# I was bored sooooo.....



## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

I took a pro rocket that has been very good to me for several years and converted it to non LW and added the speed bushing. I had an old c3 ct mag frame sitting around so i used the two screw caps after removing the lw guide bar to cover the holes. Also used the spool from that ct mag reel and the ABEC5 bearings. Man this thing is fast now. Almost scared to throw it as i am sure it will be a blow up my first time. But it is faster and feels smoother then the Akios SCM Shuttle and Akios 651 CTM i have. 

The frame is going to be upgraded to QTC if they ever get...

back to me ...
Looks so much better also.


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

Nice I'm in the process of building another 7500 CT


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

dres79 said:


> But it is faster and feels smoother then the Akios SCM Shuttle i have.


Good on you for modifying. It's a beautiful thing to tinker with positive results.

Now I don't mean to poop on your party, but if your Shuttle isn't keeping up with this reel, you may want to undress it, and give it a good once over. I spent a lot of time tinkering with my Abus, throwing almost every known performance trick at them, (without going to all aftermarket parts) and I don't think any of them are better than my Akios Shuttle. Not to take away from what you've done - just be aware that the Akios should not be lagging behind a modified Abu in any way...


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## HStew (Jan 8, 2009)

If that reel did good before ,it should serve you better now. Alright!!


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

"just be aware that the Akios should not be lagging behind a modified Abu in any way... "

Why pray tell would the Akios be so superior Mr. Solid, especially if one does not need a magnet to control spool speed

I have a couple circa 1985 Abu Garcia 7000C's with updated ceramic bearings and each has a spool shaft that has been professionally honed by several million spool revolutions, including at least a couple weeks or so of actual elapsed time being bowed up to paper Drum, not to mention an entire month or more in 24 hour days being bowed up to Sharks and Flattosaurus and Cobes..... you can't hear the clickers anymore but they are still fine casting reels


By the way *"nice looking reel"* original poster, it solves the problem of ones thumb and the level wind bar


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

Garbo solid is a scientist. Were supposed to smile, nod, and trust him


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

thing is for me with the Akios if they are a total knock off of abu's but upgraded a bit it sounds like a lawsuit will come along and close them down ... if apple can do it to Samsung ... yada yada yada


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

Ok let me start with by faster i mean grabbing the reel and giving it a good ol spin.... The Abu right now is spinning longer then the Akios. I have removed the centrifugal blocks from both. Other than that the Akios is pretty much stock. I haven't had the chance to go out and cast both to see what i can do and to do a real comparison. 

Also i love the Akios. I have been fishing Abu's for years and have tried other reels but nothing felt right to me until i got the Akios. Now i know that they are " knock offs" but they way i see it is that the Akios could have been a big failure. 

Now as for the "tinkering". This is the first reel that i have ever converted. Abu's always worked for me and as years went by the better they worked for me. But i wanted more so i pulled the trigger on it and made what i wanted. I am sure that some of you could take it apart and give me more pointers critic it and in the end i would have a better reel. But for being my first mod i am happy with the result and have learned from it. 

So now with that said. Lets talk Akios give me ideas as to how to make a good thing better.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

NC KingFisher said:


> Garbo solid is a scientist. Were supposed to smile, nod, and trust him


So what do you have to add?


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Garboman said:


> Why pray tell would the Akios be so superior Mr. Solid, especially if one does not need a magnet to control spool speed


Have you personally thrown one? Mind you, it's a simple yes or no question...




NC KingFisher said:


> Garbo solid is a scientist. Were supposed to smile, nod, and trust him


Same question for you, smacker... Have you thrown an Akios Shuttle reel? (like I need to ask) 




dres79 said:


> Other than that the Akios is pretty much stock. I haven't had the chance to go out and cast both to see what i can do and to do a real comparison.
> 
> So now with that said. Lets talk Akios give me ideas as to how to make a good thing better.


I haven't had mine as long as some of the others, so others might answer better. Pretty much all I needed was a little bearing dressing. It spins up real fast, and due to the solid frame, it's super smooth. It casts better than every last Abu I own. Now granted, I didn't have my Abu reels modified in a laboratory, but they're certainly no slouches.

I have quite a few Abu reels, and I looked for quite some time for an "upgrade" to the reels I have, while maintaining a "fishing" focus. (as opposed to setting up a tournament reel) I have been nothing but pleased with the Akios Shuttle. 

I'm not a fanboy of any particular brand - I'll use whatever works best for me. There are flaws with the Akios, to be sure. And it's not such a huge improvement over the Abu that I feel the need to throw them all away, and start fresh with Akios reels. I just think that you need to a whole lot of modifying to an Abu to make it throw better than your Shuttle, and by the time you get there, you've already bought the Shuttle...

I don't know every trick for modifying an Abu, so I stand ready to be rebutted.


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

but in a shuttle you have almost $300 in it right off the bat ... I aint payin that for just a reel


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

and the Tourno is over $300 ... sorry unless I either hit the Lotto or suffer major brain damage I'll never pay that


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

solid7 said:


> Same question for you, smacker... Have you thrown an Akios Shuttle reel? (like I need to ask)


Nope, ol smacker is a ******* who only throws his abu 7000 and penn 9s. Ocasionally a 545gs and even an ol 209 or 525mag But as i have always said, i will outcast you all with my 9/0 and a kayak



surfchunker said:


> suffer major brain damage I'll never pay that


Must be what happened to our scientist


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

I really wasn't trying to start a pissing contest here. Was just posting to show my first conversion. 

I plan on mounting both reels on this weekend and see what happens. My predictions is that the Abu will get bird nest at first until I get the hang of it. The shuttle I have thrown and felt really good. 
Now my main thing is to fish both and eventually get the Abu on either an HDX or get another Tommy CPS. Another reason for the Shuttle and converting the Abu was for distance casting as I would like to get into that! 

So my .02: I like both reels. I will pick those two over my Avet any day!


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

Solid7 has gone limp1


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

dres79 said:


> So my .02: I like both reels. I will pick those two over my Avet any day!


Im still tryig to figure out who thought those would be good to cast. I have one avet reel and cant wait to get rid of it!!!!!


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

surfchunker said:


> but in a shuttle you have almost $300 in it right off the bat ... I aint payin that for just a reel
> 
> and the Tourno is over $300 ... sorry unless I either hit the Lotto or suffer major brain damage I'll never pay that


You do, of course realize, you're basically saying this to a guy (who isn't me) who is talking about a reel he already owns? Is the implication that people who own these reels are brain damaged? Lotto winners? (let's just be clear)

The tourno may be great for distance casting, but not such a great pure fishing reel. I know that I'm not the only one who has that opinion. I'm sure that if you are a pure distance tournament caster, you can easily put that much money into building a reel. It might be a bargain, for a purpose built reel. 



NC KingFisher said:


> Nope, ol smacker is a ******* who only throws his abu 7000 and penn 9s. Ocasionally a 545gs and even an ol 209 or 525mag But as i have always said, i will outcast you all with my 9/0 and a kayak


That's all fantastic to know - nevermind that it's completely irrelevant to this topic...

Trollin' is awesome, ain't it? With any luck, you'll actually be good at it, someday.


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

just saying I won't pay that, never said that anyone that has one is brain dead or rich ... for other people that might be an acceptable price


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

solid7 said:


> Trollin' is awesome, ain't it? With any luck, you'll actually be good at it, someday.


I was serious. U know i aint figured out what this trollin stuff yall joke about is? Only thing ive heard called trollin is what rich people do off a boat


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## BubbaHoTep (May 26, 2008)

NC KingFisher said:


> I was serious. U know i aint figured out what this trollin stuff yall joke about is? Only thing ive heard called trollin is what rich people do off a boat


http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/03/magazine/03trolls-t.html?pagewanted=all&_moc.semityn.www


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## Shooter (Nov 14, 2004)

dres79

You did a great job on the mods to that reel and it ought to be faster then slick lightning.

Since no one else will step up and say sorry for turning your thread into a kiddie pissen match the next one that feels it is his duty to wizz on someone will get their very own personal golden shower.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Shooter said:


> Since no one else will step up and say sorry for turning your thread into a kiddie pissen match the next one that feels it is his duty to wizz on someone will get their very own personal golden shower.


I'll say it... I'm sorry if there was a wrong impression coming out this all... I didn't think it was a "pissen match", but I guess I understand that from your point of view it was tantamount to a hijack. (I thought it was all in good fun) Sometimes what I say comes across different than what I mean. 

My only point in posting in the beginning was to point out that for 2 "just for fishing" reels of this class, there's no reason that the former performs better than the latter. (like the OP says, the modded reel is probably too fast to fish) Garbo is right, if you strip them both back to bearings and a spool, you should expect pretty much the same result. Put them together, add a mag, and set it up for distance fishing, and you will (should) see a difference. It was meant to be constructive - possibly the next challenge for when the OP gets bored. Hopefully that can still be taken out the discussion.


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

"(like the OP says, the modded reel is probably too fast to fish) Garbo is right, if you strip them both back to bearings and a spool, you should expect pretty much the same result. Put them together, add a mag, and set it up for distance fishing, and you will (should) see a difference"

I tell you what Solid

You take your Akios whatever model and any heaver you want on earth (Keep in mind you may loose it in the Skunk down)

I will take one of my old circa 1985 7000's and circa 1984 Fenwick Big Surf Sticks (ancient technology, mag system is in my mind and thumb)

We throw a 175 gram competition sinker so we can get them to fly good

We only cast one time over grass, one cast, loser gives up rod and reel to the winner

If I happen to win I will give your rod and reel to the first Afghan Vet that speaks up for it

If I loose you can probably get around $250-$300 for a ready to go Fenwick Drum rod

No science involved here you just have to throw harder


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Garbo - this isn't personal. It's about the equipment, not the individuals. The guy has both reels, and I'd like to see him get the best out of both of them. And I chimed in because I've been in his shoes, already. I went through all of this looking to satisfy my need to tinker, and "make my stuff better". Like somebody told me, when I first started trying to stretch the distance - "you can make a reel as fast as you like, but it ain't any good if you can't control it." Well, I can't control a wide open reel, and I didn't want to take the time to learn. I'd rather have something a bit more forgiving, cause I know I'm gonna screw something up, sometime.

If you are trying to prove a point that you are the superior caster, I'm not gambling on that. I concede that you surely are. This is NOT about what 2 different reels do in 2 different sets of hands. (that's never a good way to test anything)

Like I asked you in my PM -- what would a modern magged reel do for YOUR casting game? Would it make you a better caster? That is an honest, objective question, that is straight on-topic. Maybe it doesn't... Maybe the same is true for dres79. But it's a question that deserves an answer, especially since he already owns the goods. 

I hope that doesn't get me a golden shower from Shooter... (I forgot my umbrella)


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

Dear Solid

I took a look at your PM

No.................... you cannot substitute someone else to take your place in a Skunk down, I might stand a chance of losing, and I never want to lose

I have a few "modern mag" reels I guess the most modern are three 525m's with the extra mag upgrades, they cast pretty good but the slider gets annoying as I have to have it set in the middle or the spool is too fast and I blow up on a hard pendulum drum cast. 

I have around seven Daiwa SL's in various configurations and they cast better than Abus, so I was giving up a handicap to prove a point about casting, it is more about technique than something that can be bought online......

To me the whether the spool is controlled by a mag or a centrifugal brake does not seem to make a great deal of distance difference
it is more about being smooth and fully loading the rod for me, I never touch the spool until the end of the cast unless I am throwing a 9000 or an 8600 which need a bit of slowing down in the very beginning sometimes,


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## wdbrand (May 24, 2007)

Go gettem shooter!!! Reminds me of an ole HS cheer. Kickem in da shin, kickem in da knee, din kickem in da a$$ and makem pee.


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## jakuka (Oct 12, 2009)

modest6 said:


> Now I don't mean to poop on your party, but if your Shuttle isn't keeping up with this reel, you may want to undress it, and give it a good once over. I spent a lot of time tinkering with my Abus, throwing almost every known performance trick at them, (without going to all aftermarket parts) and I don't think any of them are better than my Akios Shuttle. Not to take away from what you've done- just be aware that the Akios should not be lagging behind a modified Abu in any way...


Sometimes the things you write may not always come across as sincere. I'm not claiming that you mean it to be that way, just how some might see it. Comparing stock reels I wouldn't doubt what you're saying. But if a man wants to modify his reel and says he achieved his desired performance and is happy with the result, more power to him.


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

I am sorry for the trouble i caused, andd for hijacking the thread. Solid dont worry to much about the umbrella, shooters golden stream is like an sos signal as he is getting up in his years, and thats only when it works OP, that is a nice mod, now u just gotta slow it down some. And Jakuka, thats freaken hilarious


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## jakuka (Oct 12, 2009)

nc kingfisher said:


> and jakuka, thats freaken hilarious


Sometimes, in ill-fated attempts to parade their supremacy, imitating slim shadys expose their own naiveté and must be asked to sit down.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

jakuka said:


> Sometimes, in ill-fated attempts to parade their supremacy, imitating slim shadys expose their own naiveté and must be asked to sit down.


Nevermind...


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

Ok. Back on track.....

Got a chance to blow it up  .. I mean cast it. Out of 4 casts blew it up on the last tryin to blast it. Nothing bad but I need to learn to control it out of the hole better. 

Right after the blow up I put the Shuttle on the same rod and casted that 4 times. 

Abu faster but needs more attention. 
Akios smoother more control and I don't have to hover the spool. 

The Abu still needs work but definitely headed in the right direction. 

So now my questions. If I add the centrifugal brakes ( 2 block set up ) would that help me out the hole and during fly time? Would that hurt either distance or speed?

TIA!!!


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

The way centrifugal brakes work is that when you cast they shoot out and hit on a ring on the spool or somethin like that


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

dres79 said:


> Abu faster but needs more attention.
> Akios smoother more control and I don't have to hover the spool.


I'm not familiar with the term "hover", but I assume you mean a little side knock. Is that right? If so, you should still have that.

The Shuttle's frame adds a lot to that smoothness. If you add the QTC frame to the Abu, you should have basically the same reel. Not sure if the QTC upgrade is worth it, but it's your call. You'll probably have more money in your Abu reel than your Shuttle by the time you buy the new frame. 



dres79 said:


> So now my questions. If I add the centrifugal brakes ( 2 block set up ) would that help me out the hole and during fly time? Would that hurt either distance or speed?


It's going to slow your reel down a bit, which is probably what you will need to do, anyway. There is more than one way to slow down a reel. I don't use the centrifugal brakes, but it's one way to do it.

Maybe there are others here who can cast a wide open reel. I can't, and have no urge to attempt it. That's all my initial comments to your OP was intending to say - you can do just a basic bearing job on your Shuttle, and get it to spin just as fast, but have the mag as a means to help bring it back under control. (I can't remember, but I think the Shuttle is ABEC 5 right out of the box) I did a bearing job in my Shuttle when I got it, and it spins wicked fast - on par with any of my Abu reels - mechanical, mag, whatever.

Of course, if you want to "educate your thumb", that's all good, too. Most people that don't have to, won't. 



NC KingFisher said:


> The way centrifugal brakes work is that when you cast they shoot out and hit on a ring on the spool or somethin like that


They just change their position by flying outwards, not actually hit anything. It's the same principle as when a skater does a little pirouette.... The leg out, she spins slower, leg in, she speeds up. It's not a lot of weight, but it doesn't take much when it is spinning that fast.


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## tjbjornsen (Oct 31, 2009)

NC KingFisher said:


> Im still tryig to figure out who thought those would be good to cast. I have one avet reel and cant wait to get rid of it!!!!!


I am not about to get into the rest of the BS getting slinged around on this thread, amd the mods done by the OP look prettyy cool, 
But the above post about the Avets is what I do not get.
If you take the time to take these reels down, clean out all of the uneeded grease, clean out the bearings, and put in some hotter oil, Avets will sling the S^*t outta some rigs.
I was at the beach today, and I was throwing just as far with my Avet as I was with a Foran 5500, with the same weight.
Granted, I was throwing the Avet with a 13' CTS, and the 5500 with a CCP 11', but for (and here is the real operative word) CONTROLED casting, Avets WILL throw some baits.
They may not be out there with the hottest Abus or Akios (Is there a reason why all of these reels start with "A"?) but it is not like they are dogs limping along on 3 legs...


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

hover, he probably means just holding your thumb off the spool incase you have to thumb it a little to slow it down or stop it


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

brakes are meant to slow it at the start of the cast and mags help at the end of the cast 
statement 1 ... the force of the brake blocks is greatest when the spool is going the fastest
statement 2 ... the magnetic drag increases as the spool slows being as it slow it gets more magnetic pull ... not sure to say it exactly like I want ... then throw in the oil OMG


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

dres79 said:


> Ok. Back on track.....
> 
> Got a chance to blow it up  .. I mean cast it. Out of 4 casts blew it up on the last tryin to blast it. Nothing bad but I need to learn to control it out of the hole better.
> 
> ...


yes brake blocks help the most at the start ...


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

Yes. Hover: is thumb very close to control the line from nesting. 

Going to have to add the blocks from now then give it another try. 

As for the QTC frame ... Still on the fence about it. I let the reel go and only cleaned it after every season. And after fishing all weekend then sitting on the racks under the sun ... Yeahs not pretty. 

Yes the Akios out of the box are ABEC 5. 

I think my problem with the Avet is the profile being different and just taking longer to adjust. I casted that also with just 6oz on 11' Tica and got some of the best distance out of it. 

Sh*t. I got too much going on with this damn reels. 

Thanks all for the hints ideas. I'll keep posting as progress goes. 

Next steps will be the blocks on the Abu. Anyone know if the ones from Akios will work?


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

dres79 said:


> I think my problem with the Avet is the profile being different and just taking longer to adjust. I casted that also with just 6oz on 11' Tica and got some of the best distance out of it.


Everyone is different, but I like the Akios (or QTC) frame, because it's closer to the rod. I have pretty big hands and long fingers, but I'll still take the lowest reel that I can get. You may be correct, getting use to the lower profile may take longer... And learning to lay off with your thumb at the beginning. But that low profile will also give you be the best grip on the spool when you are starting the cast. For me, it's a whole lot more forgiving when my hands are wet or slimy. (talking fishing, here)




dres79 said:


> Next steps will be the blocks on the Abu. Anyone know if the ones from Akios will work?


I'm not sure, but if you PM me, I'll send you some of mine. I don't use brake blocks. I think I've got bot the fiber blocks and the plastic ones. (depending on which ring your reel uses)


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## RuddeDogg (Mar 20, 2004)

Looks nice


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

Any Brake block you can fit over the Brake pins will work, some people claim to have success with sections a WD40 spray tube, I have not found a way to cut them without distorting the tube.

The larger diameter the Brake Block the more resistance

Two Brake blocks cause more resistance, if you are using Daiwa blocks the rounded end offers less resistance than the flat ends

If you are throwing hard no Abu or Daiwa or any centrifugal controlled reel can function without Brake Blocks

I use one small fiber brake block in my Abu's 

Of all the Drum fishermen I know who are world class casters, zero of them use Avets

Avet is a pretty reel though


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Garboman said:


> Of all the Drum fishermen I know who are world class casters, zero of them use Avets
> 
> Avet is a pretty reel though


I'm not an Avet fanboy, myself, but the "thekingfeeder" seems pretty cracked on his Avets. I wouldn't have even taken a second look at mine, if not for his insistence. Gotta say that I always loved the retrieve on an Avet, even if I felt "distance limited" by them. I was pretty impressed by what can be accomplished by them, after they have been "finessed" a bit. 

Not sure if Robert registers on your radar as either a world class caster, or a drum fisherman, but being the "naive" type that I am, I have always respected what he has to say...


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

"
Not sure if Robert registers on your radar"

I think he fishes further south, never met the fella, he may bomb it out, I seem to recollect he tournament casts

I have been around a few fellas fishing Avets for Drum, but they were doing more watching than catching if you get my drift...

Keep in mind my core group of friends (Okay most of them are not my friends but I have fished with them over the years) (these people would be termed addicts, if fishing was illegal, or drum hoarders (if you could still keep em) ) values distance over all else...... over retrieve speed, looks, machined bar stock, pretty anodizing color schemes..........snappy advertising ..............pictures in Salt Water Sportsman

If a ten year old scratched up SL30SH or SL20SH outcast it, are lighter, (which equates to higher rod speed) why change?


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Garboman said:


> If a ten year old scratched up SL30SH or SL20SH outcast it, are lighter, (which equates to higher rod speed) why change?


No reason at all to change. I wouldn't think of asking somebody to change over if they are happy with what they got.

Point of note, however; it isn't uncommon to see Avet SX MC reels going in the $150 price point used. For a reel that is that well built, and that smooth on the retrieve - and will bomb some damn heavy weights - I'd dare say it's a pretty good value.

Not to open a debate on a new front - but I've never noticed a difference in my cast with a light or heavy reel. (I actually prefer a heavier reel) Yeah, the whole assembly is heavier... But if your reel is that close to the fulcrum, (your hand) how does it negatively impact the rod speed during the cast? That's the part of the rod that sees the least amount of movement during the cast. Do you suggest that it slows you down that significantly during rotation? If it was that big of an impact, wouldn't we see more casters using the low position, where the weight of the reel actually has a negating effect by adding leverage on the force side of the rod?


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## Oyster (Jun 28, 2000)

NC KingFisher said:


> The way centrifugal brakes work is that when you cast they shoot out and hit on a ring on the spool or somethin like that


Kingfisher you are correct. The centrifugal brakes work by applying pressure on that ring. In fact, that ring is a brake drum. The fact the drum was retained with the plastic block reels, where the blocks are locked to the pins, proves it’s true purpose and function, as you stated.


dres79 said:


> So now my questions. If I add the centrifugal brakes ( 2 block set up ) would that help me out the hole and during fly time? Would that hurt either distance or speed?
> TIA!!!


You will definitely need to add back the brakes (the blocks give better control than you thumb), and even at that, with the speed bushing, she is still going to be a hand full. For me, the best non-mag set up is two small fiber blocks on a round pin carriage, a clicker so the cog will add a little “fan effect” control, and at least red rocket oil. 

Some will say this is overly detuned, and for some it might be. Neil Mackellow used to preach that it is better to throw a reel that is detuned to the point that you can use it with confidence. When using a reel that is too fast, you will tend to hold back (often subconsciously) and not hit it as hard for fear of it blowing up. He found he got better distance with a detuned reel, which he could hit hard with confidence, than trying to use a very fast reel that he was afraid of.


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

guys just playing can make they spin for a minute or better just setting on a table but that reel would not be fishable ... I'm thinking I heard that one that spins disengaged for 10 - 15 seconds is a fishable detuning


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Oyster said:


> Kingfisher you are correct. The centrifugal brakes work by applying pressure on that ring. In fact, that ring is a brake drum. The fact the drum was retained with the plastic block reels, where the blocks are locked to the pins, proves it’s true purpose and function, as you stated.


I hadn't looked that closely at the older style - I was just thinking of the newer plastic style - but I thought the plastic brake blocks were non-contact. Can you confirm that this is the case on the newer style?


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## tjbjornsen (Oct 31, 2009)

"Neil Mackellow used to preach that it is better to throw a reel that is detuned to the point that you can use it with confidence. When using a reel that is too fast, you will tend to hold back (often subconsciously) and not hit it as hard for fear of it blowing up. He found he got better distance with a detuned reel, which he could hit hard with confidence, than trying to use a very fast reel that he was afraid of."

That is absolute brilliance, and I thank you for posting it.


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## jakuka (Oct 12, 2009)

Oyster said:


> Neil Mackellow used to preach that it is better to throw a reel that is detuned to the point that you can use it with confidence. When using a reel that is too fast, you will tend to hold back _often subconsciously_ and not hit it as hard for fear of it blowing up. He found he got better distance with a detuned reel, which he could hit hard with confidence, than trying to use a very fast reel that he was afraid of.


Good advice here.


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## Oyster (Jun 28, 2000)

solid7 said:


> I hadn't looked that closely at the older style - I was just thinking of the newer plastic style - but I thought the plastic brake blocks were non-contact. Can you confirm that this is the case on the newer style?


Yes, if you remove the right side plate and then slide the blocks all the way to the end of the pin, you will find that you can no longer put the side plate back on, because the blocks are now hitting the edge of the drum. You have to push the blocks back in toward the center in order to put on the side plate.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

****... You are right.


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

Ok so last night I took it apart again to add the blocks ... Akios comes with extra blocks but theydon't fit the pins of the Abu. So I'll need to add fiber blocks and rocket oil to the reel shopping list. 

Another thing I did yesterday was play around with the spool cap on both sides. I like a very small amount of "knock" on my reels but obviously by applying the pressure on that I can make this a fishing reel aswell....

Good news is we are taking a trip out to the beach tomorrow for some night fishing and I will be taking the converted to give it a good couple hours of non stop fishing. Bad news is I know for a fact I can't get blocks before then it will have to be block less with some spool cap tension. 

The set up is going to be the Abu on a CPS 11' 6-10 with 8+bait. 

@oyster - thanks for the tips. I am sure it will be de-tuned in a week


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## Oyster (Jun 28, 2000)

WATCH OUT----- You cannot use any end cap pressure with the speed bullet in the reel, it will ruin your bearings in a heartbeat and you will be buying a new set of bearings as well. Reels that came with the bullet (6500C3CT Mag Elite) were always supposed to be used with a slight side knock and never tightened down on. Doing so will push the bullet into the bearing, distorting it, and in just a few cast it will be destroyed.


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

Oyster said:


> WATCH OUT----- You cannot use any end cap pressure with the speed bullet in the reel, it will ruin your bearings in a heartbeat and you will be buying a new set of bearings as well. Reels that came with the bullet (6500C3CT Mag Elite) were always supposed to be used with a slight side knock and never tightened down on. Doing so will push the bullet into the bearing, distorting it, and in just a few cast it will be destroyed.


And thanks again!!!!


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## Drum Bum (Jan 12, 2004)

dres 79, a good tune for your reel would be cleaned and dry bearings with one drop of red label rocket fuel per bearing ( a half-a-drop if you can manage), both perfectly clean dry fiber rocket brakes and a dry brake drum. Make several casts and check for oil contamination of brakes.


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

"Not to open a debate on a new front - but I've never noticed a difference in my cast with a light or heavy reel. (I actually prefer a heavier reel)"

On the OBX in some of the most "prime" for Drum beach areas one generally is holding the rod and not spiking it or leaning it on a railing notch

After wading, constantly walking your bait down the beach due to lateral currents on OBX in prime areas, standing around in waders, holding your rod , casting, hopefully tussling with large type sea critters for several hours, make that as many hours as your are able before you give up and head to the truck..... you will change your preference from a "heavier" reel.

If my drum reel/rod weighs ten ounces less than your Avet/rod then you are out of the gate at a disadvantage in regards to physics, gravity don't care about the fulcrum point, it just conspires to slow you down.

Before you even get your rod out of the Truck you are behind, and being behind on the OBX means watching instead of catching.....


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Heck, I didn't know we were talking about humping gear... I thought you were talking about casting. But if you just mean it gets heavier carrying it around, then fair enough...


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

Just to clear it up, i dont have a problem with casting avets, i have other problems with them(It might or might not involve drag and bearings)


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

last night i ended up taking it apart again and cleaning it out a little. Bearings cleaned with gasoline. brake drum cleaned out. i had some blocks from the Abu 6501 c3 tried to add them but they are not going to work ( i dont think) very loose on the pins so left them out till i can get my hands on some made for that pin size. i had a washer on one side of the spool between the bearing and the spool housing, took that off. 

here is the result ...opcorn:







after all that had to take it apart again and added oil to the bearings (Akios reel oi is all i have) and the blocks ( still loose but they will work for now ... way to fast and i was just looking for trouble tonight on the beach at that speed. i know for a fact i cant cast that ...... Yet!!!!


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## Oyster (Jun 28, 2000)

I like that Champagne color, similar shade to my Tibors.


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## surf rat (Jun 30, 2004)

I can't believe you wont take Garbo up on his offer.....I myself like the abu 7500...If that Akios is all that you should spot him about 100 ft. He even said he would be casting with what is basically a boat antenna.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

surf rat said:


> I can't believe you wont take Garbo up on his offer.....I myself like the abu 7500...If that Akios is all that you should spot him about 100 ft. He even said he would be casting with what is basically a boat antenna.


I don't know Garbo, or any of his crew. I'd sure hate to get hustled. 

When it comes to making bets, I never put my pride before my ability. I don't know what he is capable of, but I know what I am capable of, and it doesn't make me a confident gambler.


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## Garboman (Jul 22, 2010)

"I can't believe you wont take Garbo up on his offer."

I thought he was too, I was looking forward to my new "Akios"


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Garboman said:


> I thought he was too, I was looking forward to my new "Akios"


You never for a second thought it was gonna happen. We both know you aren't a good enough troll to make it happen...


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## jakuka (Oct 12, 2009)

solid7 said:


> You never for a second thought it was gonna happen.


You wouldn't have to even do that solid. You could prove your original point if you were able to post a video of your akios spinning longer than 4 min.


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## surf rat (Jun 30, 2004)

Two words for a fast fishing reel...Zing Pow.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

jakuka said:


> You wouldn't have to even do that solid. You could prove your original point if you were able to post a video of your akios spinning longer than 4 min.


I think you're being facetious there, so forgive me if I'm misinterpreting.

It doesn't take anything to make a spool spin fast. The point was, right out of the box, the Akios is a wicked good reel. If you've already spent years "educating" your thumb, maybe you've got an edge, I don't know. Regardless, no matter how fast the reel spins, you've still got to tame it some way, and I don't see the fast reel having the advantage. (if thumb techinique is the limiting factor, and the difference between a good cast and disaster) I've got both reels, and regardless of what my ability is compared to anyone else's, I know how effortless the Shuttle casts, and how much more effort I have to put into my cast to get the same/consistent results with the "thumber" reel. Is it worth screwing around with an untamed reel for fishing? I guess that's for the OP and each individual to decide.

In my hands, side by side, I get distance easier, and more consistengly with a Shuttle than any mechanical Abu. Your mileage may vary. I'm not betting anything on it, but I'd sure like to see the results played out with both reels side by side in the hands of a caster who is well versed at casting both setups. I'd bet on the magged reel 99 times out of 100.


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## jakuka (Oct 12, 2009)

I was just giving you a hard time about:



solid7 said:


> ...the Akios should not be lagging behind a modified Abu in any way...


No worries though- all in good fun. I understand what you're trying to say. I prefer magged reels myself as well, but only because I have an easier time tweaking the braking than I do with brake blocks.


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## Hudak (Sep 10, 2007)

dres79 said:


> last night i ended up taking it apart again and cleaning it out a little. Bearings cleaned with gasoline. brake drum cleaned out. i had some blocks from the Abu 6501 c3 tried to add them but they are not going to work ( i dont think) very loose on the pins so left them out till i can get my hands on some made for that pin size. i had a washer on one side of the spool between the bearing and the spool housing, took that off.
> 
> here is the result ...opcorn:
> 
> ...


If you want to increase the time on that video, lay the line on that reel so it is balanced and you will spin longer. When it is balanced, you will not be able to hear it spinning, that vibration you hear will be gone, and it will not rock back and forth when trying to come to rest. Do a search on here about a balanced spool on this board. There is more than one thread on here about it. I had a 5500 that would last over 5 1/2 min. Didn't mean much at all cause I had to slow it to be able to cast it. I found it niteresting to see just how long it would go. I believe that was the only reel I timed. Even if you don't anticipate retiming the spin up, a balanced spool will cast further when fishing.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

Yeah, you got me, there. I did say " if your Shuttle isn't keeping up with this reel, you may want to undress it, and give it a good once over." Which was really meant to say, that in the end, Akios reel won't be any less of a reel than the modified Abu - but I realize my timing and context was a bit off. I take full blame for any misunderstanding my post may have caused.

Anyway, it prompted a good discussion, and a moderator intervention. Everybody wins.


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

thekingfeeder said:


> If you want to increase the time on that video, lay the line on that reel so it is balanced and you will spin longer. When it is balanced, you will not be able to hear it spinning, that vibration you hear will be gone, and it will not rock back and forth when trying to come to rest. Do a search on here about a balanced spool on this board. There is more than one thread on here about it. I had a 5500 that would last over 5 1/2 min. Didn't mean much at all cause I had to slow it to be able to cast it. I found it niteresting to see just how long it would go. I believe that was the only reel I timed. Even if you don't anticipate retiming the spin up, a balanced spool will cast further when fishing.


So I looked at how to balance and I think I did it 3 times today but still vibrating bad. I did what Tommy suggested in his video but its still had the vibration and the rock when coming to a rest. 
The last time I re spooled it I even went slow. Counted the rotations. Even though I got a neater spool still didn't do the trick.


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## NC KingFisher (Nov 20, 2011)

surf rat said:


> Two words for a fast fishing reel...Zing Pow.


You forgot Fluff and i was really looking forward to Garbos comments about his new akios reel. Really is a shame i wont on much this weekend


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## Hudak (Sep 10, 2007)

dres79 said:


> So I looked at how to balance and I think I did it 3 times today but still vibrating bad. I did what Tommy suggested in his video but its still had the vibration and the rock when coming to a rest.
> The last time I re spooled it I even went slow. Counted the rotations. Even though I got a neater spool still didn't do the trick.


If you have played with how and where you hump the balance humps on the arbor, and you carefully counted the rotations per pass of your thumb, and you are making sure you wrap the spool 2 complete rotations with electric tape to lock the loose end down before you spin it, sometimes the spool just will not allow a balance. (2 complete rotations of tape allow you to cut the tape precisely at 2 rotations, so you don't add balance issues by having a heavy or light spot caused by the tape.) 

I have had actual spools that appear to be perfectly balanced (slowly rolling bare spool to see if it rocks back and forth went coming to a rest) that I could not balance no matter what I tried with the line. Then I had spools that seemed way off balance that were able to balance perfectly with line on it. Sometimes it is a cat and mouse game of what combination of humps and sequence of humps will work for a given spool, and making sure you lay the line on consistently. (Even though theoretically, it seems a hump is a hump, it does make a difference.) I have had some spools that just wouldn't balance. I have even had some high dollar imported spools that wouldn't balance. Spendign 80 bucks on a spool w/bearings that won't balance for you sure does suck. 

Bottomline, in the end, some spools just will not balance. Try another spool. See if you can get it to balance. That vibration you feel/hear will be back when you cast that when fishing. If it doesn't bother you, don't give it another thought. It would drive me bat crap crazy. But, that may just be me.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

NC KingFisher said:


> i was really looking forward to Garbos comments about his new akios reel


Garbo has already said he is too cheap to buy one... But I'd like to see his write up when he test drives one.


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

dres79 said:


> So I looked at how to balance and I think I did it 3 times today but still vibrating bad. I did what Tommy suggested in his video but its still had the vibration and the rock when coming to a rest.
> The last time I re spooled it I even went slow. Counted the rotations. Even though I got a neater spool still didn't do the trick.


With all line off does the spool come to rest at the same spot, rocking back and forth before settling? If so, try placing thin strips of electrical tape on the "high" side, spinning slightly after each strip and quit when it stops ramdomly. Don't pile the strips on top of one another or you can create the begining of a bump (not to be confused with a hump) that can actually amplify the vibration. I normally don't use a knot on tourney reels BUT a difficult spool can also be tamed (sometimes) by marking the high side and placing your knot there.

Another cool trick is to try no humps. Lay the line on from the begining with a_ very _coarse back and forth motion without forming a hump. Keep this motion up for say 15-20 passes and then lay down normal (level) from that point. I've seen this method tame difficult spools. 

Spool balance is more eagle feathers and fairy dust than it is science. I've rebalanced tourney reels over and over (yep, anal) and suddenly you find a combination that just works. Once you get there, never remove that bottom 20-30 yards and you won't have to rebalance.

I must be getting old, giving away hard earned secrets...lol

Tommy

ps, abu vs akios.... Either can be tuned to be too fast to cast. The important thing is to have the reel tuned so that you have confidence to* hit it hard *and then control the mid flight fluff.


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

Tommy how long of a free spin would you consider fishable


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

surfchunker said:


> Tommy how long of a free spin would you consider fishable


I second that question... I had to dial mine back to about 20-30 seconds. Not sure if that's normal, or just according to my limited ability...


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## Tommy (Jan 24, 2001)

Initial spin of 8-12 seconds work best for me. Much more than that and things get squirrely, your results may vary.

As stated before, the looooong spin times only show that you have been successful in a proper balance and are running little to no braking. You have to add braking, sometimes lots of it, to get the spool under control. Blocks, oil, mags and line level can be used independantly or in combination to get the desired results.

Tommy


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## dres79 (Sep 10, 2010)

Been a while so figured I'd post an update. 

Took a little time getting used to the reel and after some minor changes I have been able to increase my distance. I have spooled the reel at 423' prior to adding the PMR center mag with 6oz. Still haven't changed the line to get more out of it. Had recently replaced the Akios Shuttle line so moved on to that reel for a bit. 

The reel is finally at the point where I wanted it and I am happy with the upgrades. Here are the changes and upgrades...

Removed LW replaced with studs and new CT conversion bar from hookless. 
ABEC #5 ceramic bearings. ( one small drop yellow rocket ) 
PMR center mag with 3 rare magnets ( this also replaced previous speed bushing)
Running a single brake block for now.


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## surfchunker (Apr 10, 2006)

sweet


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## TimKan7719 (Apr 4, 2008)

Garboman said:


> Any Brake block you can fit over the Brake pins will work, some people claim to have success with sections a WD40 spray tube, I have not found a way to cut them without distorting the tube.


To Keep the tube undistorted stick a peice of wire inside thats just smaller than the tube it will help kep its shape.


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