# Hittin tha wall...



## Custer (Jun 14, 2001)

I have 2 heavers A 1448 and a OM Heavy. I am working for "fishing" distance. Nothing fancy, nothing souped up. Consistently I can hit between 150 and 160 yards with an 8oz sinker (No bait, In the yard). There is no real difference in the distance on either rod, they both land in the same range. The 1448 is lighter and I use a Slosh-20 on it, I prefer it for wading or holding. The Om carries a Slosh-30 and is a great spike rod, and I use it when I have to go beyond 8^ bait.

Is it realistic for me to look for more consistent distance? Should I be happy with what I am doing?

I am looking at the Fusion. Can I expect more consistent distance? Am I waisting money looking for more than what I am doing?

Again, Consistency is the key (If the bait aint in the water the chances of catching a fish are seriously reduced)...

What is considered a good distance with 8oz (no bait)

Thank for you opinions...

Custer


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

Custer,

What type cast are you using?? 

450-480' with an 8oz and fishing gear is damn good heaver chunking. That probably puts you in the top 5 percent on the beach and right there with the long casting "point crowd" regulars.

Will a fusion give you more distance? Probably so. During some heaver testing a few months ago casting 8oz and it came out on top vs the inferno, the 1569 and the HDX (beat the HDX by one foot, the others by significantly more). It is a sweet rod, slim lightweight and very powerfull. 

"The Wall" can be a frustrating thing. Been there several times. I believe it's realistic for you to improve distance. You are doing a lot of things right to cast a half pound over 450'. A slight technique refinement may be all it takes to to bump you up into the 1 percentile.... 

A friend that is familiar with your cast can help. Better yet, a video camera can give you the feedback you need. That is the best way to truely know what is going on with your cast.

The single most common area of improvement is in the left hand/arm. 90% of all fishermen barely use it at all. It is kept tucked safely up close to the body guiding the butt while the right does all the work. Simply getting extension with the left and learning to "pull" along with the "push" can bring a boost in distance. Another thing is to add a little bit of body rotation. More power in the legs and torso than in the arms.

Hope this helps,

Tommy


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## Fishman (Apr 23, 2000)

I'd say 150 to 160 yards is good casting the only thing I might do is just tune up your style a little.

I wish I could cast that far.


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

*Do what Tommy says*

A tape of you casting would be a great help, I might have to try that myself  

If a Pro like Tommy says your in the top 5% I'd be grinning like the gull that stole the shrimp  

Just for my curosity what kind of set up do you have on those Daiwa's ..... Thin oil with brakes or mag ........ heavy oil and let 'er rip ? You might be able to find a little distance playing with the reels .......


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## clpoudnine23 (Dec 21, 2005)

Tommy always has good casting advice. Last spring I took a video camera to the park and shot some film of me casting 8nfakebait. After reviewing,you can really see the area's you are lacking attention in your full casting motion. There are plenty of video's clips online by some great casters (Tommy's website is one) were you can see some great casting form. I fished with Tommy two weeks ago (nice to see you again Tommy!) on the point in Hatteras and was watching his casting style for any improvements I could make. As far as buying distance with a fancy rod, more than likely it would help your distance. I know I was loving it two weeks ago when I was outcasting some of the regulars and I had my old school 1508 2/1 Breakaway. 

Charlie


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

It was great to fish with you again Charlie. You were hitting it good... 

I just reviewed the Hatteras Cast video on the website. It is actually a pretty good example of less than ideal left hand extension...  My left arm is bent at the elbow throughout the cast. A straighter left arm would mean a longer cast.

I really need to get a better example up...lol

One of the best training methods for left hand extension is the ground cast. You can actually watch the left hand as you come around, waiting for it to get out in front of your eyes before begining the "pull". The ground cast video shows a much better example of correct left arm position than does the Hatteras cast video.

There is always room for improvement, I'm searching with every practice.

Tommy


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## kingfish (Feb 28, 2004)

*out there*

Wayne can't beat Bob, Bob can't beat Mike, Mike can't beat Rolland, Roland can't beat Tommy, Tommy can't beat Danny...............Whoops
Wayne can beat Bob


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## Custer (Jun 14, 2001)

Tommy,

I am using a sorta modified Hatteras cast, I start slightly to the side when going back, and sorta "round-house" forward.

Reddog was my first teacher and he was adamant that I get the left hand more involved, But I am positive I am not using it enough.

I do get my waist involved, as a matter of fact I was told at the point once that my length was a function of my "counter-weight" (Spare tire)..(LOL)

I find myself casting lower than I want alot, but I think that is programmed in my head to avoid the head on winds I seem to fish mostly in.

I will try and get my cast video-ed. I will let you know once I do.

Thanks, 

Custer


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## surf rat (Jun 30, 2004)

*150 to 160*

150 to 160 with an 8 oz sinker and fishing reel is a long cast. If that is a true distance you are among the elite casters with 8 . How are you measureing the distance? I would say you should be able to cast 8 and a small bait 135 to 140. That is world class. I have fished with Rolland several times and that is a good cast for him. I can cast 8 and small bait about 120 to 130 yds. Rolland uses the same 1448 blank you have. I throw an Inferno. I think you are casting far enough to catch fish anywhere.


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

Red Dog was one of my early teachers too. We were lucky to have known him.

I try to use the "casters bubble" to my advantage as well...lol. It helps when hitting the heavier weights.

Send me a clip (video) When you get it done if you want. 

Tommy


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## LarryB (Apr 29, 2002)

*Casting Seminar For Northern VA*

Tommy,

I know that the Holidays are upon us but we should talk about having you come up to Northern Virginia this spring for a seminar. There are certainly enough fishermen who would like to improve on their Hatteras and beach casting. This maybe a good time to see how many people would be interested in attending.

Let me know your thoughts.

LarryB


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## Custer (Jun 14, 2001)

surf rat said:


> How are you measureing the distance?


An honest question, and one of the reasons I hate to post distances...

I own 14 acres outside of Wakefield, VA. When we bought the place, I was shooting and golfing alot. Luckily for me the property is a combination of swamp and old ag land. We left a long open "Range" that is measured with a wheel for shooting / golfing / casting. Maximum length from end to end is 590'.

I casted both rods 4 times using an 8 oz bank sinker tied directly to the shock leader.

I knew where I casted from and have a solid measurement to the "Flag" which is 140 yards from casting point. I was anywhere from 10-20 steps beyond the Flag.

My paces are based on 5 years in the USMC and 20+ years as a construction inspector / manager. My paces run between 3 and 3 1/2'. I have a measuring wheel and will re-verify.

I have spent alot of time on the point, and probably am within the top 10 or so % of the casters. My biggest problem is the 7 surgeries I have had on my right wrist, elbow (re-attached common extensor tendon) and shoulder (Rotator cuff, bone spurs, collar bone re-section). I am only good for about 8-10 casts at a go, and then I need rest. After a large Ray, I may be shot for the night..but I never give up...I caught a Manta ray that was foul hooked. took over an hour with the drag locked down, and trying to break off (Reddog and Dawgfsh taught too damn good knots  )..and it was blow up city for the rest of the night. I know I need to work on strength, but the recovery from these surgeries run into years according to the Doc...

So, my distances are more honest then my fish tales...


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

custer,

i know that this isnt your most frequented board, but nobody here is doubtin ya. surf rat is among those elite down there at the point as well.

i've actually been keepin an eye on this thread as well. because i am having the exact same problem you are. I can cast an 8oz sinker around 160toppin out, but once i get a bait on there its not very pretty. I feel like i've gotten to this place and cant reach any more no matter what rod or reel combo i use........ i have hope even tho im little! hell i've even thought about getting a casting lesson even though i think im a bit proud to have to pay someone to help me cast. 

neil


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## barty b (Dec 31, 2004)

*lemme ask you guys*

Do you guys use a clip down/pulley rig or are you throwin a straight drum rig? Reason I ask is that down here, I don't really 8-n-bait much but when I do (shark fishing) I use a clip down rig, Its basically a drum rig with a longer leader piece, and the lead between two swivels with a "clip" at the top. What this does is puts the cumbersome wind draggin bait BEHIND the sinker in flight. The sinker creates a slipstream in the air and the bait has much less drag. without this type of rig my casts are reduced by 30-40% as opposed to with it. Now I am hitting 140 yards with 8-n-bait on a good day/good conditions,but then again I dont have to hit much more than 110 where I fish. Just a suggestion and what works for me.

http://home.earthlink.net/~biters/pullyrig.htm

This is from SuBourbon (RIP Bro) I use this rig for sharks but you could scale it down for drum.


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

barty b said:


> http://home.earthlink.net/~biters/pullyrig.htm
> 
> This is from SuBourbon (RIP Bro) I use this rig for sharks but you could scale it down for drum.


you knew russ? he was a great guy man... i was over at taters house today and saw conlin wearin the pair of coveralls that russ had given him...... yeah the clip down... im kinda lazy.

i do use it shark fishin tho with the 400lb mono!


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## barty b (Dec 31, 2004)

I never met him face to face,But he helped me out alot with good advice and was always willing to share knowledge.

give the rig a try for drum fishin,you might be suprised


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

Larry,

How are you buddy??? Hope all is well with you and your family.

I'd be glad to come up for a seminar. Just need a suitable field/beach and to work out a date.

Tommy


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## surf rat (Jun 30, 2004)

*Thanks Neil*

Neil, you can cast as well as anyone. You catch your share of fish as well. I'm fishing Thursday. Are you working?


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## DickDog (Jul 19, 2006)

I dont think anyone suggested line change. If your throwing 20-30#test (a guess) on your slosh you might want to downsize for more distance. I know that i can throw 17# alot further than 20# on my 525 mag. You'll compensate for line strength with extra yardage.
Give'er a try.


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## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

surf rat said:


> Neil, you can cast as well as anyone. You catch your share of fish as well. I'm fishing Thursday. Are you working?



will be down on the island early wed


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## Custer (Jun 14, 2001)

NTKG....Trust me, I meant it that it was an honest questionand no offense was taken. I sure hope my response communicated that...

Hell, I question half the distances I see, and few of what I hear  

I really just frustrated at how quickly I loose strength and rythm and go to blow up city....

The quacks got me on new meds though and.....hopefully they'll help in maintaining strength...

we'll see....

SEAYALLONDABEACH !!


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## LarryB (Apr 29, 2002)

*Spring Casting Seminar In Northern VA, Who's Interested*

Fishermen and Fisherwomen,

We all wrestle with improving our casting techniques so that we can reach beyond the outter bar. I would like to findout how many people would be interested in attending a seminar this sping hosted by Tommy Farmer? I do not have any details of the cost which will be forthcoming if we have enough interest. Let me hear from you.

LarryB


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## Fishbreath (Nov 11, 2004)

Hey Larry, count me it for that. I know I can use the added help. The assist from you this Fall was great. If both you and Tommy are there, even better!


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## barty b (Dec 31, 2004)

*I would suggest*

for anyone wanting to improve their technique or gain distance,to attend a seminar hosted by a professional. Our surffishing club held a day last week with Neil Mackellow, Now everyone there(almost) were "good" casters,capable of 120+ yards,But we ALL learned something that helped us even if it was just a small pointer,it makes a big difference. Neil is an assc. member of the club so it was a free and informal day,but I learned a few things I was doing wrong and have benefitted from it. There is a HUGE difference in tournament casting and fishing casting but then again there are fundamental similarities that will allow you to put your bait out there,sometimes with less "effort" than you might think. All the really good casters adound here (myself included  ) can make a really long cast look effortless when properly executed, on the other hand an improper cast can look strained, akwardly forced, and fall way short. I have a lot of respect for the guys on the point tossing 8-n-bait all day,it is physically demanding an requires stamina.
So bottom line is get some pointers from the pros and work on your technique,nothing improves like practice. Oh yeah, lighten up on the line as much as possible, that will give instant gratification with added yardage.


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## Lip Ripper (Dec 8, 2003)

i in for a nova seminar!! there was talk of one last year, but i dont think it panned out. if you need a place, there is a park here in fredericksburg(prat park) that is nice its about 800x500yds of nothing but grass!!!


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## LarryB (Apr 29, 2002)

Thanks Lip Ripper,

We have a park here between Centreville and Manassas that is large enough to toss some baseballs or lead but I'll keep your suggestion in mind also. A lot of people have asked me about the Hatteras cast and Tommy can certainly help them with that. Not only is he a great caster with a Hatteras cast over 600' using an 8 oz sinker but he has become a real student of the sport and has learned from some of the best in the world. A lot of us are good casters but poor teachers and I think that it's great that he is willing to share his knowledge and time with us. If you are interested in adding distance to your fishing cast for the Big Drum or Cobia then this should be a great opportunity to break through that wall. I do not have all the details at this time but I'd like to know that we had at least 15 people interested so that I can start the process with Tommy.

Thank you for your input and I look forward to seeing you on the field.

LarryB


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## CrawFish (Sep 23, 2003)

I'm in and also count on some of the AC will be there. I spent a day last spring w/ Larry, what a day it was. I learned a great deal of things. I gained over 20yards on my cast after that day. I was happy w/ my cast before I showed up, but I was hitting the wall as well. After Larry show me how to transfer the weight, the arms straight, the push & pull, I was putting the weight further and further out.


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## notso (Jul 18, 2005)

I'd love to attend also.


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## AtlantaKing (Jul 7, 2002)

Me too. Just let me know when and where


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

Thanks Larry,

I would be glad to come up for a seminar. For those that don't know me, my roots are in surf fishing the beaches of NC. 8nbait is often needed to hold bottom or to "fit in" with the crowd at cape point. The Hatteras Cast fits the bill nicely for this type fishing, especially on a crowded beach. 

I believe the ground cast is the fundamental cast that gives you the foundation for all the other casts. The body rotation, arm position and punch-pull learned practicing the ground cast can be applied directly to the Hatteras Cast and the Pendulum.

I like to keep the classes small, 15 or so unless I can get the right person to assist then the class size can be expanded. I like to provide one on one attention to as many casters as possible.

Let me know,

Tommy


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## VA-Apraisr (Jul 31, 2001)

Larry: If you get the seminar going, count me in! Would love to learn some more. Would also be nice to see you fellows again!

John


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## LarryB (Apr 29, 2002)

John,

The only way that you would get an invitation is if we get to pick your brain on Drum Fishing. You are in my friend.

LarryB


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## AtlantaKing (Jul 7, 2002)

I want in too!


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## jcreamer (Mar 6, 2001)

*Count me in*

I would like that as no-one needs the pointers like I do.


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## Catch This (Nov 19, 2005)

Just noticed this thread. If there is a seminar put together for northern va, I am interested


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