# Omoto Chief 5000CSM



## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Got this reel a couple weeks ago to demo and review. After pulling it down and then trying it out all I can say is WOW!!! Notice anything?? I thought you might...The fit and finish is very nice and the mag works 100% better than Abu's. The best thing is the price point. At $40.00-$60.00 cheaper than Abu or Akios you won't beat it for a magged reel. Here are a few pics..


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## yerbyray (May 18, 2010)

After looking at the pics I would have sworn that was an Abu. If not somebody has broken a lot of patent laws as every part looks like Abu's.

Do they make a 7k series by any chance?


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

yerbyray said:


> After looking at the pics I would have sworn that was an Abu. If not somebody has broken a lot of patent laws as every part looks like Abu's.
> 
> Do they make a 7k series by any chance?


they do....it's like $129.00


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## yerbyray (May 18, 2010)

AbuMike said:


> they do....it's like $129.00


Yeah I just looked it up and like what I see.


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

like that 7000. was going to pick up a 666 or 757ct, but i dunno hard to beat that price.


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## bctom (May 25, 2007)

My guess would be at my age why buy PRC when I already have the original, that are in better shape now than when they were new. I converted all my bushing 9000's to bearings and took awhile to get used to the spool speed casting. same with the 7000's.....and if the really big old drum are running I will switch back to my penn 970-980 mags . I took care of what I bought many years ago and guess thats a reason also. If I were younger probably would do the same as you are to watch the money. I just cannot with good conscience buy PRC products.


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## bctom (May 25, 2007)

Guess this could be the main reason also watch it as its really that good http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSVjYBSrL68


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

It's not PRC, it's Taiwan. (there is a dispute, as you may know) If I'm going to buy anything from the PRC or RoC, it's going to be from Taiwan. It's a well known fact in industry that the highest quality cheap Chinese junk comes from the island, not the mainland. And having worked with both, I can verify this. That being said, it's a foreign company working to the specification of whomever ordered the parts made. It will be made as good as the company who designed the reel, specified it to be. After all, it was good old American and European ingenuity that put East Asia on its way to global manufacturing dominance. They still do it the same way that we would. (if we still did such things)

But if your "good conscience" won't allow you buy anything from that part of the world, you'd probably better just end it all now. Because there isn't hardly anything that doesn't come from that part of the world these days. (at some level) 

I don't have that particular aversion, but to each his own. If you don't like saving money, or appreciating the value of a dollar, no problem, mate...

I can't tell the difference in quality between my Swedish made Abus, and my Chinese made Akios reels.


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## bctom (May 25, 2007)

That is you and in this country, I also am free to chose, to me there is not much difference between PRC and Taiwan, I do realize that I also have the choice to pay more for the real thing, then I intend on doing it. just like rods, after spending the day with Terry Carroll at his factory i only use zzippys, worth the extra price, and if you don't know.... well enough on that. I also drive a toyota 4 runner in the states, and a Hi-flux here in Australia where I work, no biggy as Toyota also has US factories giving americans jobs.

If it makes you happy I really do not care what you buy, or where, but you are way off base, as there are many different avenues to avoid the far east reels and I use them. Ebay is a good one, also Hookless.com is another. So I guess the end result would be buy what makes you happy, I could care less, but at my age and with the money to get what I want, I will chose to avoid the non original....and stick with the real thing . It's like when you own a real muscle car 1965 GTO post, numbers correct car, versus a clone built on a LeMans body....but then on the other hand I also have a pair of the Millionaire 7HT Mag super tuned and a couple of damn good reels, made in Japan stamped on their side plate...what ever floats your boat.


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## Seahawk (Oct 3, 2013)

From http://omoto.donstacklehawaii.com/: "_As an OEM manufacturer, OMOTO reels are well known by various brand names_. . ."
I just can't help thinking one of those "various brand names" might be Abu considering the amazing similarity.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Kwaj-tom said:


> That is you and in this country, I also am free to chose, to me there is not much difference between PRC and Taiwan, I do realize that I also have the choice to pay more for the real thing, then I intend on doing it. just like rods, after spending the day with Terry Carroll at his factory i only use zzippys, worth the extra price, and if you don't know.... well enough on that. I also drive a toyota 4 runner in the states, and a Hi-flux here in Australia where I work, no biggy as Toyota also has US factories giving americans jobs.
> 
> If it makes you happy I really do not care what you buy, or where, but you are way off base, as there are many different avenues to avoid the far east reels and I use them. Ebay is a good one, also Hookless.com is another. So I guess the end result would be buy what makes you happy, I could care less, but at my age and with the money to get what I want, I will chose to avoid the non original....and stick with the real thing . It's like when you own a real muscle car 1965 GTO post, numbers correct car, versus a clone built on a LeMans body....but then on the other hand I also have a pair of the Millionaire 7HT Mag super tuned and a couple of damn good reels, made in Japan stamped on their side plate...what ever floats your boat.


Unless you are Mick Dodge and use absolutely nothing modern that "I don't buy China or Taiwan" dog won't hunt......I'm sure you have a cell phone, computer, tv, DVD and small kitchen appliances.



Seahawk said:


> From http://omoto.donstacklehawaii.com/: "_As an OEM manufacturer, OMOTO reels are well known by various brand names_. . ."
> I just can't help thinking one of those "various brand names" might be Abu considering the amazing similarity.


They don't make Abu but their are some connections there. Many parts are interchangeable but not all.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

cooper138 said:


> like that 7000. was going to pick up a 666 or 757ct, but i dunno hard to beat that price.


The 7000 is THE EXACT SAME REEL as the 757.....


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

AbuMike said:


> The 7000 is THE EXACT SAME REEL as the 757.....


as best as i could tell they were the same and thats the confirmation i was looking for, thank you


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

cooper138 said:


> as best as i could tell they were the same and thats the confirmation i was looking for, thank you


you bet and be sure to follow the link I put up. Don is good people and will treat you right...

http://www.donstacklehawaii.com/omoto/links/sales.html#7000CTM_Blk


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## Seahawk (Oct 3, 2013)

Omoto website (http://omotoamerica.com/Wavecaster_reels.html) shows the 7000AB3 weighs 56 ounces. That's 3.5 pounds. Really???


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Seahawk said:


> Omoto website (http://omotoamerica.com/Wavecaster_reels.html) shows the 7000AB3 weighs 56 ounces. That's 3.5 pounds. Really???


thats is a heavy reel but not the one we were talking about..


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## Seahawk (Oct 3, 2013)

AbuMike said:


> thats is a heavy reel but not the one we were talking about..


Yeah, I know.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

I have the 7000CTM coming in tomorrow. Will do a break down over the weekend...


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## cooper138 (Aug 8, 2012)

AbuMike said:


> I have the 7000CTM coming in tomorrow. Will do a break down over the weekend...


Great! i have another friend interested in the 7000 along with me. looking forward to your breakdown


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## finfish (Jun 1, 2005)

Something to consider when buying an Omoto reel, will parts be available. I bought a used Hubilie a while back, the second time I used it the axle bent while casting. I have several Abu reels and have owned several more in the past, and this never happened to one of them. Granted I bought the reel used and things happen. But tried to contact Omoto America through there website to inquire about parts and the e-mail address doesn't work. Think a Abu 7500 spool will work, but seems impossible to find Omoto parts.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

finfish said:


> Something to consider when buying an Omoto reel, will parts be available. I bought a used Hubilie a while back, the second time I used it the axle bent while casting. I have several Abu reels and have owned several more in the past, and this never happened to one of them. Granted I bought the reel used and things happen. But tried to contact Omoto America through there website to inquire about parts and the e-mail address doesn't work. Think a Abu 7500 spool will work, but seems impossible to find Omoto parts.


This issue is being rectified as we speak. Many are having the same issue with Akios. Like I said I am in constant contact with them and the issue is being fixed. Many parts are interchangeable but not all. So when I pick up the 7000CTM today this is something I will be looking at.


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## dirtyhandslopez (Nov 17, 2006)

Who makes quality stuff or who makes stuff to be sold cheaply is the answer here I believe.
There is a saying around that might confirm this. I believe it goes something like "you get what you pay for".
"Being fixed" doesn't not work so well when there is your lifetime best fish on the other end..
Holy moly, I am beginning to sound like Mike...


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

dirtyhandslopez said:


> Who makes quality stuff or who makes stuff to be sold cheaply is the answer here I believe.
> There is a saying around that might confirm this. I believe it goes something like "you get what you pay for".
> "Being fixed" doesn't not work so well when there is your lifetime best fish on the other end..
> Holy moly, I am beginning to sound like Mike...


And some of us just like to tear down things for the sake of typing words on a forum because they know no better......


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

AbuMike said:


> The 7000 is THE EXACT SAME REEL as the 757.....


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

bronzbck1 said:


>


Is it possible that you could list some, all, or even any of the differences? These reels are made by EXACTLY the same company. (that's a fact)


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

Any body that knows anything about reels knows that reels are made to specifications. If company A wants there reel to look like company B but cheaper then they might look the same but not the same quality metals etc. . Anyone worth there salt knows this but if someone wants to blow smoke then blow away


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

No smoke to be blown here. The two reels are not made by the same company. The Akios is made by Akios and the Omoto is made by Omoto. BUT, the parts for both are made by the same company. That sir is a fact so the quality thing holds no water.


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## DANtheJDMan (Aug 29, 2012)

AbuMike said:


> No smoke to be blown here. The two reels are not made by the same company. The Akios is made by Akios and the Omoto is made by Omoto. BUT, the parts for both are made by the same company. That sir is a fact so the quality thing holds no water.


Well.............................There can be differences that are not visible.

Case in point. Eaton hydrostatic makes little transaxles for lawn mowers. 
10 years ago or more, they were making transaxles for Murry (cheap) lawn mowers. 
The transaxle was made to run 500 hrs and there is no way to add any oil.
Eaton was in full production with Murry.
John Deere asked them to bid making transaxles for the (Lower cost model) not cheap, we don't do that, lawn mower line. What you can buy at Home Depot.
It took Eaton more than 2 years to bring their failure rate up to JD standards.

The outside and the inside of the transaxle looked identical. 
The bearing quality, heat treating of the gears and shafts were all different. Material of the gears and shafts different (better). 
I'm just saying it could be different and without looking at the manufacturing print that says what the heat treat and type of material and and...................
you just don't know.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

DANtheJDMan said:


> Well.............................There can be differences that are not visible.
> 
> Case in point. Eaton hydrostatic makes little transaxles for lawn mowers.
> 10 years ago or more, they were making transaxles for Murry (cheap) lawn mowers.
> ...


This is very true my friend but not in this case.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

bronzbck1 said:


> Any body that knows anything about reels knows that reels are made to specifications. If company A wants there reel to look like company B but cheaper then they might look the same but not the same quality metals etc. . Anyone worth there salt knows this but if someone wants to blow smoke then blow away


OK, I'm going to ask the same question again... Can you SPECIFICALLY name ANY differences in these reels? That's a very direct question, not a philosophical one. For the sake of education - and I'm not necessarily saying that you are wrong - could you PLEASE point out what you found to be so ridiculous about Mike's assertion, based on some evidence or fact? I'd like to know for my own enlightenment. I'm assuming that you are "worth your salt", since you boldly waved that banner.

Mike - While one can debate over the semantics of "making" vs "assembling", the fact remains, every piece of an Akios reel is made by the same company that makes the Omoto reel. (which is Omoto) Therefore, materials withstanding, the quality of the reel should be virtually identical. And... In the unlikely event that an Omoto part breaks, why not just swap in an Akios part - if, as is being implied, a quality disparity truly exists - in its place? (but only as necessary) That might still preserve the value of spending less $ upfront.

I would still like the other fella to answer the question, though. If he knows something, it should be to the benefit of the forum. No matter who one's friends may be, or where one's loyalties might lie. That is, if such a thing even comes into play. I like honesty and transparency, though, so let's just fire away...


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

Shimano makes a Stradic & Stella in the same factory. Both nice and pretty, same ratio, same drag. Big difference in price is because of what you can't see.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

I totally understand what you're saying. Now, what I'd like to know is, what *specifically* are the differences in the Omoto and Akios? This isn't some sort of attempt to call you out. I'm honestly interested to know what the differences are in the reels. If somebody on a different budget wanted a reel, why shouldn't they know the differences, to make an educated decision?


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## fishingman88 (Apr 23, 2008)

bronzbck1 said:


> Shimano makes a Stradic & Stella in the same factory. Both nice and pretty, same ratio, same drag. Big difference in price is because of what you can't see.


Clearly he's still searching the interwebz for some evidence, but he can't find it. Sometimes people hate to admit they overpaid for the exact same product so they try to make outlandish statements which have no evidence behind them.


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

I know the differences for a fact but you guys buy those department store combo reels. Buy everyone and break them down and compare them to Abu's & Akios. Don't forget you have to have both side by side to compare but the biggest thing is go fish salt water with those reels and see what happens. One use's brass where the other use's steel see what happens. All manufactures make reels that can do the same job with a broad price range (Daiwa) but people that actually use them know the difference. Solid buy you a bunch of those reels and get away from the computer and actually fish. Then get back to us at the end of the year and let us know how they hold up.


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## River (Sep 30, 2006)

Gotta agree with Bronzbck on this one ---- Take a look at AbuMikes picture, the 6th one down --- the small drive gear in the middle, the one that the main shaft goes thru and turns the spool. In all my Abu's and Akios --- that's made of brass like the large drive gear --- the one thats pictured appears to be steel. It's dang near impossible to determine hardness by appearance, you'd have to do a hardness test ---- Many years ago I bought a Marlin 30 30 lever gun from WalMart --- Killed several deer with it, shot good ---- I decided to sell it on the way to the OBX one day in 2010, stopped at the very large Mackey Ferry Gun Shop off Highway 64 near Plymouth, NC. --- I could see no difference and didn't think there was any --- handed it to the very knowledgeable gentleman that runs or owns the place ---- he took one look at it and stated --- "It came from Walmart, fake walnut stock" ---- I've seen this many time, especially in reels ---- the type metal used in the bearings, bushing, shafts, etc can be a different hardness that's invisible to the eye, the type bearings and other parts in a reel can make a big difference in cost, heat treating steel and aluminum to increase hardness also costs ---- River


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

bronzbck1 said:


> I know the differences for a fact.. Solid buy you a bunch of those reels and get away from the computer and actually fish. Then get back to us at the end of the year and let us know how they hold up.


I don't really understand the aversion to answering the question. Not once did I say you were wrong. You keep telling me that there are differences, and I keep asking what they are. I'd just like to have a clear reply, without going on a tangent, or having to endure comparative statements to products not being discussed. Not sure if I could ask the question any more clearly. 

I didn't say that I was planning on buying one. But if it's a matter of making a price point determination and assessing cost vs quality, why not put the discussion out there for those to whom it may be applicable? You've got a great chance to put your knowledge on display for those who may not possess it. I just can't understand why you wouldn't want to seize that opportunity, rather than being all cryptic about it.

Not everyone buys the gold standard, so it would be nice to have an objective analysis of these reels. There are all kinds of reasons why someone could, would, and should buy a lower quality reel. Not the least of which would be a loaner, or a kayak reel. So, for just one minute, can we lose the brand favoritism, and discuss some things factually? (and please, no mention of why only an Akios reel is good enough to loan to people that we wouldn't let touch, much less fish, our favorite equipment)


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

Solid, I said they use steel where others use brass and River pointed out one gear in the pic's. What part don't you understand? You right a book about something so simple that you just said you probable wouldn't buy. You insert yourself in every story on this forum don't ask me just buy one and find out for yourself


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Ok here's the skinny......The pinion gear is SS. It wasn't but a couple years ago all the craze for some was a SS pinion gear. I never held suit in that. I have spoken with Omoto rep and the SS pinion is going to be changed back to brass. Ok let me see, what else on the 5000 and 6000 series??? Ummm nothing. The difference in the 7000 to the 757 is the SS pinion and the sides. Akios is brass and the Omoto's are aluminium. And how many aluminium sides have failed over the years??? The brass sides add about 3.5oz to the over all weight of the reel. Like it or not the 2 reels may or may not be made in the same factory but they are sure made from the same parts with the exception of the 2 examples made here. Those are the facts I know it and some others here know it. Believe what you want. I will get the pics of the 7000CTM up today. I have another 757CTM coming just for comparison pics. 

I am not saying one is better than the other just pointing out the fact that the Omoto is cheaper than the Akios for the same product.


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## John81 (Apr 24, 2007)

bronzbck1 said:


> Shimano makes a Stradic & Stella in the same factory. Both nice and pretty, same ratio, same drag. Big difference in price is because of what you can't see.


Stella's are made in japan, stradics are now made in Malaysia. I think either the fh or fi was the last Japanese made stradic.


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## DANtheJDMan (Aug 29, 2012)

bronzbck1 said:


> Solid, I said they use steel where others use brass and River pointed out one gear in the pic's. What part don't you understand? You right a book about something so simple that you just said you probable wouldn't buy. You insert yourself in every story on this forum don't ask me just buy one and find out for yourself


River has got the right idea. I have met Solid7 and he is a straight up guy and his comments are true and to the point. Solid has an engineering background. That being said, lets pretend that these reel pieces are made exactly the same from the same material and in the same factory. When they are made for one customer (A) the specification calls for (lets use something easy 100 +- 0.13 mm) 
With a little weering and a new part pops out. The part is checked with a GO-NO GO gauge lets say every 100 parts. The machine tools wear a little each part made.
Customer (B) wants the same part but the specification for that part is (100 +-0.013 mm) 
Now the guy running the machine has to check one part in every 10 parts.
What I am trying to say is the fit and finish of the completed product is not as good because of the swing between the high end and the low end of the specification. In a perfect world the part stays right in the middle of spec. its golden. When things get bad is when the big end of one part has to line up with the small end of the spec of another part and there is a problem. It don't fit right.
That is why the customer (B) pays a little more for his part and it fits a little better. Same part same factory and 9 out of 10 times the same size. But there is always that 1 where all the tolerences add up and bad news.
The guy who uses it twice a year will never find the problem or he will luck up and get a good one. The cheap one is prolly still a good value. 
DAN


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

DANtheJDMan said:


> River has got the right idea. I have met Solid7 and he is a straight up guy and his comments are true and to the point. Solid has an engineering background. That being said, lets pretend that these reel pieces are made exactly the same from the same material and in the same factory. When they are made for one customer (A) the specification calls for (lets use something easy 100 +- 0.13 mm)
> With a little weering and a new part pops out. The part is checked with a GO-NO GO gauge lets say every 100 parts. The machine tools wear a little each part made.
> Customer (B) wants the same part but the specification for that part is (100 +-0.013 mm)
> Now the guy running the machine has to check one part in every 10 parts.
> ...


Absolutely a good post but as myself and S7 know, this ain't the case.


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## solid7 (Dec 31, 2010)

bronzbck1 said:


> Solid, I said they use steel where others use brass and River pointed out one gear in the pic's. What part don't you understand? You right a book about something so simple that you just said you probable wouldn't buy. You insert yourself in every story on this forum don't ask me just buy one and find out for yourself


Don't get a case of the red-ass because I asked for a fact that you couldn't provide. Mike made a nice little rebuttal, and on account of some of the chatter that he and I have had in the background, I tend to believe that what he says is true. Surely, being the upstanding gentleman that he is, he would reserve the right to be wrong, if it were proven to be so. But bronzbck1, so far, all I hear is deflection when I ask you to speak directly to a question, and I just don't understand why a knowledgeable person would do that. If you might be incorrect, I would respect you more if you just admitted that you spoke out on something that you couldn't stand behind, and just back tracked. But to declare that you know something, and then refuse to provide any evidence to support such bold statements? Why, it almost sounds like you're an Akios salesman, at that point...

No, I probably won't buy one. But if I could recommend them in good faith to somebody who could get by with a cheaper reel, that had the look and feel of a better reel, why not? 

I'm going to say it one more time, because the third time is supposed to be a charm - what EXACTLY do you know about these reels, that makes them such a bum deal? Nobody is asking you to like them, or even look at one. It's just that maybe one of them dirt stupid fellers (like me) that you were lookin' down your nose at earlier in this thread, might be able to make an informed decision, as a result of your input. However, I'm inclined to believe that if you can't answer a question directly after being asked pointedly 3 times, you're probably full of ****. I reserve the right to be wrong, of course...



DANtheJDMan said:


> The cheap one is prolly still a good value.


See, now that's a good attitude. It's never a bad thing to discuss a matter to determine exactly HOW GOOD of a value something may or may not be. Wouldn't you agree?


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## joemullet (Dec 20, 2005)

Cant make CHICKIN SALAD OUT OF CHICKIN SH##, hahahahahahahahahahahah.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

joemullet said:


> Cant make CHICKIN SALAD OUT OF CHICKIN SH##, hahahahahahahahahahahah.


So very true. The only difference in the two here is the dressing. Like I said I have no dog or money in this. I was asked to open it up and review that's all. The ones that are having such a hard time DO have dogs in this. A lot of people selling Akios reels cheap, cheap as dealers that have no store front and killing the legit dealers. Seems anyone can be a dealer. Those LEGIT dealers better wake up and take note.

Funny how the most clueless have the most negative stuff to say.......And yes I have done the same thing.....


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## joemullet (Dec 20, 2005)

don't care myself, seen companys try to copy ABU for years and fail, akios seems to be close and time will tell, I like the mag opt but I stay for the real thing but I have plenty to use and some still in box. will like to see what a dunkin in the salt does after time. anybody need ultramag bearings?


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

joemullet said:


> don't care myself, seen companys try to copy ABU for years and fail, akios seems to be close and time will tell, I like the mag opt but I stay for the real thing but I have plenty to use and some still in box. *will like to see what a dunkin in the salt does after time.* anybody need ultramag bearings?


Same exact thing it does to an Abu......Really????


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## River (Sep 30, 2006)

Clueless Mike !!! Smack my face - Snort, Snort --- Definition on this one ----- please --- I'm 65, been fishing with Abu's so long I can't remember - still got a box full, some I won't sell for nothing because of the memories, can tear one down and put it back together sitting underneath my desk by candlelight and I can't see so good no more, can do the same thing with Stratic's and many more types --- Repaired and cleaned reels for years, did it at Teach's when I worked there. I won't even get into my qualifications due to my occupation for 43 years but I do know a little bit about metal --- I like all these round reels, I luv Abu's, Akios and I'm sure the Omoto's are fine --- no dog in the hunt for me --- use/buy what you want but I like Akios best, I tested 3 of em for two years hard, they rode on the front of my truck thru Sandstorms, hard wind, they stayed on my truck 24 hrs a day lots of times and I fished em hard, dang near every day that was fishable, never put a bag over em but I did not drop them in the sand or dip them in Saltwater, even once (Thanks to some nice Sandspikes) - I washed em off hard with a water hose at the end of each day --- never had a breakdown, line jumped off the spool a couple times and I stripped out the little screw in the handle on one --- great reels - so are Abu's --- They make cheap ones, they make high dollar ones - they make em for fresh water, they make em for Saltwater, high precision/not much precision -- Woo, I feel better now -- River


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

River said:


> Clueless Mike !!! Smack my face - Snort, Snort --- Definition on this one ----- please --- I'm 65, been fishing with Abu's so long I can't remember - still got a box full, some I won't sell for nothing because of the memories, can tear one down and put it back together sitting underneath my desk by candlelight and I can't see so good no more, can do the same thing with Stratic's and many more types --- Repaired and cleaned reels for years, did it at Teach's when I worked there. I won't even get into my qualifications due to my occupation for 43 years but I do know a little bit about metal --- I like all these round reels, I luv Abu's, Akios and I'm sure the Omoto's are fine --- no dog in the hunt for me --- use/buy what you want but I like Akios best, I tested 3 of em for two years hard, they rode on the front of my truck thru Sandstorms, hard wind, they stayed on my truck 24 hrs a day lots of times and I fished em hard, dang near every day that was fishable, never put a bag over em but I did not drop them in the sand or dip them in Saltwater, even once (Thanks to some nice Sandspikes) - I washed em off hard with a water hose at the end of each day --- never had a breakdown, line jumped off the spool a couple times and I stripped out the little screw in the handle on one --- great reels - so are Abu's --- They make cheap ones, they make high dollar ones - they make em for fresh water, they make em for Saltwater, high precision/not much precision -- Woo, I feel better now -- River


That was not directed at you but if defensive you must be then so be it. I know the facts, you may or may not but that's ok. Like I said, some shady stuff going on and the true tackle shop sellers better wake up to the fact that more Akios reels are being sold under the table at discounted prices than they know.....That's all and I'm done with this thread....


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## River (Sep 30, 2006)

Oh - I thought you was talkin bout me -- I am getting a little touchy and paranoid settin here with the snow falling - Cabin/Fishin f-e-v-e-r --- Not defensive, just tellin my opinion why I like em --- Sorry and Never mind --- River


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

River said:


> Oh - I thought you was talkin bout me -- I am getting a little touchy and paranoid settin here with the snow falling - Cabin/Fishin f-e-v-e-r --- Not defensive, just tellin my opinion why I like em --- Sorry and Never mind --- River


No problem brother. Cabin fever I know. Just started snowing again here and looking at a few more inches...


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## js1172 (Jun 5, 2012)

River said:


> Oh - I thought you was talkin bout me -- I am getting a little touchy and paranoid settin here with the snow falling - Cabin/Fishin f-e-v-e-r --- Not defensive, just tellin my opinion why I like em --- Sorry and Never mind --- River


Know where your at River, got a new rod and reel, and a beach cart, all delivered the last few days, right now there is 20" of that white misery on the ground, still more to come, after plowing all day, the wind is kickin up. Gettin burnt out on winter.
Js


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## jmadre (Jan 3, 2008)

I have handled the Akios 656CTM and the comparable Omoto side-by-side. The Omoto was noticeably lighter, however it had a lot more slop in the handle when rocked back and forth.

I also handled the Akios 757CTM and the comparable Omoto side-by-side. Again, the Omoto was noticeably lighter but had a rough spot on every rotation of the handle. The Akios was smooth as glass.

In my web research a few months ago I found that Omoto makes the reels for Akios to Simon's specifications. Omoto has also manufactured round reels for Abu. Omoto is owned by a former Shimano guy. I don't remember the sources for that information, but I found it easily by doing web searches, so anyone else should be able to do the same.

They may look the same, but they do not appear to be equal in quality.


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

Jeff you can see almost every part is made of a cheaper grade metal, thickness, etc. The only thing the same is from 10 feet away. if you have one in your hands even Ray Charles can see the difference. They would be a good reel for the person that only fishes a few times a year and likes to take their reel apart when they are not.


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

bronzbck1 said:


> Jeff you can see almost every part is made of a cheaper grade metal, thickness, etc. The only thing the same is from 10 feet away. if you have one in your hands even Ray Charles can see the difference. They would be a good reel for the person that only fishes a few times a year and likes to take their reel apart when they are not.


Well we will see. Picking up the 757 today and have the 7000 in hand so we will see. Kinda funny how this was made an Omoto vs Akios thread. Didn't start that way but must have sparked some interest since Mr Akios is really interested in these reels now for some reason.


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

That is exactly why you started this thread Mike but it wont wash they only look the same to someone that doesn't know better


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

bronzbck1 said:


> That is exactly why you started this thread Mike but it wont wash they only look the same to someone that doesn't know better


No it's not really and that was not directed at you but oh well. And I do know the difference..The implication that the company make 2 different sets of parts is ridiculous. Yes the pinion is SS and may cause some issues but that has been resolved.


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## bronzbck1 (Jun 13, 2007)

AbuMike said:


> And I do know the difference..The implication that the company make 2 different sets of parts is ridiculous. Yes the pinion is SS and may cause some issues but that has been resolved.


This is totally UN-true and you know it


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

bronzbck1 said:


> This is totally UN-true and you know it


ok, no harm no foul...


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## jmadre (Jan 3, 2008)

Mike,

The cast control caps, handle, and end plates were different on the models I inspected. I didn't disassemble the reels and mic any parts, but the slop and roughness in the gears was present in the Omotos, not the Akios reels. As River pointed out, the pinion gear is different whether they intend to change it in the future or not.

It is obvious to even the casual observer that they are not the "same reel". It appears to be true that they are manufactured at different specifications, as has been asserted earlier in this thread.

I'm sure that if you just want to tear the reels down and take pictures for the Internet the reels are equal in performance. They were not equal in performance during a 'crank test', and I do not believe they would be equal in performance if you actually fished them for any amount of time.

Now, let me just go ahead and connect the dots for your 'audience' here.

This thread has become a "Omoto vs. Akios' thread because that's what you intended it to be from the beginning. You are the one that compared it to Abu and Akios in your first post.

From your Facebook activity it's been apparent to me (before I saw or heard anything about this thread) that you have a bone to pick with Joe Moore, and then suddenly you make a 'helpful' post informing people how they can get the 'same' reel as an Akios for less money. You provided a link to a dealer. You also attempted to discourage current Akios dealers from carrying the line. I seems like you have an axe to grind.

Why all the hate and discontent?


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

You can read into into it what ever you want. 

My Facebook is public so anyone can see it so your point is? 

What dealer have I spoke to?.... That would be none. 

Yall are on the defensive not me. Wonder why?


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## fishingman88 (Apr 23, 2008)

I'm finding it hard to believe that you found slop and roughness in the gears without any solid proof (i.e. pictures of poor quality control with badly machined parts). It sounds like you might have some sort of stake in Akios as you can't provide any objective proof of Omoto's "poor" quality. 

I have read many reviews online and the general consensus from what I have read is that the Omoto reels are highly recommended and just as smooth as Abu reels.

Here's just ONE of many posts online in other forums that give nothing but praise for Omoto reels:

http://www.catfish1.com/forums/showthread.php?175954-Omoto-6000CSM-Review

I will admit,I do not have one, but I would have no objection to recommending one to other people as many others have bought these reels and have had nothing but positive experiences with them.



jmadre said:


> Mike,
> 
> The cast control caps, handle, and end plates were different on the models I inspected. I didn't disassemble the reels and mic any parts, but the slop and roughness in the gears was present in the Omotos, not the Akios reels. As River pointed out, the pinion gear is different whether they intend to change it in the future or not.
> 
> ...


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## AbuMike (Sep 3, 2007)

Most of us have to pay for what we use. Do I fish these? No, I fish Abu, Daiwa and Avet. Since you felt the need to throw mis-information out there about what you think I'm doing. I will say to the legit dealers you better check your 6. 

1 person who is selling as a dealer with no store. 1 who gets what they need for free. A couple that gets their friends reels for free or at cost. Not very good for your LEGIT BUSINESS.....Just saying they are not hard to pick out of a crowd....


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