# Marshy Hpoe Creek 11-24-16



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

The yellow perch are starting to show up. Was very hard to fish from shore with all the leaves, pine needles, sticks, and goose feathers all over the river. but looking good and going to get better.






Click on picture.


----------



## Tracker01 (Apr 4, 2011)

Nice catch and even better eating.


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

Tracker01 said:


> Nice catch and even better eating.


 Tracker, they are the first yellow perch since the spring run for me. They are moving up the river, or they are just starting to bite with this cool weather. Happy Thanksgiving to you and family.


----------



## Tracker01 (Apr 4, 2011)

Same to you Andy. Thank You.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

Went prospecting for yellow perch and crappie today. I finally found seven or eight micro dink yellow perch and five or six small blue gill in a winter holding area. I totally struck out at the place where I use to catch 11 to 14 inch YP. I don't know if I was too early or too late. Water temps plummeted over the past week in the upper bay so the perch will be moving to their winter haunts soon. Didn't raise any crappie today at all so they either have not moved in or someone has already caught them all-which I doubt. I did score some dandy perch size minnows though so I will have a supply for a little while so long as they don't freeze into a block of ice.


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

Jerry, I am starting to catch yellow perch on the small orange shad darts you sent me. Yes, it's shad dart time for me. You make a good shad dart. Thanks!


----------



## Pajigging machin (Oct 3, 2015)

Shad darts love them love them love them but what sux is no more local ma and PA Baitshops around so I have to travel 45min to Northeast MD if I want good quality darts


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

Pajigging machin said:


> Shad darts love them love them love them but what sux is no more local ma and PA Baitshops around so I have to travel 45min to Northeast MD if I want good quality darts


 See Jerry for your darts on this fishing forum.


----------



## Pajigging machin (Oct 3, 2015)

Andy are you suggesting ordering shad darts through the mail?


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

Yes, from Jerry. That's how I got mine for this year. 
Jerry Norris is your man for darts.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

Pajigging machin said:


> Andy are you suggesting ordering shad darts through the mail?


I sent you a PM.

Jerry


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

andypat said:


> Jerry, I am starting to catch yellow perch on the small orange shad darts you sent me. Yes, it's shad dart time for me. You make a good shad dart. Thanks!
> View attachment 28770



Thanks Andy, I'm glad they are working for you. I went out again a little while this afternoon. Caught a small crappie on the first cast and was hoping they had moved in but no such luck. Finished out the afternoon with one crappie, one bluegill, and five small yellow perch.


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

Jerry, I need some little orange/white tail darts. Like the one in this picture. I don't know the weights on the darts. Wish I did know the weights of your darts for when I order.






I tried to do this with message but couldn't show picture of the darts I need. I could use about 18 of them. That should last all winter and spring. Thanks! PS orange/white tail, and or orange/yellow tail will be OK.


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

andypat said:


> Jerry, I need some little orange/white tail darts. Like the one in this picture. I don't know the weights on the darts. Wish I did know the weights of your darts for when I order.
> View attachment 28849
> I tried to do this with message but couldn't show picture of the darts I need. I could use about 18 of them. That should last all winter and spring. Thanks! PS orange/white tail, and or orange/yellow tail will be OK.


 Also send 12 of the larger ones in orange.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

Sending you an email.


----------



## jigmeister (Feb 23, 2013)

Jerry Norris said:


> Thanks Andy, I'm glad they are working for you. I went out again a little while this afternoon. Caught a small crappie on the first cast and was hoping they had moved in but no such luck. Finished out the afternoon with one crappie, one bluegill, and five small yellow perch.


Jerry. Do you make flutter spoons like this ?


----------



## CYT (Nov 9, 2015)

As a shard dart novice, what's the difference between the darts I buy at Walmart and bass pro or the "good" home made darts some of you guys make?
Just wondering.


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

CYT said:


> As a shard dart novice, what's the difference between the darts I buy at Walmart and bass pro or the "good" home made darts some of you guys make?
> Just wondering.


 Not much difference, if any. Like to buy from fishing friends. When you buy from a friend, you can order the colors you like best. Like orange/yellow tail, and orange/white tail that are my favorites. CYT I fished the lake this morning for two Hrs. and caught 13 crappie on the tube bait jig three feet under a bobber in about eight feet of water. Was a little chilly but not bad. No wind. I was going to take a picture but camera battery was dead.


----------



## Pajigging machin (Oct 3, 2015)

CYT I like homemade better cuz you normally can get smaller sizes and if timing is right 2 small darts tipped with worms split shot between them hanging off cape henolopen pier is a deadly spot and croaker rig.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

CYT said:


> As a shard dart novice, what's the difference between the darts I buy at Walmart and bass pro or the "good" home made darts some of you guys make?
> Just wondering.


Primarily color and size. Unless you go to a local tackle shop, you probably won't find darts less than 1/16 oz. and only a very limited color selection. There is a difference in colors. I make a pretty limited selection of colors, but they are colors that catch fish for me. That is the reason I started making lures, I could no longer find the sizes and colors of darts that I was using for shad and perch.

Jigmiester: I make something similar but mine are made with a much shorter shank hook and are probably a little larger than the ones in you picture. Here are mine compared to 4/0 Nunguessers


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

Jerry Norris said:


> Primarily color and size. Unless you go to a local tackle shop, you probably won't find darts less than 1/16 oz. and only a very limited color selection. There is a difference in colors. I make a pretty limited selection of colors, but they are colors that catch fish for me. That is the reason I started making lures, I could no longer find the sizes and colors of darts that I was using for shad and perch.
> 
> Jigmiester: I make something similar but mine are made with a much shorter shank hook and are probably a little larger than the ones in you picture. Here are mine compared to 4/0 Nunguessers


 X2 on that. I have to say Jerry's is the best place. IMHO.


----------



## CYT (Nov 9, 2015)

Jerry Norris said:


> Primarily color and size. Unless you go to a local tackle shop, you probably won't find darts less than 1/16 oz. and only a very limited color selection. There is a difference in colors. I make a pretty limited selection of colors, but they are colors that catch fish for me. That is the reason I started making lures, I could no longer find the sizes and colors of darts that I was using for shad and perch.
> 
> Jigmiester: I make something similar but mine are made with a much shorter shank hook and are probably a little larger than the ones in you picture. Here are mine compared to 4/0 Nunguessers


You had a good day Andy. 

Jerry, how do you rig those tiny spoons? 
Bought a couple at the Pasadena flea market and haven't used them yet. Split shot about a foot above w/ 4# test on the ultra lite??
They look deadly if you know how to use them.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

I rig them in tandem with a 1/8 or 1/16 oz. shad dart with the dart on a six or eight inch dropper and the flutter spoon on a twelve to eighteen inch leader. I rig the same with the Nungesser spoons. I usually use at least eight lb. nanofil or braid, and if double rigging, I use a minimum of 10 lb. leader. Hooking a double on shad on 4 lb. is sure to lose one or both lures.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

If you are fishing a single lure, 4# is ok rigged with a split shot as you describe-so long as there are not a lot of snags. Personally, I never go with line that light because I fish the Susquehanna river and there are so many rocks that light line only results in losing a lot of lures. I have a couple of videos on YouTube of shad and perch fishing last spring in the Susky where I was using a dart and spoon combination.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCz-plkQiGSL2DASVPc-L4Sw/videos?view=0&sort=dd&shelf_id=0

The shad and perch are the first two videos that I posted.


----------



## CYT (Nov 9, 2015)

Jerry Norris said:


> I rig them in tandem with a 1/8 or 1/16 oz. shad dart with the dart on a six or eight inch dropper and the flutter spoon on a twelve to eighteen inch leader. I rig the same with the Nungesser spoons. I usually use at least eight lb. nanofil or braid, and if double rigging, I use a minimum of 10 lb. leader. Hooking a double on shad on 4 lb. is sure to lose one or both lures.


I would never use 4# for shad, I was thinking for yellow perch, crappie and such.

Do you use a 3-way swivel for your tandem rig? A pic would be sweet of how you rig. Thanks


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

I use to like to let the spoons flutter fishing straight down off the boat or through the ice hole. So many ways to fish them.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

CYT said:


> I would never use 4# for shad, I was thinking for yellow perch, crappie and such.
> 
> Do you use a 3-way swivel for your tandem rig? A pic would be sweet of how you rig. Thanks


OK, you asked for it. I rig two different ways depending upon whether my main line is braid or mono. The narrative below describes what is shown in the two attached sketches:

TERMINAL KNOTS

UGLY KNOT:
This knot was shown to me by a friend. I use it almost exclusively to tie mono leaders to braided lines for all species of fish. I use it to tie braid to all sizes of mono up to 40 lb. or heavier. It is a very strong knot.

Step 1: Select the amount of mono leader you want and lay the braid along side the leader material. If you are going to tie a single lure on the leader, make the lap at the end of the leader using about two or three inches of line and leader. If you are going to tie two lures, use about two or three inches of the braid and however much leader you want for one of the droppers. In the illustration, I tied a two lure rig.

Step 2: Make a loop in both the braid and the leader. Note that for a double rig the leader will be longer than the tag end of the braid. For a single leader, the ends of the double lines will be the same length.

Step 3: Pass the doubled lines through the loop four or five times.

Step 4: Moisten the line and pull both ends of the line and leader tight to complete the knot. Trim the tag end of the braid as needed. Tie your lures to each end of the mono leader using either a cinch knott or a palomar knot. I generally prefer a cinch knot because lots of times I can break off a snagged lure and save one lure and the leaders.

JERRY KNOT:
I came up with this knot a few years ago to tie modified drop shot rigs for yellow perch fishing. I have since started using a modified version of it to tie droppers for two lures in monofilament line, typically when using two shad darts or a shad dart and spoon combination on monofilament.

Step1: Double about 18 inches of line. After a few knots, you will know how much to use depending on the lenghts of the leaders you want. 

Step 2: Make a loop in the double line. The position of the loop will determin the length of the legs of the droppers, and since the doubled line will be cut near the knot, that dropper will be just a little shorter than twice the length of the doubled line loop. Be sure to give yourself enough line to easily complete the next step. You can always trim a leader that is too long. 

Step 3: Pass doubled line through the loop six to eight times. I find that eight times give me a little more strength to the knot and also makes the dropper stand off better from the main line.

Step 4: Moisten the knot and pull both ends of the line to snug up the knot.

Step 5: Clip one end of the loop about half an inch from the knot. Tie your lures onto the two free ends of the leaders using either a cinch or palomar knot.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

Here is how a finished double rig should look


----------



## CYT (Nov 9, 2015)

Jerry Norris said:


> Here is how a finished double rig should look


What? No video? Just kidding.

Pretty extensive info. Jerry. Looks like a killer rig. I got the idea now. Thanks

Will probably just pre tie several small 3-way swivels and use flouro. My main line is always braid.
I never tie braid directly to the lures. I'm into stealth as much as possible.


----------



## andypat (Jan 7, 2004)

Sooo many ways to catch a fish. That's one of the things I like about fishing. Seeing how other people catch fish. Jerry, that is a pretty neat rig you showed. You know your knots. I like all knots, No hardware for me. All knots. Thanks for the Info.


----------



## Jerry Norris (Oct 14, 2016)

I like to minimize the hardware as well. I use to rig using a three way swivel as well just to get the separation for the two leaders, then I went to tying the two lures in tandem directly on the main line with either cinch or palomar knots. Since I switched to braid, I use the ugly knot with a mono leader for both single and tandem lures. I believe the ugly knot is a stronger connection than a palomar or cinch knot tied to a swivel. For me, no three way means less tangles, less to lose when you hang up and quicker to retie if you do break off. The bottom line is to use whatever you are comfortable with and works for you.

I have a friend that I fish with for crappie and YP in the winter. He ties his braid directly to a small dart or jig and fishes it under a float like Andy. He consistently out fishes me and everyone else around him so, even though I prefer to use a mono leader, I am not sure how much difference it really makes.


----------

