need to learn!


Its like a chinese finger cuff, the tighter you pull the tighter it gets. It involves hollow braid or dacron with mono/flurocarbon inserted around 3 to 6ft and served on the end. They have held up to 60+lbs of drag. Its also stronger than knots if done correctly


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## dudeondacouch

Yes, even 65-80lb braid will get tailed off easily by a big biter, so you have to do something else. There are options if you're yakking out baits, but for casting there was really nothing. So I took a page out of the offshore book and started making surf-casting-specific wind-on leaders. Has worked very well so far.


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## NC KingFisher

yerbyray said:


> I was under the assumption that braid was not very abrasive resistant and fishing against pilings would be rather abrasive wouldn't it?
> 
> I don't like braid because it can cut to the bone rather quickly and is expensive. Knots fail and with braid you have a knot between the mono backing, the knot to the shock leader, a knot to rig/lure....plus you have to use specific knots so I tend to stick with mono which has worked for 50+ years.
> 
> I'm not against it, I just don't use it.


You dont need mono backing, electrical tape is just as good if not better. As far as abrasion, braid is better than mono on pylons and stuff. For sandbars and all, mono wins


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## dudeondacouch

I also use electrical tape on the arbor. Works like a charm.


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## NC KingFisher

dudeondacouch said:


> Yes, even 65-80lb braid will get tailed off easily by a big biter, so you have to do something else. There are options if you're yakking out baits, but for casting there was really nothing. So I took a page out of the offshore book and started making surf-casting-specific wind-on leaders. Has worked very well so far.


Any braid under 200 will get tailed off easily. 200lb+ is like small rope. You can make pulley rigs and stuff like that, RR has a pretty good thread in the bible. He uses different rigs now though


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## mbg60

Each line has its uses. If you fish an area with lots of structure then mono may be for you. Otherwise, braid is the bomb. If you are worried about the visibility then use some fluorocarbon as leader. If you're worried about the shock to your rods and reels then set your drag a little loser. Today's tackle is made to handle the stresses of fishing braid. And wind-on leaders are terrific too.


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## roostertail

It cost me 10 bucks to spool my 5000 series with mono. It cost 35 to 45 to spool it with braid. In my opinion braid is much harder to tie knots with because its so limp and frays out. But the cost is my biggest factor.


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## dudeondacouch

roostertail said:


> It cost me 10 bucks to spool my 5000 series with mono. It cost 35 to 45 to spool it with braid. In my opinion braid is much harder to tie knots with because its so limp and frays out. But the cost is my biggest factor.


$10 per year X 5 years = $50

$45 per 5 years X 1 = $45

Which is cheaper, again?


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## yerbyray

dudeondacouch said:


> $10 per year X 5 years = $50
> 
> $45 per 5 years X 1 = $45
> 
> Which is cheaper, again?


Well with me you would have to figure in getting wind knots, stuck on debris, tangles and other perils to line consumption.


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## RuddeDogg

River said:


> RuddeDogg - I repair Reels and Rods here on the Island, Some Reels with minimal moving parts resist damage from Braid very well, its the ones with Level winds that take a beating - braid will snatch the corners off the grooves in the worm gears and cause a sudden stop or clicking noise when you cast but the non-level winds do take Braid well. Braid will wear groove in the bail roller on Spinners causing them to stop rolling - it takes lots of use to do that but it happens. I do a lot of guide repairs on the older Rods because of braid, especially the more inexpensive ones but the newer Rods especially Customs with good guides will take the Braid beating well. I do understand, if it works for you - use it, a lot of my good friends and good fisherman like you use it - Jam, SusanOBX and Bronzbk1 use it, I think Kelvis the Troutmaster here on the island uses it - especially when they're Trout and Flounder fishin - throwin grubs so I'm around it a lot - River


River I agree with you. Braid can be rough on your gear. I've just never had an issue wth it that's all. I wouldn't use it on some reels and rods just for that reason. It's all good. Tights line.


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## NC Confederate

All right


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## AbuMike

NC Confederate said:


> All right


Almost a year old thread and that's the best you can come up with for your first post......


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## NC Confederate

AbuMike said:


> Almost a year old thread and that's the best you can come up with for your first post......


I just bought a 7000 ics abu. For surf fishing . I have never used braid before and was wondering what kind of braid line or LB of line. To use ... Any thoughts???


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## NC Confederate

Thanks y'all ... Sorry about my first post. Really new to this computer thing... Thanks again


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## Drumdum

dudeondacouch said:


> $10 per year X 5 years = $50
> 
> $45 per 5 years X 1 = $45
> 
> Which is cheaper, again?


 Yeap,no doubt IF you know how to use braid,break it in as well as pack it on right,no issue with windknots.. Matter of fact,had many more windknots with mono.. I use the grey original fireline,till it is almost as white as the crystal stuff they sell,catch plenty of fish on it and it's still good without breaking off fish.. I buy bulk spools of fireline,have had the spool of 20 for over 5yrs now,bear in mind I'm filling 4 spinners and take customers out catching cobia and drum.. Still have enough to fill em up again... 



AbuMike said:


> Almost a year old thread and that's the best you can come up with for your first post......


 Figured I'd add to it Mike,might get this redundant thread started again...


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## Drumdum

NC Confederate said:


> I just bought a 7000 ics abu. For surf fishing . I have never used braid before and was wondering what kind of braid line or LB of line. To use ... Any thoughts???


 Use 14 to 17lb mono.. I'm a braid guy with spinners,hate it on baitcasters.. If you backlash you are talking a pain in the arse with braid. jmho...


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## Yakkin

NC Confederate said:


> Thanks y'all ... Sorry about my first post. Really new to this computer thing... Thanks again


Not to worry, you aren't the first poster to reopen an old thread.


River said:


> I have a few things I'd like to say about Braid:
> 5. Backlashes, fluffs and wind knots are just about impossible to get out, ya'll may not get those but I do ----


Wow, I love braid cause it backlashes less for me and when it does I can clear it easier.



yerbyray said:


> Knots fail and with braid you have a knot between the mono backing, the knot to the shock leader, a knot to rig/lure....plus you have to use specific knots .......


I just use the recommended knots, works for me.


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## Kellercl

I am a bit late to the discussion but want to add my 2 cents anyway. I am exclusively braid on all my gear. Braid simply lets me put stronger line on my reels compared to mono, plain and simple. I have no issues with knots nor have I had my gear beat up by it, at least not noticably. I use a Shimano Sustain, Shimano Baitrunner and Shimano Saragosa; all with braid. Why put 100 yards of 8 lb mono when I can put 150 yards of 15 lb braid? That is my logic at least. To each their own and no hard feelings. But braid has worked great for me. Occassionally I rip into a larger fish than I expect, I still can get him in. I also feel braid lasts a lot longer than mono. My reels have Power Pro that is 5+ years old, still in fantastic shape.

Edit:
Braid also casts further, at least for me.

As for knots I use uni to uni to tie braid onto my backing. I use improved clinch to tie onto a swivel which connects to fluorcabon leader. I use an 18-24 inch fluorocarbon leader because it is 'clear' and doesn't scare fish. At least that is what I have been told.


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## justafisher

I've been back and forth with braid and mono in the surf. I primarily use bait. If I were to throw a lot of plugs I would consider braid. I've converted back to mono, it is easier and more enjoyable to fish. Any kind of tangle in braid is nasty, care must be taken not cut your fingers. It's no stretch requires heavier sinkers to hold in big surf than mono. I think the give and stretch of mono is helpful when circle hooks are used. 
I also worry about braid around people swimming or jet skiing . I don't fish around bathers,but if a large fish is hooked up 30 lb braid could do bad things to a person in the water. And no matter where I fish 500yds from anyone, someone will decide to swim near me for some reason.
Also I've never had birds hit my mono and tangle, they somehow can hit braid and wrap a leg.
Braid at night for me has been a mess, tangle city. Braid to flouro or mono leader , the knots don't always flow perfectly through my guides. I get alot of loops around guides. It's all worse at night.
Braids big advantage is more distance, but to me is not worth the drawbacks . It's strong for sure , but I rarely fish more than 5-7 lbs of drag from the beach. 
I've gone back to berkely big game, 12 ,15, and 20lb. Pretty much covers everything I may encounter in the surf, aside from sharks over 7 feet. Just my opinion, fish what makes you happy


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## bloodworm

LMAO have at it guys I'm staying out and just remember use what you prefer opcorn:


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## SALTSHAKER

Been around the barn with this thread reading and watching. Boils down to this for me,,,, braid is great, for wrapping presents and tying up awnings. Cut my teeth, when I had em, on mono and have to say still like it. I tried braid, all of em, and always go back to mono. Now it is the Sakuma co-polimar and like the man says, if you like it use it.... everyone of us has our likes and dislikes and what we use.... so as I agree with River,,,, if ya like braid, there ya go,,,, if you like mono,,,, there ya go....LOL..... be safe..... salt


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## River

This is getting good --- ya'll know what side I'm on, my mind hasn't changed any from a year ago, Pier's banning it just makes my opinion stronger -- River


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## AbuMike

Why do you need 40#, 50# or 60# braid when your reel will ONLY MAKE 9 to 15lbs of drag????


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## Yakkin

Mike, heavier braid is more forgiving, can keep from breaking off on a snag and some reels allow you to lock them down. Line in the water creates it's own drag too.

I freshwater fish a lot of stump fields, braid is very handy in there.


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## Kellercl

AbuMike said:


> Why do you need 40#, 50# or 60# braid when your reel will ONLY MAKE 9 to 15lbs of drag????


I agree. I match my max drag. If my max drag is 15 lb, I put 15 lb braid on it. Braid allows me to put far more yardage.


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## AbuMike

Kellercl said:


> I agree. I match my max drag. If my max drag is 15 lb, I put 15 lb braid on it. Braid allows me to put far more yardage.





Yakkin said:


> Mike, heavier braid is more forgiving, can keep from breaking off on a snag and some reels allow you to lock them down. Line in the water creates it's own drag too.
> 
> I freshwater fish a lot of stump fields, braid is very handy in there.


I will agree to a point.........The fishing we do in the salt is a whole different animal from the catfish pond. You hang a 10/0 Drum hook and you will destroy your reel locking down and trying to pull it loose.....Just sayin


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