# Surf Cat



## HellRhaY (Jul 6, 2007)

if you are using mainly braid, would size 6 lowrider too small for the afaw 13' surf? 
20-16-12-10-8-6-6-8.

was wondering because bartyb has 20-16-12-10-10-8-8-8.


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## WALT D. (Dec 18, 2003)

HellRhaY,

I know your question was directed to Surf Cat but I couldn't help but answer. As far as your question IMO Barty B has the best scenario; but personally on a 13' rod I don't go smaller than 10mm to allow for leader connections. I would expect even with the smaller size of the braid the angler would still be using a 50lb or so mono leader, and I feel 8mm is a little small for that depending on the knot used. Also, I never go larger after smaller (8-6-6-8) with the guides and tip.

Sorry for offering unsolicited input.
Just my 2 cents,

Walt


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## HellRhaY (Jul 6, 2007)

no probs. WaltD.


i don't use shock leader. I use braid, my leader is only 1-2 ft long and it doesnt get inside the tip guide.


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## eric (Oct 24, 2007)

small guides arent necessarily good guides.

since they are LRs make them big enough for at least shock knots.

maybe use LRs for the first 3 guides. then the rest use lighter guides for faster tip recovery.


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## HellRhaY (Jul 6, 2007)

ooeric said:


> small guides arent necessarily good guides.
> 
> since they are LRs make them big enough for at least shock knots.
> 
> maybe use LRs for the first 3 guides. then the rest use lighter guides for faster tip recovery.


they are the lightest guides you'll ever find Eric. they are titaniums. T-LCSG.


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## basstardo (Jun 5, 2006)

HellRhaY said:


> they are the lightest guides you'll ever find Eric. they are titaniums. T-LCSG.


Not necessarily. A lot of folks, myself included, use the single foot fly guides for this application as well. The weight difference is probably so small though that you would never be able to tell the difference.


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## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

HellRhaY said:


> if you are using mainly braid, would size 6 lowrider too small for the afaw 13' surf?
> 20-16-12-10-8-6-6-8.
> 
> was wondering because bartyb has 20-16-12-10-10-8-8-8.


I think Barty is pretty much on the money, I wouldn't use anything smaller than the 8 and might stay with 10's as the samllest guide on a 13' rod.

I haven't built with lowriders, but even on the 11' footers I have built spinning, I use 10 as the smallest guide. I know the braid will go thru the 8 or even 6, guide ok, but there is such a small foot print to use that I would be skeptical of the guide holding up on a big fish. It just doesn't leave enough thread on the guide to fight a quality fish. Would make for an extremely light and responsive rod tho.

Also agree with walt, I might go up one size for the tip, but not for a guide before the tip.


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## Mark G (Nov 15, 2004)

HellRhaY said:


> if you are using mainly braid, would size 6 lowrider too small for the afaw 13' surf?
> 20-16-12-10-8-6-6-8.
> 
> was wondering because bartyb has 20-16-12-10-10-8-8-8.


I think Barty is pretty much on the money, I wouldn't use anything smaller than the 8 and might stay with 10's as the samllest guide on a 13' rod.

I haven't built with lowriders, but even on the 11' footers I have built spinning, I use 10 as the smallest guide. I know the braid will go thru the 8 or even 6, guide ok, but there is such a small foot print to use that I would be skeptical of the guide holding up on a big fish. It just doesn't leave enough thread on the guide to fight a quality fish. Would make for an extremely light and responsive rod tho.

Also agree with Walt, I might go up one size for the tip top, but not for a guide in front of the tip.


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## basstardo (Jun 5, 2006)

Surf Cat said:


> but there is such a small foot print to use that I would be skeptical of the guide holding up on a big fish


That is a good point, especially on a 13' blank. Didn't think of that. Especially true with the guides I mentioned.


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## eric (Oct 24, 2007)

so you gonna sell me a rod after its built ray?
lol. or try?

maybe ill think about it. lolol


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## HellRhaY (Jul 6, 2007)

the reason i asked this question between size 6 and 8 because, on the fuji catalogue with the guide placement FORMULA. You only use size 8 for tournament rods with 7 guides and if your rod is a bit stiff like the LDX, you are going to have 20-16-12-10-8-8-8. 

But when a rod is built for fishing especially with a soft tip like the AFAW, the guides changes to 8 guides with sizes 20-16-12-10-8-6-6-8. The number of guides inscreased by one so the guides can follow the curvature of the rod having more flex.

maybe my brother did a poor job of translating the darn book. But the engineers at fuji have done enough research on LC and i trust their findings on guide placements.

My concern, is when i sell the rod DOWN THE ROAD, that people who uses shock leader would be able to use the rod as well. I don't need to worry about shock leader- I DONT use shock leader. I use a 30# running line and i dont throw anything more than 4 ounces. So basically this rod will be built with the future in mind that i would be able to sell it and the person who buys it won't have any problem with it (especially that most people uses shock leader). 

And Eric, I'm not selling it in the forseeable future yet. I, m just covering my bases. You know me, I'm a tackle junkie, always wanting the next best thing, the search for a better gear never ends.


FOR all the people who responded, thank you so much for all the insights and info's. I"ll just need to tape both size 6 and 8 and see if a shock leader would pass without any hitch, AND see which one cast farther.


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## TreednNC (Jul 1, 2005)

HellRhay....theres just one more thing they forgot to mention.................. we need pics of the finished product!


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## toejam (Jan 28, 2005)

Hellray, If you want max performance out of your lowriders then it would pay you to look at some post Gowge Pope on that other board you post on. He wrote much on the subject, like how lowriders were developed to simulate the Dawia interline rods and reels. The second guide up from the striper guide should be the intersection line with rod and the axis line of the reel. The striper guide should then be placed so the reel's axis line passes thru the center of the striper guide, (that why it set so high)... the rest of guides above those guides should be placed according to the curveture of the rod. I would advise you take a look at these measurements and play around with guide placements by temporary taping them in place and then takeing the rod to the grass and testing the setup before wrapping the guides.... you may find that the fuji gerneric spacing guides may not be the best performance for a 13' AFAW

PS,,,,still waiting for the sand flea trap plans, hehehe,,,,,


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