# Reel Position High or Low



## fishwatson (May 20, 2009)

I have been watching and can't find many casters that throw high reel could someone explain why? If hands are in same position in a high reel as low reel why would it really matter!
Thanks,
Ricky Watson


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## fish bucket (Dec 5, 2002)

aahhh....but they are not in same position.
high reel,you are holding reel with right hand
low reel,you are holding reel with left hand
changes the dynamics of push/pull
i'm sure some of the top casters will weigh in on this subject


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## fishwatson (May 20, 2009)

what i am trying to say is if your hands are spread 30 or so inches apart what difference does it make what hand the reel is in.a right handed caster will still push with right and pull with left. Please beat it up gentlemen i need answers not just that is the way so and so does it and he can cast a long ways.


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## fish bucket (Dec 5, 2002)

Reason for low reel? 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have a question for the masses. Why do you think low real works for some? 

I have a 1569rs built low reel that I never really used much. My last trip to Hatteras I was practice casting with my friend who built the rod for me and who fishes low reel some. He's a very good caster and the wind was blowing 30 down the beach so the fun began. We both started trying the OTG since we had a forgiving wind and no one in sight. No really impresive numbers, but it started feeling better. After casting for about an hour non-stop, I realized that low reel suddenly didn't feel very awkward anymore. 

I left Lee with a new blank to build low reel for me. It's one of the new Daiwa Salitiga 40-405's that I really like, that has great power and a thin butt. I'm thinking that the small diam. will be a little easier to get control of the reel than the thick 1569. I'm pretty excited about trying that rod in that configuration. 

Here's where I get back to the reason I'm asking. My thoughts are that it let's my right hand concentrate its power to the push and lets it free float to the exact sweet spot for me on the reach. I don't feel like my left hand is really inconvenienced by holding onto the reel. After concentrating on the OTG and not thinking about low reel, it just started feeling pretty natural. Just wondering what others thought of the benifits of this style.

Thanks, Ken Dillard. 




i feel like it helps utilize the entire rod in loading. its almost like adding some length to your rod without changing the casting characteristics. my .02 
__________________

#3 04-06-2008, 04:02 PM 
Tommy 
DISTANCE CASTING SPONSOR Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: wilmington n.c.
Posts: 1,619 

Low reel does seem to work better with a longer rod. Neil Mckellow pioneered low reel back in the 80's when he was experimenting with long rods. 

The mechanics of gripping the spool with a pulling left vs a pushing right makes it easier to apply grip power to the spool. The right is freed up for the hit and that does seem to help with the transfer of power.

Some prefer high reel, but most serious tourney casters end up with the reel down low.

Tommy 


#4 04-06-2008, 04:11 PM 
SINNER 
Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: LOUISA VA
Posts: 45 

I have also noticed that I seem less prone to fluff with that setup. I was thinking that giving it more space between the spool and first friction point (guide) helped in that matter. 

The loading the entire rod theory has me interested too. I feel like I'm getting more with less.


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## Hudak (Sep 10, 2007)

So in other words....



fish bucket said:


> changes the dynamics of push/pull



Robert


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

fish bucket said:


> Reason for low reel?
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> ...


Hi Tommy, agree 100 percent

PS, hows it hanging these days with you and Kim???

BB


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

Hello Neil,

Kim and I are doing great. We moved into a new home last fall and are still unpacking boxes..lol.

Four weeks from today we are flying out for the big trip to the UK. We'll be there from the 5th-17th of Aug.

Will you be attending the Zziplex and/or the Wales events?? Hope to see you while we're over. 

Tommy


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

Hi Tommy, good to hear you are both doing OK.

Would be great to meet up, the Zziplex do should be a great time.

What are you travel arrangement once you fly in, you are welcome to stay with Carol and I...... OK for huntingdon not good for Wales.

Let me know - Neil


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## curtisb (Jul 21, 2004)

fishwatson said:


> I have been watching and can't find many casters that throw high reel could someone explain why? If hands are in same position in a high reel as low reel why would it really matter!
> Thanks,
> Ricky Watson


Are you talking tourney casting or fishing here. In Texas most people throw high reel while fishing and some throw low reel for tourney casting. I myself fish high reel and use low reel for tournies. I started out practicing for tournies with high reel and switched to low reel and stayed with it because it felt better and I could hit better with it. I still use high reel for fishing because of the more leverage I can put on a fish when reeling in.


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## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

fishwatson said:


> I have been watching and can't find many casters that throw high reel could someone explain why? If hands are in same position in a high reel as low reel why would it really matter!
> Thanks,
> Ricky Watson


It's generally easier to maintain your grip on the reel until the right moment when you are pulling the reel into your body as opposed to pushing it away from you. OF course the counter point to that is that in low reel most are now gripping the reel with their non-dominant hand (left hand if right handed caster) so, if that left hand grip is not suffieciently strong-- it may not offer that great of an advantage in that aspect.

In low reel, the reel does perform more like a counter weight on the rod, at least to a small degree this should add to the speed that can be applied at the hit. In high reel, you are fighting to push both the rod and weight of the reel away from you, in contrast to low reel, where you are pulling the weight of the reel "down" and into you.

Lastly, I agree with what others have said-- it just seems easier to get a more effective push with the upper hand, when it is not doing double duty trying to control and grip the reel as it is being pushed away.


One downside to low reel is you have to be careful of top hand placement-- so as not to interfere with the line flow coming off the reel. I also do not use low reel when fishing, it is more akward and you give more advantage to a big fish when trying to fight it in a low reel position-- altho I am sure that there are many who use a reducer and low reel when fishing, so it can be done.


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## Tacpayne (Dec 20, 2008)

I just Started learning the low reel position on a Beach blank I bought from Tommy in Charlotte, after one day of about6 casts, I can say it doesnt feel ackward any more. It has messed my timing up a little, but not terrible. I have had a problem getting a good hit, as Mark pointed out in Charlotte I was chopping wood. I focused on it with the high reel, with limited success in altering my cast. When I went to low reel, Out of my 6 cast 4 I had good hits on. It did seem to make a difference for me. I was casting a baseball with my fishing reel, just to work on technique, so I cant say if there is any difference in the distance with my improved hit yet.


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## curtisb (Jul 21, 2004)

Ok, this is a double posting........


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## fishwatson (May 20, 2009)

The info posted will be studied well. Thanks to all that had comments I am working on my tournament cast and was just trying to convince myself that I can throw better with high reel, I guess because it has not become second nature yet. Thanks again. and sorry for the double post first time posting.
Ricky Watson


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## kingfisherman23 (Dec 14, 2003)

Hey Ricky, and welcome to the forums.

I had the same question about high/low a few months ago, so I decided to do a side-by-side comparison with the same rod and reel in both positions. With a full-rotation OTG I snapped off two in a row high reel. I tried a third time and it was shorter than my shortest low reel. I slowed it down and realized that in high reel one of two things were happening with the reel mounted high. I was either naturally putting too much pressure on the reel and releasing too late when I hit with the right (thus digging the shock) or pulling back with my right hand when releasing the spool with correct timing (thus reducing the force of the push).

I'm not a top caster (yet), but this is just what I observed. 

Evan


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## Big Dave (Jan 22, 2001)

In my humble opinion, I think it has more to do with monkey see monkey do than anything else. When you punch a rod with your right hand and you are holding onto the reel with your right thumb pressing down on the spool, when you do you are actually applying more pressure on the spool than if you were holding under your left thumb using your left to pull toward you. That said I think it mitigates the better grip argument. In my years of casting I have done both, and I don’t recall a time when I had a high reel slippage, but I can’t say the same about low reel. Is it because I low reel cast 70% of the time? Maybe, I can’t say for sure. The best high reel caster in this country is Jerry V. and not many T-guys have bettered him on the field. Some of the elite have but the list is not long. What I would like to have seen, would have been a Jerry V in his prime, (not that he’s over the hill) with what he knows now and the equipment now available, what he would do with high reel. That in its self might put an end to the debate over high or low reel. I also watched Hector years ago use a fiberglass Fenwick rod, I think it was a 1688F with a high reel ABU 6000 with bushings cast in excess of 720 feet high reel. I really believe casters cast low reel because of success of others that have done well with it and it is now considered the norm in the sport. Being the R+D mechanical engineering type that I am? I think my monkey see monkey do theory holds as much weight as any of the arguments I have read over the years on the topic. 

Geezzz BB look what you started, its all your fault

Big Dave


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## curtisb (Jul 21, 2004)

I also made reference to Jerry and Hector on this subject in the other posting by the same name. They were probably two of the best at high reel casting on the field.


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## Kwesi W. (Apr 14, 2006)

Let' not forget about Angel V. aka Texas Tornado.. He uses High Reel an he's a GREAT caster, and still a good age to put up good numbers. 

Im a left handed guy who cast right handed and for me the low reel postion has made a world of difference. Having my strongest hand holding the spool has stopped my thumb from slipping.

I do however agree with Big Dave, I think alot of it is monkey see monkey do.. I truly beleive if Tommy and Troy broke 850ft while wearing rainbow colored spandex shorts with "SPORTCAST USA" on the butt, most of us would have them by the next tourny... LOL


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

kmw21230 said:


> I truly beleive if Tommy and Troy broke 850ft while wearing rainbow colored spandex shorts with "SPORTCAST USA" on the butt, most of us would have them by the next tourny... LOL


You mean you didn't get yours????


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## Big Dave (Jan 22, 2001)

kmw21230 said:


> I do however agree with Big Dave, I think alot of it is monkey see monkey do.. I truly beleive if Tommy and Troy broke 850ft while wearing rainbow colored spandex shorts with "SPORTCAST USA" on the butt, most of us would have them by the next tourny... LOL


What a perfect analogy, My only hope would be video could be taken and put on Ytube


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## Black Beard (Jan 25, 2001)

Ok OK, I admit it's MY ALL FAULT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I produce a new a style in 1981 and I get pegged in 2010

Cheers dave, I will get my big brother in Rhode Island to beat you UP - LOL

How's it swingin Big Fella?


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

There are some great points in this thread. I'm not going to technobabble, just keep it simple....

To me, low reel just _*feels*_ right. 

I fish high reel but when I'm looking for maximum distance low reel just works better for me. Feels better balanced and in my opinion allows for a better spool grip.

Tommy


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## Kwesi W. (Apr 14, 2006)

No I dont have mine yet.. I can hear Willie Longcaster (and Mark G) already " Hey Bob why does Kwesi get to use two 14ft poles" LOL


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## Kwesi W. (Apr 14, 2006)

Big Dave said:


> What a perfect analogy, My only hope would be video could be taken and put on Ytube


That Youtube can be dangerous.. LOL I just wish it was around when you were active in casting. I have heard good things about you and would like to see some footage of that Gentle Gaint from Mass. LOL


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## Kwesi W. (Apr 14, 2006)

Black Beard said:


> Ok OK, I admit it's MY ALL FAULT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I produce a new a style in 1981 and I get pegged in 2010
> 
> ...


This may sound corny but it's awesome to have past and current casting greats on here chatting it up.. It makes me want to grab a pole and run towards the closest field I can find..


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## Big Dave (Jan 22, 2001)

Neil 

Good to see you mate (virtually anyway) Things with me are well, Life’s good for sure, and hopefully the same with you. The weather here in New England has not been that great so far this summer, cool and rainy, Just the pits, which is too bad considering summer is so short up this way. The bright spot for me has been the fishing, it has been just awesome. I’m getting out on the water as much as possible, and I fish the Cape Cod Canal when times allows. Hopefully sometime we will be able to get together and wet a line. 
Big Dave


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## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

Big Dave said:


> In my humble opinion, I think it has more to do with monkey see monkey do than anything else. When you punch a rod with your right hand and you are holding onto the reel with your right thumb pressing down on the spool, when you do you are actually applying more pressure on the spool than if you were holding under your left thumb using your left to pull toward you. That said I think it mitigates the better grip argument. In my years of casting I have done both, and I don’t recall a time when I had a high reel slippage, but I can’t say the same about low reel. Is it because I low reel cast 70% of the time? Maybe, I can’t say for sure. The best high reel caster in this country is Jerry V. and not many T-guys have bettered him on the field. Some of the elite have but the list is not long. What I would like to have seen, would have been a Jerry V in his prime, (not that he’s over the hill) with what he knows now and the equipment now available, what he would do with high reel. That in its self might put an end to the debate over high or low reel. I also watched Hector years ago use a fiberglass Fenwick rod, I think it was a 1688F with a high reel ABU 6000 with bushings cast in excess of 720 feet high reel. I really believe casters cast low reel because of success of others that have done well with it and it is now considered the norm in the sport. Being the R+D mechanical engineering type that I am? I think my monkey see monkey do theory holds as much weight as any of the arguments I have read over the years on the topic.
> 
> Geezzz BB look what you started, its all your fault
> 
> Big Dave



Of course , new guys will copy what the older more experienced guys are doing, that's only natural and to be expected. 

That being said, if guys like Tommy,  (BB), and Big Danny, not to mention many,many others, have had, or are having, extreme success with low reel, then that speaks for the method itself. 

The Why does it work ? question is inevitable, but the fact is for many, it just does. And that should be ample enough reason for anyone to at least try it.

Every individual should try both styles, and decide for themselves, not just use one style because "it's the way someone else does it".


BTW-- if Tommy ever does show up at a tourny in


> rainbow colored spandex shorts with "SPORTCAST USA" on the butt


 LOL

Well, let's just say I'd sooner take up another sport than play monkey see, monkey do on that one. LOL


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## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

I was thinking (sorry :redface some more on the stronger grip concept.

I have had many more thumb slips on high reel than low reel, tho both have occurred. I have to say that no doubt the high reel slipping is at times partially do to a wet line (fishing).

I can't nail it down in engineering terms, but I do have an anology.

What happens when the wife hands you that jar of peanut butter with the stuck lid and asks for some manly assisstance in opening it ?

Do you hold it far away and try to unscrew it ? Not likely. You may hold it out and give it a test turn, to see if it is "really" stuck. So then what happens? The natural inclination is to pull the jar in very close to the body to get a "better" grip on it, because when the hands are farther away they can't apply or maintain an increasing pressure without the lid slipping in their grip. If this still fails we may reach for a towel or something similar to grip the slippery lid with... (inner tube anyone ??  )

OK, so that low hand should be far out in front before the actual pull on the cast, right ? True, but the pressure to hold the reel spool, from the hit, builds up as the push/pull is being executed and as the need to hold the reel steady increases, in low reel position, the reel is moving ever closer to the body. 

Hopefully this makes sense, if not, oh well, I tried.

BTW, these are just my thoughts, your mileage may vary.


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## Hudak (Sep 10, 2007)

Throw what is comfortable, and keep the peanut butter off the threads so the lid doesn't stick.

Robert


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## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

thekingfeeder said:


> Throw what is comfortable, and keep the peanut butter off the threads so the lid doesn't stick.
> 
> Robert


Now that just may be the best advice I've read yet. .. 

LOL


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## smartie (May 6, 2008)

I have similar problems with high and low reel (multi) 
I have small hands (that does not help)
In the low position I get deposits from the thumby on the leader and the running line. It is not reel slip prior to the release its due to my thumb not coming far enough away from the line after the release. I have no problems high reel.

I believe that when the rod butt goes from parallel to the body to angled into the body. In the low reel position the hand works a bit like a plumbers wrench and the pressure on the reel from the thumb increases. In the high position this is in reverse. This does not mean either positions are best, just my expieriences. Ultra slim reducers 18mm O/D to hold the reel are not easily obtained.


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