# 10-5 refuge questions



## Sea2aeS (Jan 7, 2005)

anybody on here fish the refuge tonight meet a special few visitors out there that made ya leave after giving you a lil piece a yella paper??


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## Cdog (Mar 18, 2002)

Sea2aeS said:


> anybody on here fish the refuge tonight meet a special few visitors out there that made ya leave after giving you a lil piece a yella paper??


Sea2aeS, I was a guest of someone with a special permit. As you found out their is a new sherriff in town(His words) so I wouldn't be going out there without a permit. And no I dont know how to get the permit but I will be looking into it.


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## the rhondel (Feb 6, 2003)

I think a duck-stamp from the PO will get ya on a lot of places....the R


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## Cdog (Mar 18, 2002)

the rhondel said:


> I think a duck-stamp from the PO will get ya on a lot of places....the R


Not after dark.


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## fisherman (Feb 20, 2002)

I got one. Breakin' the law, Breakin' the law! Watchin the boys battle the bulls almost made it worth it. AWESOME! 

R


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## Anthony (Jul 3, 2002)

From what I have heard there are 7 people who have these special permits to fish after dark. All I can say is do not ask where you can get these permits. It took a long time to get these permits and this is the first time that someone was able to fish after dark on the refuge. If too many people start asking about this permit they may take it away or not allow them again next year.


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## fisherman (Feb 20, 2002)

Just called the office and a very nice lady said that the pass costs 35 bucks and I can pick one up anytime M - F, 9 to 3:30. However, the refuge will be closed for hunting until Thursday next week.


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## Gotta Go (Aug 4, 2006)

You need to ask where we can get the permits. The refuge is paid for by all, isn't it. At least the folks working there are government or state employees. What should be good for one should be good for all. If there is a special fee, which I believe there is, so be it.


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

Anthony said:


> From what I have heard there are 7 people who have these special permits to fish after dark. All I can say is do not ask where you can get these permits. It took a long time to get these permits and this is the first time that someone was able to fish after dark on the refuge. If too many people start asking about this permit they may take it away or not allow them again next year.


Ant...this is Federal Park......we the people put the bill up to run it...the Park services cannot and will not just give a few folks the special right to fish that place after dark.

Ther'es a lotta shady crap going on @ that refuge...from the "30 key holders" to the 7 special people.........


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

Nserch4Drum said:


> Ther'es a lotta shady crap going on @ that refuge...from the "30 key holders" to the 7 special people.........


Al, you know who has the permits. No hard feelings, ya know. Those guys worked hard and jumped through hoops to get a permit to fish after dark on the refuge for one month. 

And one month only. 

The group of guys who got the permit are part of a non-profit organization that was created for the sole purpose of keeping free access to the public beaches in the state - especially Hampton Roads.

I'm a board member of the group, and I'll be able to tell you more about what we're trying to accomplish in the upcoming months. We've got our non-profit status approved by the Commonwealth, but we're still trying to get the name officially adopted. We've got a lawyer helping us with the process, and our proposed name has gotten caught up in red tape.

Anyway, our group is working with Back Bay NWF in order to gain a two-week period for night fishing for everyone in the future. We are ready to submit a formal proposal that would allow everyone the right to fish Back Bay at night during the last week of September through the first week of October. 

We are presenting refuge administrators with some ideas that include a possible small fee, a beach cleanup day and other incentives to get our proposal passed.

I would like to caution everyone about protesting the monthly permit some of the guys landed. The more protests, the harder it will be for us to get the night fishing proposal passed.

By the way, I'm not on the list of those who have the permit. However, I'm doing all I can to help get a small window of night drum fishing for everyone in the coming years.

Stay tuned for more info, OK. 

On a side note, one thing everyone can do is sign the petition against the proposed Indigo Dunes project on the banks of the Lynnhaven Inlet. Our group has already begun working to ensure any commerical develpment in the area will include free and resonable access to the public. 

http://www.noindigodunes.com/


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## Sea2aeS (Jan 7, 2005)

Permit or no permit. Everybody deserves to fish down there. Im not gonna sit around idle and be quiet just so a select few people can fish.... Nonprofit organization or not, I should be able to fish there just as much as them. 

No offense to them, they did their homework. Woulda been nice had they said " hey i dunno if you knew, but if you dont have a permit you might get in trouble being down here after dark if the man catches ya". It aint them guys responsibility, but still. I want a permit and im going to apply for one. If the people that be are soo concerned about the beach and fishing down there then this only shows them that enough people wanna fish down there so we should do something about it. 

The so called "New sheriff in town" was a rather nice gentleman too. He was calm, polite, and informed me of my violation. He wasnt a prick like the one officer who patrols lynnhaven in the summer. Im sure some of you know who im referring to and the problems he caused with many boaters last summer. 

Anthony.... it seems to me like your too concerned with many people fishing down there with the comments of


> All I can say is do not ask where you can get these permits. It took a long time to get these permits and this is the first time that someone was able to fish after dark on the refuge. If too many people start asking about this permit they may take it away or not allow them again next year.


  when all it takes is going in the office to get one.  The officer last night even told me so. Nice try


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

Newsjeff said:


> Al, you know who has the permits. No hard feelings, ya know. Those guys worked hard and jumped through hoops to get a permit to fish after dark on the refuge for one month.
> 
> And one month only.
> 
> ...



Ohh...its like that ....Your doin me a favor...sacraficing yourselves instead of the group as a whole... 



> Those guys worked hard and jumped through hoops to get a permit to fish after dark on the refuge for one month.


NJ- this is a Federal Reserve...we the people, pay taxes to keep that place open. Guess working to get through hoops, pay a little kick back money, is as hard as the guys that have put the time on that beach.


Send the grunts in to do the dirty werk, like scope the beach for the holes....relay the information...and then let the "special few" fish?..while everyone else gets booted or ticketed.



> I would like to caution everyone about protesting the monthly permit some of the guys landed. The more protests, the harder it will be for us to get the night fishing proposal passed.


Why?..shouldn't everyone be angry or jealous that they can't fish the Refuge at night without the fear getting a ticket or their car /truck towed. Why can't the Refuge be operated like Pea Island....because of the 30 key holders...the Park is worried that people may get run over or hit by the automobiles. The complaints on the beach are usually from beach drivers driving at night.



> The more protests, the harder it will be for us to get the night fishing proposal passed.


-in other words..the select few will keep fishing when they want to, while we wonder when we can get a shot at the PRIVELEDGE.


Been fishing the Refuge for a few years...love that place...even tipped a few fellas on some holes...but now its like that?...

That group sounds great, and sounds like they're doin' alot...great...but when they are singled -out from others...and permitted to do what others can't...on land that is being supported via tax payers money...well...There's something shady going on in the Refuge.

BTW...I got a hook up....I know a guy that will sell his permit to drive through the Refuge...you interested?  


When did surf fishing become a crime or involve a buncha shady dealings?



> No hard feelings


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

Al, you were invited - just like me - to fish with the guys who got the permit. 

Look, I'm not trying to start a fight here. The refuge has rules, like them or not. The days I fished Back Bay by myself I left at sunset. Did I like it? Hell no. But those are the rules.

The nonprofit went through the proper channels to get a special use permit. I don't know anything about kickbacks. I'm positive they did nothing illegal, if that's what you're implying.  

Now that the group has its foot in the door, the members are working to get free access for everyone. At least for a couple of weeks during the drum run. 

I strongly believe that working to get a couple of weeks of night fishing for everyone will be easier than several groups petitioning to get one-month special use permit. That's just my humble opinion, and you guys are free to do whatever you think is best. 

No one likes to be left out. But now that the group has its foot in the door, maybe everyone should see if they can help the rest of us out in the future. All I'm asking is that you give them a chance to get the proposal approved before everyone starts making a fuss.

From what I understand, it's not easy to get a special use permit. I think we all have a better chance to get some night fishing in the future if we let the nonprofit work for all of us.


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

Per the head cheese @ the Refeuge the only reason that the park closes at night is due to the traffic on the sand -

Why now?..........


Since the words out regarding the special nite permit...gonna get mine on Thursday...wonder if I should bring my lawyer or my heavers?


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## CrawFish (Sep 23, 2003)

Nserch4Drum said:


> Since the words out regarding the special nite permit...gonna get mine on Thursday...wonder if I should bring my lawyer or my heavers?


Bring another Asian, then we'll get it done.


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## Sea2aeS (Jan 7, 2005)

yea, imma get mine too.... lets get the refuge crowded as heck... 

before you know it, the whole LIP crowd will be there to fish too since the snag wont let anyone without making a donation....


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

> Look, I'm not trying to start a fight here. The refuge has rules, like them or not. The days I fished Back Bay by myself I left at sunset. Did I like it? Hell no. But those are the rules.


Thanks NJ.......Ive been yelled at and called a hypocrite on the phone.

I hope you send these facts to the appropiate folks.

Have I broken the law in the Refuge?...yes..this past Sunday night ..helped a buddy get a paper drum while we tried to get a noob one also.....would we have gotten a ticket or reprimand?...yes...if the "man" rolled up.

Have I fished with the now known group of special permit holders...yes...on Saturday morning @ 5am ... was it an invite deal? Do you need a special permit to fish in the AM?- NO...fished with part of that group with SF, you , Ant and Ken....

Did I know anything about a special permit to fish at nite? NO..I did receive a call from a friend in that group, while I was at Wal-Mart shopping with teh family...the signal was not very strong...but I did hear something about a permit. 

Was I asked to fish with a person in that special permit group...yes..last night..did I go-NO.Did I know that the person held a special permit?Nope...did I care...nope...did I ask..nope. If I was single and without kids...I woulda been down there in a heartbeat-fine or no fine.

Now...knowing what I know now and the consequences..woulda I posted the previous rant regarding access on the Refuge? Yes.

So I hope this clears things up...never assume you know all the details. Never assume that you know what he said or she said. Never assume you got all the details.

Those that are planning to fish the Refuge at night - please take the steps to get a permit.
The group that NJ has spoken about is doing some things that maybe someday help eliminate the shrinking waters where we fish.


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

> Did I know anything about a special permit to fish at nite? NO..I did receive a call from a friend in that group, while I was at Wal-Mart shopping with teh family...the signal was not very strong...but I did hear something about a permit.


Al, it's all good. I didn't know about the special use permit right away, either. I heard about it around the same time you did. I kept wondering why the guys were showing up at the refuge at sunset when I was leaving.  I thought it was because Dean was off patrol duty and no one was monitoring the beach.  I thought they were taking a chance, I did. 

All I can figure is they kept tight lipped about the permit to avoid what's happening right here. I can't say as I blame them.

By the way, Al, I've only fished the refuge with the guys one night. 

Having said that, let me get onto the more important issue. The group now has its foot in the door. I'm hoping they can convince refuge officials to let everyone have night access for a couple of weeks each year. 

Chit, I would love to fish Back Bay at night during the drum run. I'm just asking for everyone to see the big picture. 

I honestly believe that we've got a better chance of getting everyone access if you let the group give it a shot first. Individuals going to refuge officials for permits is going to hamper their efforts, IHMO.

Also, I don't think anyone is going to have much luck getting a special use permit on their own. Sure, you guys can try. But from what I understand, it's all but impossible. 

Can I ask everyone to give them until next year to get us access? If they can't, then I'll be in line with the rest trying to get my own special use permit.

And I might even bring an Asian with me.


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## Caught Myself (Sep 14, 2004)

Anthony said:


> If too many people start asking about this permit they may take it away or not allow them again next year.


I certainly hope so. It's all or none, bud. To heck with the special permits. Where's that puking smiley?


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## Caught Myself (Sep 14, 2004)

Newsjeff said:


> Individuals going to refuge officials for permits is going to hamper their efforts, IHMO.


Good. Every now and then you'll see a thread on this board about the "special" people with permits to drive on that beach. Jerks! Now we have "special" people who have permits to fish there at night. What is it - a freaking country club? I've fished there for 2 years now, year round, usually by myself, hardly anyone in sight. Now that the drum are running, everybody and his brother shows up.


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## Newsjeff (Jul 22, 2004)

Caught Myself said:


> I've fished there for 2 years now, year round, usually by myself, hardly anyone in sight. Now that the drum are running, everybody and his brother shows up.


Two years, huh? I guess you're getting used to the annual drum crowd.


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## Caught Myself (Sep 14, 2004)

No, Jeff. When the crowd shows up, I go south. Plenty of beach to fish.


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## Shooter (Nov 14, 2004)

OK folks I know this is a hot topic and easy to get mad about but untill someone or a group of someones gets turned down for a special night permit lets not get to mad. 
I haven't personally fished back there yet and with this bum knee don't know if I ever will be able to but things aren't always fair. Sometimes groups get permits where a single person can't, go tell the city you want to shut down a city block to have a single person parade. From what I understand the reason they don't want people on the beach at night is so the card holders that are allowed to drive on the beach doesn't run you over and I am guessing that a group of folks would be easier to spot and be safer.
I am sure that the office will be flooded with calls when they open Monday with everyone trying to get a Special use permit.

So before blowing up if your going to call and check please be polite you stand a better chance.


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## Fishing_Feud (Nov 16, 2004)

Caught Myself said:


> Good. Every now and then you'll see a thread on this board about the "special" people with permits to drive on that beach. Jerks! Now we have "special" people who have permits to fish there at night. What is it - a freaking country club? I've fished there for 2 years now, year round, usually by myself, hardly anyone in sight. Now that the drum are running, everybody and his brother shows up.


 i agree with the priority permits being Bs but can u imagine how many HS kids would be ther with barn fires and beer cans or even better KEGS! i would even probaly go ther to party and im no young buck no mo but it would be a good time  

PAY a fee at the gate?????? simple solution,..........


OH and you have only 400 and some posts so ........... no one cares what you say YET

even if its right  

except ME 

take it light guys


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## Cdog (Mar 18, 2002)

Fishing_Feud said:


> PAY a fee at the gate?????? simple solution,..........


You already gotta do that.


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## Fishing_Feud (Nov 16, 2004)

Cdog said:


> You already gotta do that.


AFTER DARK?

get my point?


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## Cdog (Mar 18, 2002)

Fishing_Feud said:


> AFTER DARK?
> 
> get my point?


Oh DUH, sorry been a long day...


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## Fishing_Feud (Nov 16, 2004)

Newsjeff said:


> On a side note, one thing everyone can do is sign the petition against the proposed Indigo Dunes project on the banks of the Lynnhaven Inlet. Our group has already begun working to ensure any commerical develpment in the area will include free and resonable access to the public.
> 
> http://www.noindigodunes.com/


NJ 

U need to get some pics of the area in its natural state TOday on that website!!!!!!

Most people that look at the petition will have no idea what they are lkooking at or where!

Remeber the old live oaks and potholes at the boat ramp side?

Natural beautiful and free! the good ole days

And BUBBAS was happy too gettin thoe launches


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## skiffisher (Apr 10, 2005)

Just stating a fact here but the people with those permits to drive on the beach there dont get to stop and fish wherever they want. That is considered a road for them to get back and fourth to carolina. If they stop and set up shop they to can get in trouble. My buddy has that key and never uses it for that reason
Just some general knowledge
MATT


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## Fishing_Feud (Nov 16, 2004)

fisherman said:


> I got one. Breakin' the law, Breakin' the law! Watchin the boys battle the bulls almost made it worth it. AWESOME!
> 
> R



ALMOST?


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## Fishing_Feud (Nov 16, 2004)

These dam mesage boards confuse me my responses are in *BOLD*


Nserch4Drum said:


> Thanks NJ.......Ive been yelled at and called a hypocrite on the phone.
> *ME too but i agree with you al the permit shiit is BS*
> I hope you send these facts to the appropiate folks.
> 
> ...


*Good for that group !!! BUT Al you know u gotta pay fer the candy lol*


had to throw that in

remeber i said i agreed with you 

on the other note the REDS arent just at the REFUGE! But its natural


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## AL_N_VB (Apr 3, 2002)

Fishing_Feud said:


> These dam mesage boards confuse me my responses are in *BOLD*
> 
> *Good for that group !!! BUT Al you know u gotta pay fer the candy lol*
> 
> ...



LOL--FF... .....Pay to play..its not who you know but who you  .......whatch yo mouth Shooter  !!!!!!!!!.

Heard they slammin' them N of the CCBT.

FF----let me know when you want that beer....got a good chuckle from your post....Meetca @ the Refuge next week @ 9pm?


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## Fishman (Apr 23, 2000)

We need to know more about this gruop or do we already know them.


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## Digger (Jan 4, 2000)

You know them.


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