# Revolver Surf Plugging Rod



## skunk king (Mar 25, 2008)

I'm rebuilding my WRI 1143 following the same design as Rich Forhan's revolver rod for bass fishing. My deviations are 

using a single piece of shrink wrap(but with no foam underneath) instead of a split grip
I will have a butt wrap of some sort, but I can still feel the blank since it'll just be thread epoxy and not grip material
I will use double foot guides instead of single foot 

I have one size 16 fuji guide, one size 12, then eight size 10s with a size 10 tip. I taped it up and it threw much smoother than this blanks previous incarnation which was the traditional cone approach. But I didn't really get into it to test the distance because we still have snow here, the weight was really digging in, and I didn't feel like putting on my boots to throw in the backyard Most of the snow should be gone today, so I'll get some better casts this evening. But just from what I did, the rod felt awesome. Better action on the tip, more sensitivity, and it felt stronger. And it was smooth as butter with simple lobs. Can't wait to see what it'll do when bringing the violence. 

Has anyone else tried this yet? How did you like it on a surf rod? I'm half way tempted to try micro guides, but that would eliminate using a shock leader. If I don't go full micro, I may try building one with as micro as I can get on a surf rod with size 6 or 4 guides. As I use smaller guides, I'm not sure at what point the knot of the shock leader will start damaging the guides. With a plugging rod, I won't need a shock leader most of the time, but will wish for it the couple of times I send metal into outerspace 


Revolver Rod


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## CraigG (Sep 25, 2006)

I've been thinking of doing the same thing to a AFAW surf rod that I don't much care for the way it is, but I've made different decisions than you.

From what I've read about doing the transition guides on spiral surf rods, the O'Quinn method is preferred over Forhan's revolver method. Have you heard otherwise? I'll be using the O'Quinn method.

I'll be trying to keep the guides toward the tip of the rod as light as possible. To me that means single foot guides as small and light as is practical. My shock leader knots will easily pass through size 6 guides and probably 5's, but the Breakaway spin link at the end of the shock leader will only pass through 8's. For practical purposes, I'll use Fuji Titanium single foot 8's for running guides.

I'm a complete novice at this, so I'd be anxious to hear your or anyone else's thought on the matter.

I hear Charlie2 is an expert on spiral surf rods. Maybe he'll chime in and offer some sage advice.


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## Charlie2 (May 2, 2007)

*Spiral Surf Rods*

An expert is someone is over 5 miles from home. In my case, it's learning from mistakes. I am hardly an expert; just fool around with stuff and fish more than most folks.:fishing:

First; I use the O'Quinn method. It gives you an almost straight shot to the tip. I have been experimenting with another method but will probably go back to O'Quinn. If I get the other to work, I'll advertise the fact. If not, you won't hear about it. Don't believe the old saw about not getting the range as a conventionally wrapped rod.

I use double footed guides as transition guides; you don't really have to, but I find two wraps to be a tad more durable than single. I use singles all the way as running guides. Use the same number of guides as you would with a conventionally wrapped rod with the same spacing. Use charts only as a reference point. *EDIT* You can use double footed guides as running guides if it makes you feel better. Singles make for a lighter tip. works better for casting. IMHO

Two rules' per se(the only two that I really have), are (1) the first 180 guide has to be in front of the flex point and (2) a minimum of 24-36 inches to the butt guide. I know that I'll catch h*** for this one, but it works. *EDIT*: I told you so; I didn't really notice the length of your rod, so it may vary a bit. May require tweaking.

Use a good lline. I use 17-20# test Tri , but mono will work. Just don't overload the reel gears with humongous lines. Think about the mule when you load the wagon!

That's about all that I can think of right now. I'll probably think of something else just as I post. Just ask questions. That's the way that I learn. I don't always have an answer but we'll learn together.

I'm pacing at the bit. Almost cobia season.

I think that you'll be happy with the spiiral wrap. I haven't wrapped but one conventionally wrapped rod in several years. JMHO C2


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## skunk king (Mar 25, 2008)

thanks for the input guys. I'll taped up a O'Quinn version and see how that does vs. the revolver. I think on this blank, it won't make any difference since the butt is so strong. But we'll see.


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## Charlie2 (May 2, 2007)

*Spiral Wraps*

Be sure to post results/impressions.

I learned the Roberts Wrap from Joy Dunlap himself and use it but can't get the distance on a surf rod. It transitions in a few inches while other methods take longer. I haven't really studied the Forhan Revolver Wrap, but understand that it's similar.

I use the Roberts Wrap for freshwater and light inshore saltwater rods but use the O'Quinn Method or slow spiral, for surf fishing applications.

Let me know how you do. Im always interested. C2


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## skunk king (Mar 25, 2008)

Charlie2 said:


> Be sure to post results/impressions.
> 
> I learned the Roberts Wrap from Joy Dunlap himself and use it but can't get the distance on a surf rod. It transitions in a few inches while other methods take longer. I haven't really studied the Forhan Revolver Wrap, but understand that it's similar.
> 
> ...


Will do. I was hoping to have this done by now, but am pursuing my other passion of barbecue tonight  Making a bacon explosion then off to the midnight show of Watchmen. 

I'll post my thoughts as soon as complete.


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## skunk king (Mar 25, 2008)

Taped up with the revolver rod method and then the O'Quinn. Didn't see much of a difference in casting between the two just based on guide angle and quickness getting the line under the blank. But did see better distance getting the stripper guide closer to the reel seat with either method and the O'Quinn method felt superior for fish fighting. Seemed just that much effortless on the static test. 

So my take away is getting a stripper guide relatively close to the reel is the largest factor for casting. Getting the line under the blank faster improved the feel.


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## Charlie2 (May 2, 2007)

*Spiral Surf Rod*

I haven't forgotten you; just doing some researching.

I can't comment because I don't know what your set up actually is.

Most of the people that I talked to consider anything that transitions under the blank is a 'Revolver' Rod.

AFAIK, it's a 'Bumper Rod; pure and simple.

I don't know what casting distances that you are involved with but mine are 150-200 yards and I can definitely see a difference with different set ups. 

I can use the Robert's Wrap which transitions in a matter of inches with light saltwater and freshwater rods. It definitely won't make much of a difference under those applications. JMHO C2


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## skunk king (Mar 25, 2008)

Charlie2 said:


> I haven't forgotten you; just doing some researching.
> 
> I can't comment because I don't know what your set up actually is.
> 
> ...


A revolver rod is much more than a spiral wrap. It's more or less a minimalist approach to rod building that also features a spiral wrap. The qualities are outlined above.

For my setup, the original spiral transitioned as follows measured in degrees.

0, 30, 120, 210.
So the stripper guide was aligned dead center with the reel seat, then took 3 guides to transition fully.

I then changed to the following.

35,120.

So the stripper guide starts the transition and it's complete by the second guide.

I didn't notice any casting difference between the two setups, but the later felt better in static tests so I went with it.


I also played with moving the stripper guide in relation to the reel seat. In general, I got better distance the closer I placed the guide to the reel seat up to about 12-18 inches.

I can post pics later. Thanks for the help.


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## Charlie2 (May 2, 2007)

*Revolver Wrap*

I've done a lot of reading(and asking) about the Revolver Wrap in the past few days and am impressed with it. I am not going to abandon the O'Quinn for my heavy, long range surf rods by any means, but will probably use it on the others. 

I have a new respect for the Revolver Wrap as developed by Rich Forhan. 

Thanks for making me look. I like to find out about new things.

Like you say, it's more than a spiral wrap.

I was mistaken and I apologize.

BTW; 18 inches is the recommended minimum for the butt guide.  C2


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## skunk king (Mar 25, 2008)

Charlie2 said:


> I've done a lot of reading(and asking) about the Revolver Wrap in the past few days and am impressed with it. I am not going to abandon the O'Quinn for my heavy, long range surf rods by any means, but will probably use it on the others.
> 
> I have a new respect for the Revolver Wrap as developed by Rich Forhan.
> 
> ...


No problem and no need to apologize. 

I see them as complementary technologies and not competing. In my opinion, a revolver rod just has a spiral wrap, not necessarily it's own type of spiral wrap. So my rod is still a revolver, even with the O'Quinn spiral which is closest to what I did thanks to your advice.

I sat in on Rich Forhan's speeches at the rod expo and they were very impressive. His techniques were created for bass rods and I think much of the philosophy is applicable to surf rods. Thus my plugging revolver was born.

In Rick's lecture, he also talked of micro guides. He said his eyes are too bad to use them and he has a butt load of size 6 guides, so he's sticking with regular guides. But continued that micro guides are an interesting technology and fit in with his revolver rod. He said the next generation of builders will have to flush out the kinks as he is retiring from building.

I also love learning of the various building techniques and thank you for pointing me to O'quinn.


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## Charlie2 (May 2, 2007)

*Micro Guides*

On my surf rods, a 6mm is a 'micro'; it's all relative. Knots to consider. C2


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## Charlie2 (May 2, 2007)

*Micro Surf Spiral Rods*

Here I am again; like a bad penny! Just letting you know what I've been up to and into.

I have been doing some heavy testing with a 12 foot UL surf pugging rod for about a year now and am well satisfied with the results.

I couldn't find the blank that I really wanted, so stripped a 12 foot B&M crappie pole and rewrapped it as a spiral surf plugger.

I built this rod for casting the small(er) Pompano jigs but have tried it with a heavier plug (up to 5/8 oz) and it works real well.

I used 6mm guides for the running guides with a 12-10-8 double footed transition guides. The running guides are single footed with a locking wrap. You can use a Forhan. It casts as smooth as butter.

I caught fish of all species with no problem as that long rod literally whooped them. I also caught a 38lb cobia which decided on a tiny Pompano jig for lunch.

I have some 4mm that I May, stress is on MAY; MIGHT or whatever try on a surf spiral blank of some kind.

I have an AFAW Estuary(11 foot) which is between strips right now for a possible candidate. I have looked at(and for) these little boogers. Right now; I'm well satisfied with 6s so may stick with them.

BTW; I used this rod strictly for plugging(jigging) so a shock leader knot to bang things up isn't a factor. I do use a short 'bite' leader which doesn't come back through the guides except for storage.

Oh yes; I still use 6 lb test mono with a fluorocarbon bite leader. You can use braid if it keeps you happy.

I just thought that I'd check in with a status check and to let you know that I'm not in jail or whatever. :fishing:C2


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## skunk king (Mar 25, 2008)

Nice!

Thanks for the update Charlie.


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