# Ft Story Access - Update



## Dixie719 (May 12, 2003)

Thanks to all of those who made this story happen!

*http://www.wavy.com/dpp/military/Group-seeks-fishing-access-at-Ft-Story*

Way to go DS422!


----------



## Dixie719 (May 12, 2003)




----------



## Juan_EZ (Apr 10, 2006)

*Good on the Navy...*

in my opinion... keep it closed to the public. with all the spec war teams already there and the ones that are looking to move in... they do not need the general public to have the ability to "accidentally" stumble on to their property. 

although i'm a Navy verteran, i do not have access to the base either. so yes, i loose out too. but i look at the big picture.

the whole public access thing on the site said that it will remain unchanged... well they were probably just thinking about the lighthouses and not the fishing access... an oversight. i'm sure they will make the change to further clarify that.

to me National Security trumps simple pleasures of fishing.

and yes, i expect a total #$%&* storm to follow this... so let it begin!


----------



## jay b (Dec 1, 2002)

Steve you guys at VCAN continue to ROCK !! Thanks again for all the hard work you all do and for everyone else (Juan) lets just "un-pucker" a little and remember why the military works so hard for us ordinary citizens ......... Freedom.


----------



## pirateM (Aug 23, 2010)

Juan_EZ said:


> in my opinion... keep it closed to the public. with all the spec war teams already there and the ones that are looking to move in... they do not need the general public to have the ability to "accidentally" stumble on to their property.
> 
> although i'm a Navy verteran, i do not have access to the base either. so yes, i loose out too. but i look at the big picture.
> 
> ...


x2, op-sec takes pri. its a military base, c'mon people.


----------



## Dixie719 (May 12, 2003)

pirateM said:


> x2, op-sec takes pri. its a military base, c'mon people.


Eighty to One Hundred Thousand people a year drive vehicles onto the Base to visit the Lighthouse and Memorial and park in the exact same and let me emphasize *exact same spot as people who access the beach.*

What's the difference it you go the lighthouse or memorial to visit or to the beach to fish? You know how many of those people visiting the lighthouse and memorial take a walk on the same stretch of beach we are talking about trying to have access to fishing on....probably half to 3/4 of the 80-100 thousand! Keep in mind once you show a valid ID and go through a car inspection, your free to drive on...NO Military ID required!

Not asking to go deep into the base, just asking for basically the exact same access as those who access the lighthouse and memorial. 

Honestly I doubt they will ever do it due to $$$, but they need to move the gate further into the Base anyway to alleviate the whole lighthouse issue to begin with!


----------



## sgtcupps (Sep 28, 2009)

thats my favorite spot dude ...i live right across the street in the berraks


----------



## SkunkApe (Dec 9, 2006)

It's possible the new command is thinking about the ramifications of opening up the beach to "tourists" during the summer. Who's to say the proverbial family from Ohio won't set up shop on the beach all day? It cost money to have extra security, trash pick up, manage parking problems, etc. Will Security say "You can't hang out on the beach all day, but if you're fishing it's ok."?

Skunk


----------



## Dixie719 (May 12, 2003)

SkunkApe said:


> It's possible the new command is thinking about the ramifications of opening up the beach to "tourists" during the summer. Who's to say the proverbial family from Ohio won't set up shop on the beach all day? It cost money to have extra security, trash pick up, manage parking problems, etc. Will Security say "You can't hang out on the beach all day, but if you're fishing it's ok."?
> 
> Skunk


There has never been an issue in the past and I hear where you are coming from, but bottom line is bottom of the beach backs up to north end of Va Beach anyway as the south end of dam neck backs up to the north end of sandbridge.

Family from Ohio can come set up camp all day now as it is visting lighthouse and memorial while having a picknick in parking lot. Even when it was open, not a ton of people fished it, due to having to get issued a fishing pass from the base thats the ironic part! Will have to have security there one way or other with 80-100 thousand people a year visiting lighthouse alone! A few fisherman here and there is not going to make a difference in that!


----------



## Fish4Food (Jun 17, 2004)

I see both sides of the issue. I agree public access should be allowed to the greatest extent possible... but at the same time if the Navy does not have the security to patrol the beaches (i.e. opening them to the general public) then allowing fishing is an added liabiity. The lighthouses are a problem the Navy inherited when ordered to merge with Ft. Story (via BRAC).. allowing those visitors onboard is not a business they want to be in I'm sure... I also doubt 80-100K people visit the lighthouses annually. 

In the post 9/11 world, installations are targets, and to make matters worse.. people are litigous, wanting to sue the government for anything and everything.. so, them trying to limit access and still be consistent with their security posture makes sense to me. 

I guess moving the gate would cost some big bucks, but would fix the lighthouse access problem.. but wouldn't do anything for public fishing.


----------



## Dixie719 (May 12, 2003)

Fish4Food said:


> I also doubt 80-100K people visit the lighthouses annually.


Fact that many do!


----------



## Fish4Food (Jun 17, 2004)

Fact eh? Ok.... Seems like a kinda high number, but it is the symbol of Va Beach... in any event, this just further justifies the need to limit access to the rest of the base and fence it off imo.


----------



## Dyhard (Oct 24, 2002)

The military has always known that community relations are paramount and is important for mutual respect.
These kids, that are our military, all have our support and respect.
Offering a couple of token fishing spots to the community is not going to dismantle this nation's security.
I have fished this area for 40 years, the military that I know and love would not slap us in the face by keeping us out!


----------



## Juan_EZ (Apr 10, 2006)

pirateM said:


> x2, op-sec takes pri. its a military base, c'mon people.


thank you... at least you know and respect the fact that Ft. Story is in fact a military installation. operational security trumps all matters, i'm glad someone understands that.

i mean really... Norfolk Naval Station, and Dam Neck both offer fishing too but is only open to active duty personnel and retirees but no one is bitching about that.

yes as a fisherman, it sucks that another fishing resource is just out of reach from the general public, but also as a Navy veteran, i understand the need to close it down. 

at least i've done my time... and sacrificed my life out there... just so jayb can fish... you're welcome.


----------



## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

SkunkApe said:


> It's possible the new command is thinking about the ramifications of opening up the beach to "tourists" during the summer. Who's to say the proverbial family from Ohio won't set up shop on the beach all day? It cost money to have extra security, trash pick up, manage parking problems, etc. Will Security say "You can't hang out on the beach all day, but if you're fishing it's ok."?
> 
> Skunk


arent you the one who was advocating and showing pictures of burning fires on chix?


----------



## NTKG (Aug 16, 2003)

Juan_EZ said:


> thank you... at least you know and respect the fact that Ft. Story is in fact a military installation. operational security trumps all matters, i'm glad someone understands that.
> 
> i mean really... Norfolk Naval Station, and Dam Neck both offer fishing too but is only open to active duty personnel and retirees but no one is bitching about that.
> 
> ...


the navy didn't teach you very well how to aim and be sure of your target before you shoot. Why don't you ask jayb about his career before you open your mouth. 

the worst thing in the world to see is military and LEO that think they deserve to be thanked for a job they were paid to do.


----------



## Juan_EZ (Apr 10, 2006)

NTKG said:


> the navy didn't teach you very well how to aim and be sure of your target before you shoot. Why don't you ask jayb about his career before you open your mouth.
> 
> the worst thing in the world to see is military and LEO that think they deserve to be thanked for a job they were paid to do.


ok point taken... i shouldn't have said what i said to jayb... i'll take that back. 

just the whole issue about beach access... i just think it should be up to the military whether or not to keep it open. if they close it... they close it, if not then its cool.

if i had offended anyone... i apologize.


----------



## LKSalty (Jun 19, 2007)

*Ft.Story Access*

I see no problem in allowing public fishing near the lighthouse and to use the parking lot and the beach access ramp, pull out my surf rod and sit on the beach for a few hours in the daylight. This is just another land grab by the people that make the rules. GOOD LUCK !!!


*PS: We need a new version of the Bumper Sticker and state motto showing a fisherman with a big " X " over it instead " Virginia is for Lovers " to show it does not include fishermen unless you are on a boat or pay to be near the water and that also goes for freshwater access as well.*


----------



## SkunkApe (Dec 9, 2006)

NTKG said:


> arent you the one who was advocating and showing pictures of burning fires on chix?


Yeah, that's right. In fact, our organization has gone world wide! 
*SAFE* (Skunkapes Advocating Fires Everywhere)


----------



## DS422 (Apr 28, 2004)

Juan_EZ said:


> i mean really... Norfolk Naval Station, and Dam Neck both offer fishing too but is only open to active duty personnel and retirees but no one is bitching about that.


The entire point of the Fort Story issue is the Army allowed this access for years and there has never been a problem. Go to the gate, show your ID, go to headquarters, show your ID and VA state fishing license and you were issued a base fishing pass for the year. There are only a fews locations on the base a person could go to fish. Fishing was only allowed from sunrise to sunset, with the exception of near the harbormaster where it was allowed until 2200 hours. The Navy takes over operational control in Oct. 2009 and says it's no longer allowed.

All civilians entering the base to go to the lighthouse have to go through the same security checkpoint at the East Gate and they do not have DOD security clearance. The Navy's statement that only people with DOD security clearance enter the base is false.

VCAN started a dialogue with the NAVY over three years ago notifying them of this public access issue and asked them to continue with the Army's policy. We are not asking for them to open up Damn Neck, Little Creek, Naval Station Norfolk, etc. We are only talking about Fort Story since this public access had previously been in place.


----------



## jb1edlover (Jun 12, 2010)

I have to play the devils advocate here.... While I don't see how letting folks fish in the same area folks are allowed to view a lighthouse as being a problem you don't have to look beyond this website and even this "virginia" section of Pier and Surf to find problems with letting folks on a military installation for recreation. 

Couple of things I've found (in less than 10 minutes of reading) that show even fish'n folks for whatever reason break the law..... 

1. Someone caught and kept an illegal flounder and posted photos of it, (no matter the reason and logic behind it, it's illegal)
2. Someone mentioned when a certain pier in Newport News closes you can still fish on it if you don't mind climbing the fence. (sounds silly but illegal non-the-less)
3. Someone was discussing today about fishing on the rocks (and they admitted isn't legal) but they did it anyway. 

What I'm trying to say is even though the few things posted above aren't "major" deals they are still illegal. You can't pick and choose which laws mean not letting folks fish there. Law breakers are law breakers and jumping over fences to get to areas when closed is the kind of problem you can't have on a military base. Now add to the equation "sensative" military training that goes on here, then you're opening a can of worms letting anyone with a Virginia license on the beach there. Is it the only beach in the area? No.. someone further up the thread said, it borders N. Virginia Beach... then why not just go there? When military bases open the gates for airshows, 4th of July and other celebrations it's a security nightmare and that is when it's manned and planned with careful thought.


----------



## andrew k (Oct 12, 2007)

funny.....about a month ago i drove right on fort story with a buddy in the car, the rent-a-cops didn't care to look at my CAC badge or his id. granted this was on the weekend, but i told them i wanted to go fishing and they let me right on. no vehicle search, no checking in, no nothing......didn't matter really, all we did was fish the rocks (which we were told was ok).

i dont really want to get into this pissing match, i support mark and the VCAN guys all the way, but what i wanted to say is that the military is the military they do what they want when they want. there are alot of things they do that i think is stupid, but they do them for their reasons, and there isn't much that the public can do to change it. did you know they disabled all our microphones in our laptops because somebody found a way to hack in and enable the microphone to listen to our conversations? the threat levels change all the time which creates headaches for the rest of us, military or not. with the joining of fort story and little creek, there is a lot more 'activities' going on now that the public doesn't need to know about, or be a part of. anywho thats my two cents.

i think we should open it up to the public, and if some family from ohio ventures into the wrong area, shoot them. problem sovled. lol


----------



## jay b (Dec 1, 2002)

Let me get this straight, no one owes me anything I just believe in the freedoms that this country was founded upon and enjoy using them responsibly. I also truely respect everyone that works hard to protect them.

I grew up in a military family with a Dad that flew with the Marine Corps for 30 yrs. and even though I choose not to join the military myself I have worked in the defence industry as a DockMaster in a local ship repair yard picking up all classes of naval vessels for over 30 yrs. now.

Believe me it was absolutely weird when they took the Marines off guard duty at all Navy and Marine Corps facilities and it just didn't seem to be as secure with the rent-a cops there instead. That has changed somewhat since 9/11 and I understand the need for extra security in todays world however that shouldn't mean closing down the entire base to protect certain areas.

Even at facilities like NOB you can access most areas with the right decals but when it comes to walking on a ship or in certain buildings forget it unless you have the proper need and clearance.

Thanks again to all that are or have served and remember we need your help and respect here in our own country just like we do overseas. :beer:


----------



## rattler (Jul 3, 2004)

jb1edlover said:


> I have to play the devils advocate here.... While I don't see how letting folks fish in the same area folks are allowed to view a lighthouse as being a problem you don't have to look beyond this website and even this "virginia" section of Pier and Surf to find problems with letting folks on a military installation for recreation.
> 
> Couple of things I've found (in less than 10 minutes of reading) that show even fish'n folks for whatever reason break the law.....
> 
> ...


So a base with What, 5000 people can't find someone stand POST on a road/beach? There are some great places sweet and salt on our local bases. they used to be all open. The navy/marines/army were all for it. WE WERE LOCAL and showed the around. It was an enjoy where you are thing. I fished with some and went to history with some. Can we do this again.


----------

